What If You Could Change The Schooling System

[Damien]

Hi everyone, 

I am a college student in Switzerland.

A professor asked my class  the classic question of: "What if you could change something in the way you were educated...?". Most people where suggesting things along the line of: more IT classes, more foreign languages, more choices for the children,...

It got me thinking. I realized that I needed more background information for a deeper understanding of the topic.

First: What is the purpose of school? 

 

 I think that the current purpose of school is transferring knowledge and preparing kids to become citizen participating in the democratic process. (There is probably a bit of a Swiss bias in this understanding:)

My proposed purpose of school is the following:transferring knowledge and preparing kids to become better humans (citizen participating in the democratic process).

Second, Why is schooling done in the way it is? What are the reasons for the current "design " of the educational system?

Option 1 : “I want a nation of workers, not thinkers.” – John D. Rockefeller

Option 2: Education interventions promise a wide range of potential benefits: increased economic growth ; higher rates of societal production; quicker adoption of technological change; development of government and business leaders; improved health; empowering women; and the intrinsic value of education(1).

Option 3: Education is the way it is because it is the optimal way for the average person to get the most knowledge and understanding when spending 1000 hours a year doing something.

The reality is likely to lie somewhere in between the three above-mentioned options. Maybe one, maybe the other, maybe all of them.

 

Which gets us back to what could be done to improve education. This topic seems critical since from the age of zero to 18 most of what you are exposed to is school and what your parents let you do. Let's keep the parents out of the equation.

 

So if we assume for a moment that schooling's mission is transferring knowledge and preparing kids to become better humans.

 

What are the key competencies needed to be the best human you could be? (in no particular order)

-Developing awareness

-Grounding yourself in reality: life purpose, top values...

-Understanding emotions

-Meditation: (discussing the need for spirituality for any human beings, put it in contrast with religion)

-Introduction to psychological evolution: (Clare Graves model)

sexuality, relationships, dietetic...

 

Why do I propose addressing these topics in school? 

-Life is a bit like using Excel.

You don't need to know exactly how to use every option but you have to be aware of their existence. So that when you need them you can figure it out.

-Not everyone has the particular mix of character traits to be curious 

-The people having access to these concepts are in possession of a more practical toolkit to navigate life

 

To conclude this mental masturbation. I would like to ask you what the beautiful and wise people of this forum: what could be improved in the schooling system in order to make it as useful as possible? 

 

 

PS, this post is not about religion, teachers getting paid more, classes being too big , Montessori nor the fact that the world "god" is a part of the pledge of allegiance 

 

Thanks for your time 

Source 1: https://www.givingwhatwecan.org/research/other-causes/education/

[vizual]

The whole philosophy of education needs to change. At the moment, school is pure brainwashing. They hand kids all kinds of information and command these kids that that information is the truth and nothing but the truth. This creates a very unhealthy society where the whole world view of people is severely compromised.

The focus of education needs to be on what knowledge is, who I am, who you are. How I relate to this world, and what my role to play is in everything. School needs to be about exploration, both inner and outer. So when you then are released into the 'real' world you have a sense of what the fuck actually is going on. When I finished high school I had loads of useless stuff floating inside my head, but I had no clue whatsoever what really is going on in the world. It's hard to fault them because even the teachers and the people in charge of education also probably have no clue about the world as well.

This is also a bit the joke of society. The people who are in charge have no clue what it's all about, and the people who have a sense about things don't want anything to do with the current establishment. Even if a sane person came along to change stuff the majority of people would probably revolt against it if they are not ready. 

Like Bill Hicks said, we always kill the good guys and let the demons run amok. The message that good guys bring to this world are often too painful for people to face, because this means that we have to face that we have lived as a demon all our lives without even seeing it.

[Toby]

It's a very complex issue. There are already different approaches in different countries and also non-mainstream approaches. They have all weaknesses and strengths. The main thing is imo to not deaden the childrens creativity and curiosity, because by default they love life and learning.

I don't think it's easy to come up with a "system" that fits everyone. I guess one of the next step of mainstream education that is affordable is to use things like "Khan Academy" and then transition to what kids want to learn and not what they have to learn - at their own speed. But even with that the question then is how to keep a group of classmates together, because for young kids this is also very important developmentally.

Regarding meditation: there are already schools that use mindfulness-courses, even mainstream-schools afaik. But even there it's possible that for some it is not the right time and it would be better to do some sport or learn an Instrument or do something creative - if they prefer that.

[Toby]

If your language is german, you can check out the documentary "Alphabet" which deals with it. (I haven't seen it but heard it is a good film)

[Henri]

Education has five aspects

Information — Often we think information is education, but it is only one aspect of education.

