Are Psychedelics A Good Idea — Existential Crisis

[PetarKa]

Lately I have been struggling with some existential issues. Mainly on free will. I am fearful about my free will and from the conclusion that free will is an illusion I've been causing a lot of stress and fear in my life. After some research about psychedelics, I am skeptical about whether it's a good idea. I have not tried psychedelics. At first I read only positive things about them — they're used for treating depression, anxiety, PTSD, spiritual growth, etc. But then I also read that, although rare, some people might have a bad trip with bad psychological effects later after the trip.

Is it worth the risk?

Is my situation appropriate for psychedelic use?

Is a bad trip the result of chance, or the wrong approach / setting?

[YaNanNallari]

Just relax man

[Forestluv]

@PetarKa You may get a variety of feedback on this. From my POV, there seems to be instability with some sort of underlying issues. I think there is a high risk of psychedelics destabilizing and being counter-productive.

I would recommend building a foundation based on consistent daily practice that could include meditation, yoga, contemplation and journaling. After a foundation is built over 6-12 months and things stabalize, there may be a calling to go deeper with psychedelics. I’d consider a counselor as well.

Personally, I don’t think psychedelics are a useful tool to use solo until one has matured to Green. Combining psychotherapy with psychedelics has shown to be beneficial, yet it hasn’t yet reached mainstream clinics. 

[Leo Gura]

@PetarKa If you haven't tried, then you don't know and will never know until afterward.

Stop trying to know things beforehand. You are putting the cart before the horse.

Either do, or do not.

You might as well be asking, "I've heard of roller-coasters, is going on a roller-coaster a good thing? What if it goes off the rails?"

"I've heard of microscopes, is looking into a microscope a good thing? What if a bacterium pokes my eye out?"

"I've heard of music. Should I listen to it? What if it gives me ear cancer?"

[Salvijus]

5 hours ago, PetarKa said:

Lately I have been struggling with some existential issues. Mainly on free will. I am fearful about my free will and from the conclusion that free will is an illusion I've been causing a lot of stress and fear in my life.

Psychedelics will not bring balance into your life i can guarentee you that.

If you can't even maitain proper sanity while being sober, then psychedelics will only mess you up even more.

What you need in life right now is to bring balance on all levels. Clearly your mind is working against you. Anxiety and stress is all a consiquence of no balance in the mind. 

Psychedelics will not give you balance. That's a 100% guarentee. And possibility for you to become even more imbalanced is huge. 

You have nothing to gain from psychedelics at all. Psychedelics can be useful when you're extremely balanced and stable. Then venturing into different dimensions can be fantastic. If you do that in your current condition you will go crazy. It will brake you. It will not stabalize you.

Edited January 31, 2019 by Salvijus

[Setty]

@PetarKa Why are you worrying about your free will? If the free will is an illuson your worrying will do nothing to change it. If there is free will then you don't need to be worrying. It is completely unnesesary for you to suffer this conundrum.

The trip could help you tremendously or it could harm you. The question is how would you deal with a bad trip afterwards? Where would you go for help if it made things worse? What would be your refuge? Maybe answer that question first. 

I never had a bad trip (only uncomfortable ones) but I experienced many negative effect of psychedelics after the fact. And I think the worst thing about it was that I had to keep it a secret. I had to suffer in silence. There was no one I could talk to about it and share the pain with. After a while I found a therapist that specializes in psychedelics and it helped me tremendously. Just the fact I could tell someone what I was going through helped me.

 

[Gabriel Antonio]

4 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Psychedelics will not bring balance into your life i can guarentee you that.

If you can't even maitain proper sanity while being sober, then psychedelics will only mess you up even more.

What you need in life right now is to bring balance on all levels. Clearly your mind is working against you. Anxiety and stress is all a consiquence of no balance in the mind. 

Psychedelics will not give you balance. That's a 100% guarentee. And possibility for you to become even more imbalanced is huge. 

You have nothing to gain from psychedelics at all. Psychedelics can be useful when you're extremely balanced and stable. Then venturing into different dimensions can be fantastic. If you do that in your current condition you will go crazy.

I don’t fully agree with you.

Before I first went to an ayahuasca ceremony, I was in a moment of hardcore existential seeking. And in that trip, I realized what a great blessing it is to be a human. It was as if “my heart opened”. As many seekers, I had been destroying my relationships. And in the trip, I realized first-hand the significance of bonding with others. I felt an enormous love that I hadn’t felt ever since I was 7 or 8. Then, with that, my neurotic quest for spiritual liberation dropped away. 

Even though I don’t use psychedelics antmore, I am grateful that I tried them at least once in my life. 

That being said, I’m not saying the same thing will happen with the OP. Psychedelics might trigger psychotic, maniac (unhealthy euphoria), or megalomaniac episodes. And they can be very traumatic.

But, again, these substances can also reconnect the person with Being, which can melt away many neurotic, obsessive, and obselete patterns. 

@PetarKa Not an easy choice... try to follow your intuition. And remember that psychedelics are not the only way to bring healing into your life.

Good luck ?

[Salvijus]

@Gabriel Antonio interesting. But it doesn't sound like you weren't emotionally unstable. It sounds like you were reasonably stable but confused about spiritual liberation or smth. And psychedelics gave you some nice insight. Am I wrong? Being confused is not the same as having no balance. Being confused is a good thing.

Or is it that you were totally depressed and stressout and then did ceremony and everything became fine and now you're joyful and happy?

The real question is whether psychedelics made you more grounded or not. Because my point is psychedelics can't make you more grounded. it can only shatter your pshychological structure on whitch all you sanity depends on. Before you remove that make sure you can stand being insane. That's what I meant.

