I don’t think people suffer because of purposless lives

[Conceptually-made]

I’ve been studying Maslows pyramid of needs and maslow presented the first four needs as the deficit needs which means when these needs aren’t satisfied you will experience discomfort and will work hard to satisfy them. Now the first four needs are: physiological (food ,water...), safety (do you feel safe), love and belongingness (do you have close relationships in family and outside), self-esteem( do you feel accepted by society, do you feel up to the challanges life presents to you and the challange life as a whole is). 

So maslow claims these are the ones you experience discomfort from. And the other such as cognitive, aesthetic, self actualization and self transcendance needs are different because our attitude toward gratifying them isn’t like you need to gratify them and you will be good but you enjoy gratifying them. 

So now i am thinking about the problem many people have which is that they don’t have a purpose in their life. Purpose is in my opinion very similar if not the same as self-actualization. But how are people then experiencing discomfort and insecurity about life when they don’t have purpose if self-actualization need doesn’t produce these kind of responses according to  Maslow. What i think is actually happening with people that are depressed because they don’t have a purpose in their life is that their self-esteem need isn’t trully gratified. As i said earlier self-esteem is how you feel about challanges of life. Do you feel that life is something you can or can’t handle and are you afraid of the future. If you are afraid this has nothing to do with your lack of purpose but it is acually a self-esteem issue.

[Aquarius]

Sounds intriguing. What would the deficit of love look like from your perspective? 

[Nahm]

@Conceptually-made Satisfaction is relative.  It matters as it matters to you.  

[Conceptually-made]

@Aquarius i really don’t know much about this since there are different kinds of love you get. Lacking love from your parents will definitely influence you negatively but also not having any close relationships such as true friends or a significant other has its effects. I think when you are deficient in a thing like love you will feel exactly like that “deficient of love” your biggest wish and desire will be to find someone you could get close with and open up to. And if you are lacking love through longer periods of time especially when young it can have major impact on the development of your self-esteem 

[Conceptually-made]

@Nahm sure but to get to a state like that you need a lot of work and you need to be a healthy human being and needs such as those above are very important to develop into a healthy human being who can then evolve to a state of nondual consciousness.

I love how Abraham Maslow put it. He said that that being deficient in your basic needs is just like being deficient of certain minerals or vitamins. You are not at your top performance.

Edited February 9, 2019 by Conceptually-made

[Leo Gura]

From what I have seen there are two types of people: ambitious people and unambitious ones. Ambitious people crave a life purpose to work on. Unambitious people are happy working at the Post Office licking stamps. Unambitious people seem to have no vision or concern for their impact on the world.

It would make sense that such is the case since society needs a lot of stamp lickers and factory workers.

But I think it is also the case that a lot of folks would be more ambitious and visionary if they were shown how and given more opportunity. The degree of income inequality and our medival education system destroy a lot of potentially ambitous people from flourishing.

[Seed]

@Leo Gura What about imaginative people? 

[Leo Gura]

@Seed I consider those ambitious people. I guess you could also have that as a third class, since some folks are ambitious but not so imaginative, like the Wallstreet banker types.

Obviously there are many ways to classify people. I was speaking of one distinction I have spotted over the years of dealing with people. I have run across people with very little ambition and they don't seem to care.

[Seed]

Ok. But sometimes people just imagine all day long. And get lots of joy out of it. But don't do anything. Cause they are so satisfied by their imagination?

 

 

[Leo Gura]

@Seed There probably are such people.

They would lean more artistic I would think.

I am both very imaginative and ambitious. Which is a terrible combo for meditation. The best meditators are the stamp lickers, lol.

[Seed]

@Leo Gura I am massively imaginative. 

And I am also ambitious.

But I am also content. Because of my imagination.

And sometimes. I wonder - is it slowing me down?

Just a thought. 

[Leo Gura]

@Seed But you are also in hell, because of your imagination

 

[LastThursday]

Are ambitious people deficient in something? They strive, because they are lacking in whatever it is they have ambitions about? For example, if I'm hungry doesn't that make me ambitious about finding food? Or is it something else? Are stamp lickers fulfilled?

[Aaron p]

17 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

From what I have seen there are two types of people: ambitious people and unambitious ones. Ambitious people crave a life purpose to work on. Unambitious people are happy working at the Post Office licking stamps. Unambitious people seem to have no vision or concern for their impact on the world.

It would make sense that such is the case since society needs a lot of stamp lickers and factory workers.

But I think it is also the case that a lot of would be more ambitious and visionary if they were shown how and given more opportunity. The degree of income inequality and our medival education system destroy a lot of potentially ambitous people from flourishing.

Jesus ising that true. I was quite unaware of how silly education is and how it's based upon memorisation not creativity...like, at all. @Leo Gura

[Seed]

@Leo Gura Like I feel the two often at war against eachother.

I have both sides raring to go!!! 

But one is gentle, and creative and mesmerising -  and the other is a resourceful, brave and analytical. 

Which leaves me paralysed, as I am conflicted in which aspect to lose myself in. 

And yes, my imagination does bring me hell, but an equal measure of ecstasy . If I were to lose it, I don't think I would achieve much, or have much fun. 

[Seed]

13 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Seed There probably are such people.

They would lean more artistic I would think.

I am both very imaginative and ambitious. Which is a terrible combo for meditation. The best meditators are the stamp lickers, lol.

Yes, This is exactly me. Nightmare! It fabricates enlightenment experiences for me all the bloody time... or just uses it as a time to plan / conceptualize / day dream.. 

[Leo Gura]

15 minutes ago, LastThursday said:

Are ambitious people deficient in something? They strive, because they are lacking in whatever it is they have ambitions about?

I don't think of it that way.

It doesn't feel like a negative need. It feels more like a postive need to express oneself. Like life bursting forth with creative enthusiasm.

There is this passion for creating stuff just for the sake of creation.

I have found that some people just aren't into creativity. It has always baffled me because my entire life is dominated by creativity. Like 24/7 creativity mode.

[Seed]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

I don't think of it that way.

It doesn't feel like a negative need. It feels more like a postive need to express oneself. Like life bursting forth with creative enthusiasm.

There is this passion for creating stuff just for the sake of creation.

I feel like I don't understand anyone else, who isnt this way.

I keep meeting people like this, groups even. And I feel like an alien amongst them.

[Conceptually-made]

@Leo Gura

19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Ambitious people crave a life purpose to work on.

 

Yeah sure but it does depend on in what way you are using the word crave. The thing i was pointing out above is the difference betwen the cravings of the basic needs and the higher ones. So the word crave would in my opinion suit better the basic needs.

I wouldn’t say healthy people (even if they are ambitious) crave life purpose work but i’d say they are driven towards it since they are inspired and they enjoy it. Basically the goal of doing the work is not finishing it. But i would say unhealthy people may crave life purpose because of a bad self-esteem because they think life purpose is what is missing and is making them insecure about life. So they may crave a life purpose but not because they would enjoy in doing it but because they want it done since they would feel better about themselfves if they had something like that.

[Leo Gura]

Creativity seems like a drive, like sex, but it is never satisfied.

Maslow puts creativity as a self-actualization drive at the top of the pyramid. Although for very creative people creativity can be as fundamental as food.

Creative people tend to be more insane. But sanity is overrated