I want to keep her around a little too badly

[flowboy]

@Serotoninluv Yes! You get it. This describes my last long-term relationship. Great moments of flow and understanding, but also being anxious and insecure around her and addicted to her approval.

My hope is that it will help to just meet more people so I have more trust that there will always be another good potential connection..

Man this thread dug a lot deeper than I expected

[Forestluv]

@flowboy I was in a similar dynamic with my last relationship. Then I spent six months caring for myself. Introspection, learning to self love, starting new hobbies, cooking healthy meals for myself, learning self massage, yoga etc. It helped a lot - for both awakenings and personal development. 

One of my personality patterns is trying to please others. I would do lots of loving things to please a partner, that I would never do for myself.

[Shin]

On ‎25‎/‎02‎/‎2019 at 3:49 PM, flowboy said:

I did NOT want to hear this but it turns out that you're right.

It triggered a lot of "this is not fair - why can't I just authentically show interest without girls losing attraction" feelings.

As long as you want the relationship more than she does, it's only a matter of time.

[Elia]

2 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

@flowboy I was in a similar dynamic with my last relationship. Then I spent six months caring for myself. Introspection, learning to self love, starting new hobbies, cooking healthy meals for myself, learning self massage, yoga etc. It helped a lot - for both awakenings and personal development. 

One of my personality patterns is trying to please others. I would do lots of loving things to please a partner, that I would never do for myself.

im the same......Always trying to please so much....

 

its so annoying, and such a difficult program to get out of

[Shadowraix]

Before you do things, ask yourself: Does this bring me closer to the goal I am striving for with this person?

Now how many of your actions can you say you would answer yes with this?

[Forestluv]

1 hour ago, Shadowraix said:

Before you do things, ask yourself: Does this bring me closer to the goal I am striving for with this person?

Now how many of your actions can you say you would answer yes with this?

For my personality, that’s not a good question. My mindset would become oriented toward outcomes and I would likely start trying to steer things toward an intended outcome. I would start trying to define the relationship and evaluate where we are and if we are making progress. That might be a good orientation for other couples though.

[Emerald]

On 2/22/2019 at 2:08 PM, Serotoninluv said:

@flowboy I've gone through this mind-body dynamic and know how intense it is. The mind-body will try to behave in a way it thinks will keep the relationship going (e.g. "I better not text her again because I may look desperate"). Ime, this is not the healthiest way to go. The underlying mind-body dynamic that needs to get addressed is the sense of being incomplete and insecure. When the mind-body is with the gal, there is temporary relief from insecurity/anxiety and a temporary sense of being complete. Yet, the incomplete/insecure dynamic will return and continue on, until the underlying issue is addressed.

This is just my opinion based on my experience. . . To me, this looks like a counter-intuitive situation. As hard as it is to do, I would sit and get grounded with the sense of insecurity and attachment. I would try to get enough detachment that I could discuss the dynamic with her without any attachment. This is a very high level of emotional maturity. . . Sometime when you are with her, the conversation might go something like this "I was doing some introspective work and noticed a mixture of attraction and fear arising. I thought 'how interesting'. So, I observed this energy to get to the root of it's source. After some contemplation it seems like. . . "  Being genuine and grounded with fearless vulnerability is a sign of a mature confident man. Yet, it can't be said in a clutchy "don't leave me" desperate way. Also, it can't be said with too much intensity. Don't make it some huge deal and bring in stuff about childhood, past failed relationships, therapy that didn't work etc. You've got to say it from a detached, curious, genuine, grounded position. As if you were talking about a friend you care about. People pick up on neediness and clutchiness and it is unattractive. As well, the timing is important.

I would only do this if you want a meaningful relationship based on mutual support with who you really are. If you want a sexual fling, I would not go this route and I would work on role playing development (you would essentially be playing an actor with her that is not the true you). If you go the meaningful relationship route, it's not easy. It took me years to get grounded enough to have these types of conversations. You've got to be ok with either reaction from her. She may say "You are a beta male. I'm looking for more of an alpha male. Sorry. See ya". Yet, that is good to know if you want a meaningful relationship, you can move on. Or she may say something on the same wavelength like "hmmm, I've experienced that too in life. I've never really thought about it like that. I've been doing some self-love practices lately that have helped". It won't be this exact phrase, yet something that creates a connection, support and continues a mutual exploration. If so, you are GOLDEN. You can now discuss this dynamic with her without fear and anxiety and it's something the two of you could work through.

If this dynamic has been a pattern in the mind-body, it will continue to arise. Trying to repress it or hide it in the relationship doesn't work. It will get expressed one way or another. 

I've been in every combination of this dynamic. I dated a gal I was really really into and had this conversation and she dropped me because I wasn't "manly" enough in a traditional sense (good riddance to her). Another woman I was into became super attracted by this level of emotional awareness and with the strength of fearless vulnerability. We began to get to know each other below the surface - it's so much deeper.

Wonderful advice.

[SgtPepper]

On 2/25/2019 at 9:49 AM, flowboy said:

It triggered a lot of "this is not fair - why can't I just authentically show interest without girls losing attraction" feelings.

Honestly, I would say that you still can, it's just how you do it. 

For example,

I don't see anything wrong with saying "Hey I really like you, want to go out and do x,y,z?" or "I really appreciate that I can talk to you about sensitive topics, makes me feel like you are open minded, thanks, you are truly special " Additionally, if she keeps rejecting or ignoring, you can also authentically say "Hey I get the sense, that you are intentionally not responding to me. That's fine, I still appreciated our time together, if I see you around, I'll wave." then stop and move on!