My point is you don't solve your existencial crisis by shattering your sense of reality even more. afterall, all the fear and stress that is happening is simply because his constructed reality is falling away. He realizes that he has no free will and that is too much for him. Imagine if he finds out he doesn't exist. He'll go crazy. It's important to have a solid foundation before you climb high. Otherwise work on your balance and stay on the ground.

Edited January 31, 2019 by Salvijus

[Girzo]

@PetarKa Beware of opinions of people who have not tried psychedelics or got scared off them for some unusual reason.

Unless you are a teenager or mentally ill, psychedelics are 100% for you to try. Start with something like LSD and dedicate yourself to tripping at least a dozen times before you judge them.

I've experienced almost no side-effects from psychedelics, like most people. They are extremely safe and effective, but you have to be responsible.

[Gabriel Antonio]

@Salvijus Actually I was highly unstable.

Luckily, my trip was more about emotional healing. Probably because I didn’t take a high dose.

There was no shattering of reality. That would have likely made me go even deeper into the rabbit hole. And it could’ve had really bad consequences. 

Instead, the trip made me fall in love with physical reality. I would observe someone in the ceremony, and I’d feel an immense love for that being. 

I also rejuvenated a lot after the ceremony. 

But, again, psychedelics are not for everyone. Many psychonauts not only would be much better off if they stopped; they turn tripping into an addiction.  

Anyway, thanks for sharing your opinion! Psychedelics do have a dark side despite all the healing I got from them... 

[Salvijus]

@Gabriel Antonio thanks for sharing your experience also

It's interesting for me to hear that psychedelics would have a grounding and healing effect on you... thanks

But to be fair if stability is what you need in life, there are far more reliable methods to become more grounded and balanced then psychedelics. And far more safer.

 

Edited January 31, 2019 by Salvijus

[Salvijus]

28 minutes ago, Girzo said:

@PetarKa Beware of opinions of people who have not tried psychedelics or got scared off them for some unusual reason.

Who cares about my experience with psychedelics. If what I say makes logical sense then what's the problem. 

[TheAvatarState]

7 hours ago, PetarKa said:

Is it worth the risk?

This is a deeply personal question, you tell me!

[Girzo]

@Salvijus because logic is highly susceptible to be faulty when you lack direct experience.

For example, in my experience psychedelics make you more grounded while you say the opposite thing. 

[ajasatya]

8 hours ago, PetarKa said:

Lately I have been struggling with some existential issues. Mainly on free will. I am fearful about my free will and from the conclusion that free will is an illusion I've been causing a lot of stress and fear in my life.

you can think of an orange; you can say the word "orange"; you can buy an orange and eat it. i don't know why you think you have no free will.

you may think "oh, but what if all of that was already written?".

• suppose it wasn't written: what practical benefits would you have?
• suppose it was written: what practical harms would be caused to you?

you're just indulging in mental masturbation. let go of both existence and absence of free will. those are just useless mental disturbs.

[luckieluuke]

I heard Rupert Spira say the other day, something along the lines of: "for now consider that free will is a thing. What you should do with it is feel your connectedness with everything and act on it"

[Salvijus]

1 hour ago, Girzo said:

For example, in my experience psychedelics make you more grounded while you say the opposite thing. 

Can you elaborate more on what is your experience you talk about being more grounded after psychedelics?

Can you say that one can use psychedelics when he is in depressed state and full of anxiety and stress. And then use psychedelics as a tool to become an absolutely focused, in harmony, at ease with life, joyful, happy, with a clear mind, full of energy, able to handle whatever life situation throws at you, always remain peaceful in all situations? can you achieve this kind of balance with psychedelics? I don't think so. They are good at dismantling your illusions. But not for bringing stability in ones life.

Tho@Gabriel Antonio  is an interesting example. It made me rethink this whole thing. I guess there could be some emotional trauma release or energy release that would lead to a better mental health. It's possible. But that's just as far as it can get you. It can only heal your wounds. But if you want to build a strong fabric on with you can land whatever life thows at you and remain balanced even if hell falls upon you and you're still okey. To get this kind of balance takes totally different approach. Psychedelics have no such effect on the mind.

 

I think you're just confusing being grounded with something else.

There're few explanations as to why you think you became more grounded after psychedelics. Either you became more confident and you think you're better then everyone else because you had some fancy nondual experience. This gives you confidence and you think you're more grounded.

Or maybe you just melted your brains out. Like people who smoke weed to have no anxiety. They think weed makes them more capable of handling stress but what is truly happening is that they are numbing themselfs to the point where they don't care about anything and then they think they achieved balanced in life. 

Or it could be some emotional release also. This could be actually good.and healthy and thus make you more stable. That's one way it could produce balance in someone's life. But I wouldn't call this a bacoming more balanced i'd call this healing and rejuvinating. It's good. But balance is much more then just a rejuvination. In other words it's how capable are you to handle whatever life throws at you. It depends on how much balance you have.

there's no way psychedelics can make a person more capable, more focused, clear and stable in life. It is highly draining, damaging and destructive. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 31, 2019 by Salvijus

[Girzo]

1 hour ago, Salvijus said:

there's no way psychedelics can make a person more capable, more focused, clear and stable in life. It is highly draining, damaging and destructive. 

That's a groundless assumption stated as a fact. The harm is in confusion caused to minds of people reading essays like this one.

You are free to have an opinion, just don't express it with a tone of authority.

Edited January 31, 2019 by Girzo

[Salvijus]

1 hour ago, Girzo said:

That's a groundless assumption stated as a fact. The harm is in confusion caused to minds of people reading essays like this one.

You are free to have an opinion, just don't express it with a tone of authority.

You say you disagree but you're naither able to give me an example of how psychedelics can make you more stable in life, nor can you counter-argument the things I said. 

 

 

[Jack River]

Fosho..

Stability is not dependent upon things, things are dependent upon stability.