Concepts — Concepts are the basis for all research. You need to conceive in order to create.

Attitude — An integral aspect of education is cultivating the right attitude. Proper attitude at the right time and place determines your actions and behavior.

Imagination — Imagination is essential for creativity, for the arts. But if you get stuck in imagination, you may become psychotic.

Freedom — Freedom is your very nature. Only with freedom, do joy, generosity and other human values blossom. Without freedom, attitudes become stifling, concepts become a burden, information is of no value and imagination becomes stagnant.

[charlie2dogs]

9 hours ago, Damien said:

Hi everyone, 

I am a college student in Switzerland.

A professor asked my class  the classic question of: "What if you could change something in the way you were educated...?". Most people where suggesting things along the line of: more IT classes, more foreign languages, more choices for the children,...

It got me thinking. I realized that I needed more background information for a deeper understanding of the topic.

First: What is the purpose of school? 

 

 I think that the current purpose of school is transferring knowledge and preparing kids to become citizen participating in the democratic process. (There is probably a bit of a Swiss bias in this understanding:)

My proposed purpose of school is the following:transferring knowledge and preparing kids to become better humans (citizen participating in the democratic process).

Second, Why is schooling done in the way it is? What are the reasons for the current "design " of the educational system?

Option 1 : “I want a nation of workers, not thinkers.” – John D. Rockefeller

Option 2: Education interventions promise a wide range of potential benefits: increased economic growth ; higher rates of societal production; quicker adoption of technological change; development of government and business leaders; improved health; empowering women; and the intrinsic value of education(1).

Option 3: Education is the way it is because it is the optimal way for the average person to get the most knowledge and understanding when spending 1000 hours a year doing something.

The reality is likely to lie somewhere in between the three above-mentioned options. Maybe one, maybe the other, maybe all of them.

 

Which gets us back to what could be done to improve education. This topic seems critical since from the age of zero to 18 most of what you are exposed to is school and what your parents let you do. Let's keep the parents out of the equation.

 

So if we assume for a moment that schooling's mission is transferring knowledge and preparing kids to become better humans.

 

What are the key competencies needed to be the best human you could be? (in no particular order)

-Developing awareness

-Grounding yourself in reality: life purpose, top values...

-Understanding emotions

-Meditation: (discussing the need for spirituality for any human beings, put it in contrast with religion)

-Introduction to psychological evolution: (Clare Graves model)

sexuality, relationships, dietetic...

 

Why do I propose addressing these topics in school? 

-Life is a bit like using Excel.

You don't need to know exactly how to use every option but you have to be aware of their existence. So that when you need them you can figure it out.

-Not everyone has the particular mix of character traits to be curious 

-The people having access to these concepts are in possession of a more practical toolkit to navigate life

 

To conclude this mental masturbation. I would like to ask you what the beautiful and wise people of this forum: what could be improved in the schooling system in order to make it as useful as possible? 

 

 

PS, this post is not about religion, teachers getting paid more, classes being too big , Montessori nor the fact that the world "god" is a part of the pledge of allegiance 

 

Thanks for your time 

Source 1: https://www.givingwhatwecan.org/research/other-causes/education/

I made the effort so that my kids could be taught at home, I worked, the wife stayed home with the kids and i helped her educate the kids where i was needed, and of course i educated them in areas other than books.  In teaching your own kids you have to provide a lot of things for them outside of the book learning, interaction with others is a big one, but you get to choose the environment they are subject to growing up.  It requires a great deal of sacrifice but it is worth it.  The public school system wont ever change, and i know it is criticized a lot but all kids need an education and many parents aren't qualified, capable, or even have a desire to educate their own kids, and i suspect the public schools and the teachers are doing a pretty good job with what they have to work with.

[Gmork]

1. Lesson cant be more than 25 min. (When in class) No one can be at high efficiency for longer than ~30 min and thats why there should be no lecture longer than that. No one can actually LEARN form long 90 min lecture. 
2. All important information should be given on start of class and work through in lesson. No person can learn form simply writing stuff more than 5% of material (was proven) then why waste time for writing ?
3. Writing only to train or learning proces NO rewriting information.
4. First years should be like Language class, Math class and the rest stuff like 'How to learn', 'Communication' 'Food' etc. (and Sport/gym) I dont remember almost anything from years of my history class... so thats how i have my horyzont widened...