Ideally you want a situation where both partners need each other equally and then perhaps over the years it wavers back and forth, with one partner needing the other more due to emotional distress (this happens with my relationship).

It's definitely hard to let go if you're not used to being alone, but if you feel lonely, go out and be around people, strike small conversations with stranger (both men and women) and let those little moments delight your need for socializations.

edit:

I also agree with @Serotoninluv here! There are different girls that are attracted to different qualities in guys and vice versa!

It is imperative to develop balance and understanding of masculine and feminine energies too.

I seriously recommend this book, definitely one of the best books I've ever read.

https://www.amazon.com/Way-Superior-Man-Spiritual-Challenges-ebook/dp/B004A8ZWM4/ref=tmm_kin_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=

 

Edited February 28, 2019 by SgtPepper

[Shadowraix]

15 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

For my personality, that’s not a good question. My mindset would become oriented toward outcomes and I would likely start trying to steer things toward an intended outcome. I would start trying to define the relationship and evaluate where we are and if we are making progress. That might be a good orientation for other couples though.

I would say only consider it with major proposals or advancements. Something risky. A lot of people make risky moves they regret when they already knew it wouldn't work in their favor.

[Forestluv]

10 hours ago, Shadowraix said:

I would say only consider it with major proposals or advancements. Something risky. A lot of people make risky moves they regret when they already knew it wouldn't work in their favor.

Well yea, for major things like marraige, buying a home, having a child etc. That’s a whole nother level.

[catharticcreation]

I'd say you're overthinking...When I'm into someone it doesn't matter how hard they pursue me/text me/or talk to me(unless its at stalker-level). You can't MAKE someone be into you through the perfect strategy, and the acceptance of it just not being meant to be is important if that is the case. Also, PUA is a huge turn off for a lot of women. I think a lot of guys who are into PUA reek of desperation that most women can pick up from a mile away. 

 

Go with the flow, yo.(easier said than done, i know.)

[flowboy]

8 hours ago, catharticcreation said:

PUA is a huge turn off for a lot of women. I think a lot of guys who are into PUA reek of desperation that most women can pick up from a mile away

That's not because of the pickup. They get into it because of the desperation, and to improve and grow out of that. Why would you shame them?

[flowboy]

But you are right that I was overthinking. I left her alone for a week, then we started casually talking again and actually we'll meet this Saturday. Only thing is, she wants to be exclusive and I can't do that

[flowboy]

On 2/28/2019 at 6:14 AM, SgtPepper said:

It is imperative to develop balance and understanding of masculine and feminine energies too.

I seriously recommend this book, definitely one of the best books I've ever read.

https://www.amazon.com/Way-Superior-Man-Spiritual-Challenges-ebook/dp/B004A8ZWM4/ref=tmm_kin_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=

 

Read it it's one of my favourite teachings

[Shin]

A lot of things make suddenly a lot of sense when you read this book ?

[flowboy]

Yeah, it's helping me in subtle ways every day

[flowboy]

Just thought I'd give an update, in case the people who so generously advised me are curious. What I did was stop texting her, and kind of assume it was over. I used that time to chat and set dates with other girls, which made me way less needy.

After a full week she texted me again, and we had a nice exchange for another week, after which I suggested meeting again. She asked me what my expectations were, considering we had found out that she wants a traditional relationship and be exclusive, and I don't. I said let's not have expectations, just have dinner. She suggested coming over to talk.

We met and had a LOT of fun comparing music tastes and singing along with songs, and comparing what we consider horny sex music (I was making a playlist). Just amazing chemistry overall. Talking to this girl feels goood.

Then the talking part. Turns out that me sharing that I like her and feel vulnerable had not turned her off, but confused her and she simply needed a lot of time to process that. She has only had one previous relationship, so kind of inexperienced. And she has some values that conflict with "just having fun".

So we didn't resolve the whole I'm-not-what-shes-looking-for issue but we did make out, because at a certain point that just felt right.

She said sternly: "I'm NOT going to sleep with you tonight!"

And thanks to my decrease in neediness, I could say: "Toootally fine with me!" and MEAN it. And I meant it. I didn't expect sex but I had another date the next day, so I was just enjoying being with her.

I did offer her a massage with coconut oil and tea tree oil. She loved that scent. I liked doing it.

After that, I expected her to pack her stuff and leave, but she surprised me by asking me what specific things make me horny. And making me guess where the spot on her neck was that I could kiss to turn her on. This is where I felt that she changed her mind, and wanted me to turn her on and fuck her.

Amazing night.

Now, she's back to being unavailable (in time, she does respond to texts very well), and "processing"

[flowboy]

I'm confused as to whether I'm being a jerk to her by even meeting up, knowing that she's looking for a relationship.

My personal opinion is that she's not over her ex and is better off "just having fun" for a while anyway. I told her this. She doesn't agree.

And I like her a lot.

[Hello from Russia]

14 minutes ago, flowboy said:

I'm confused as to whether I'm being a jerk to her by even meeting up, knowing that she's looking for a relationship.

My personal opinion is that she's not over her ex and is better off "just having fun" for a while anyway. I told her this. She doesn't agree.

And I like her a lot.

Did you end up having sex with her?

[flowboy]

@Hello from Russia Yes.

Edited March 25, 2019 by flowboy