Thats my short view on schooling system, plus that : "preparing kids to become better humans"

 

P.S @Leo Gura Actually i often use 1,25 or 1,5 speed up on youtube and watch your videos on 2 or 3 parts. Anyway its not like you heaving us to learn intensively, you dont use compressed 'knowledge', and we all here enjoy it so its 3 times easier to do, we all have interest in it.

 

Edited April 16, 2016 by Gmork

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Gmork said:

Lesson cant be more than 25 min. (When in class) No one can be at high efficiency for longer than ~30 min and thats why there should be no lecture longer than that. No one can actually LEARN form long 90 min lecture. 

Guess that means I'm disqualified

[Nic]

 

[Philip]

@Damien

29 minutes ago, Damien said:

what could be improved in the schooling system in order to make it as useful as possible?

Our education system was useful for centuries, but now it's pretty outdated. I see three major aspects here :

• The content
• The medium
• The tests

First, the content. I think we need to refocus our teaching in two different ways.

Instead of presenting the material as an absolute truth they must accept right away, we should ask the students to make hypotheses about it. If we do that (moderately, of course), they might discover a scientific curiosity that's hiding inside them, which will motivate them to work for passion instead of obligation.

Also, the content should be more personal. It should be more about how to improve one self in a holistic way, instead of just improving IQ, memory and discipline. Positive psychology, ancient philosophy, communication, marketing, and physical education are good examples of courses we should put more emphasis on.

Then, the medium. Instead of listening to the teacher in front of the class, I suggest putting lots of money and effort into making videos, text with illustrations or animations, as well as educative games. Also, a well-developed forum should be available for every class.

And finally, the tests. I can't say much about those, because I'm not an expert. But I sure hope someday we invent a technology that makes them more accurate at measuring true understanding. So we can know if a student has superficially explored the lesson just to pass the exam or if he integrated it and will remember it for years. Maybe by using brain scans, or by doing interviews, I don't know. That way we encourage the students to develop some kind of interest in the subjects presented. We also encourage passion, curiosity and wisdom. 

Passion, curiosity, wisdom. Not only are these three capacities found in no other species than humans, but they're pretty much what allowed our education system to exist in the first place.

[Nic]

Hi Damien, greets from Zurich! Cool to have neighbors round here!

 I believe in a school without competition, where we care about the outcome of the group, not making egoistic individuals caring only about their own results.

i believe also that school should be use to solve the issues of tomorrow by teaching pupils to look at the roots of the problems of how we could improve the human condition. I bet they would do a better job than all the politicians around today, could it actually be worse? The ones that should get marks are teachers from the group's ability to get better at problem solving.

Teach pupils the difference between making a life and making a living as the TED video said!

 

[Damien]

@Henri Thanks for this insight.

17 hours ago, Philip said:

Instead of presenting the material as an absolute truth they must accept right away, we should ask the students to make hypotheses about it. If we do that (moderately, of course), they might discover a scientific curiosity that's hiding inside them, which will motivate them to work for passion instead of obligation.

@Philip Your approach to the content seems on point. I would say that we all intuitively know it but choose to ignore it.

 

@vizual The school system seems quite inert. Nonetheless, from my perspective it is not as hopeless as you make it sound. Maybe it is the idealist part of me speaking

 

@charlie2dogs Home schooling seems like an "ideal" yet tricky alternative. I admire the commitment the two of you made.

[reez]

https://www.ted.com/talks/ken_robinson_changing_education_paradigms

[Lorcan]

Ha! We talk and complain, and moan about the education system, yet no one does anything.

I dont blame you, its the system we live in.

No one does anything because they dont know how, or they feel like they cant do anything.

 

[actualized1]

Personal development should be encouraged or at least mentioned (laughed when i wrote this) at school

[StarfoxEpiphany]

@Leo Gura Your videos have a pause button.

Edited April 29, 2016 by StarfoxEpiphany

[Irina Irina]

It's really tragic. Looking back, I think the school just keeps distracting you from yourself and life. It's awfull. When you finish highschool you're completely unprepared for life. 

[Steven]

1 minute ago, Irina Irina said:

It's really tragic. Looking back, I think the school just keeps distracting you from yourself and life. It's awfull. When you finish highschool you're completely unprepared for life. 

Highschool prepares you for university  

[Irina Irina]

@Steven That's true. That's even more fucked up.

I mean, I've invested my energy into school and learning for like...my whole life?? I finished university, I have a good job, I'm 24. But I'm completely unprepared for life. Real life. They don't teach you in school things like self respect, self esteem, abuse and so much more. Uhhh. this makes me sick. Cannot even express all my feelings and thoughts about this subject.

[Irina Irina]

Will there ever be schools that teach you to create a life not a living?? uhhh. This whole system is so fucked up.