I Saw the Devil

[JayG84]

Hi guys. Been listening to Leo for about 4 years. This is my first time reaching out on the form. Glad to be in the community.

I started working with a therapist about 6 months ago just to assess how far along I was coming along because I still have a lot of problems that I'm struggling to take action on, like a binge-eating disorder, loneliness issues, life purpose (I bought the course). etc.

He identified that I have an overactive sub-conscious mind that was overpowering my conscious self and keeping me in this "comfortable" state in my life. Like I have 2 people living inside me. One is scared, doesn't like change, feels inferior to the rest of the world, and is mad about it (Which I think is my ego). The other one is a confident, adventurous, intelligent, empathetic being who wants to grow and love unconditionally (Which I identified as my authentic self). The therapist said doesn't seem to have the same definitions of these things as I do.

We did this exercise the other day called the Empty Chair Technique of Gestalt Therapy, where you picture those 2 entities who are inhabiting you sitting in empty chairs in the room. You can also picture all the "roles" that you play in your life in chairs too, like the inauthentic "work self", or the side of you that wants to pursue sex and money at all costs. You have a dialogue between all these sides of you. You can sit in a chair and talk as one of these entities to other ones, or speak to them as if you are outside looking in.

After a while of putting on this "play" of different roles, and talking openly about all the things you wish to change and forget about all these entities, you slowly start to realize that what you're witnessing is a battle inside of you.

At that point I had, what felt like, an outer body experience.

I started looking at all the roles I play on a day to day basis as just the actors that were created and put into the play to tell a part of the story. I saw the conscious entity that wants to change, grow, and love, as the audience who is looking at this play, wanting it to be better, and believing that it can.

I turned to the chair that had the entity who is scared, mad, and hates change. I have an feeling wash over me that I've only had watching horror movies. I saw the Devil. He was smiling at me. He looked like me, but he was ruff looking, dirty and sitting there with immense arrogance. It felt like he was laughing at me while he was engaging in all the lowest conscious behaviors that I've been doing over and over in my life. It felt like he had so much power over the whole situation. I just stood there looking at that chair, terrified, astonished, in disbelief, and I finally said to myself, there's the Devil. There he is, sitting there in that room pulling all the stings. He's the director of this "play". He hired all the actors, he built this set, he controls what you point the light at and don't -  He's micro-managing all of it. The audience is not happy and trying to tell him what they really want to see, but he just keeps on with the show. 

I finally realize what is meant by saying that the Ego is the Devil. The Ego is the mastermind who is fabricating this whole production. He's stubborn, ignorant, and thinks he knows best. He only wants to serve himself, not the audience. So I have to find a way to convince him to change the production, or get rid of him entirely. He definitely scared me. I don't know how he got in there and why he's so scared. But this devils got to go.

Have you guys had any experience with seeing this side of your psyche? Maybe when taking psychedelics? How did you deal with it?

Thanks guys.

[Forestluv]

Be careful about starting a “good ego vs bad ego” dynamic. The entity calling out the “bad ego” is also ego cloaked in goodness. 

See if you can be a neutral observer. Just  observe the psychological dynamic without judgement or criticism. As if you were watching a movie. It gets fascinating. . . 

[Leo Gura]

@JayG84 He is you.

Lol

You are like the groundhog who saw his own shadow and ran away.

[pluto]

@JayG84 The Devil is nothing. Wait till you see Leo Gura

[Anton Rogachevski]

Had the exact same vision at the beginning of the journey!

[Leo Gura]

27 minutes ago, pluto said:

@JayG84 The Devil is nothing. Wait till you see Leo Gura

Don't assume what I have seen.

[JayG84]

@Leo Gura I agree. He is me. At least the me who's in control right now. My authentic self controls my mind, and the devil controls my actions. I can armchair philosophize all day, but he won't let me do anything about it. He zaps my motivation, gives me this cloud of depression, makes me afraid of everything, and tries to convince me to give up. 

Sad thing is, I thought I was making some real progress. But he seems to be more powerful now than ever. (Ego backlash)?

[Leo Gura]

1 minute ago, JayG84 said:

My authentic self controls my mind

Nope, that's a devilish lie.

The devil IS your entire mind.

[JayG84]

@Leo Gura What is that part of the mind that knows what I should be doing? 

I want to be comfortable

I want to be calm

I want to be emotionally un-reactive

I want to be ok with failure

I want to be free of my addictions

I want to be fully present

I want to be self-sustaining

I want to be grounded in my authentic self

I want to be true to my core values

I want to be of service to people

I want to be moving towards my greatest purpose and passion

 

But another part of me wants to be a complete fuck up. How can it be so fragmented?

[Leo Gura]

@JayG84 Both of those are ego (the devil).

The True Self wants nothing. That's the paradox. By wanting nothing you get everything, and by wanting stuff you are forever trapped in a cycle of fragmentation and self-created hell.

But also, within every devil there is a tiny 1% part which wants to return to God. That is what allows for the devil's salvation.

If you weren't a fragment, you couldn't exist. See? In order to stay alive you MUST fragment yourself. If you stopped fragmentation you'd be dead! The way you've set up life is, you've defined fragmentation as "life" and unity as "death". So you're busy all the time avoiding unity. You are terrified of unity because it would mean the loss of the fragment you call you.

The devil is just a fragment of God!

[Joseph Maynor]

I went through a stage where I was really keen on the religious words, and I think I've hit the exact opposite point where I don't like the religious words anymore.  It's just not necessary plus the Ego clings to it.  That's exactly what religion is: a spirituality that a human Ego can cling to.

Edited January 29, 2019 by Joseph Maynor

[TheAvatarState]

I looked in the mirror this morning as well, lol

[JayG84]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

The True Self wants nothing. That's the paradox. By wanting nothing you get everything, and by wanting stuff you are forever trapped in a cycle of fragmentation and self-created hell.

@Leo Gura

So are the True Self, the conscious self, or the authentic self all ego? Where does your intuition come from? What is that tells you to move forward and not give up? Where do you get the motivation from?

I'm having trouble reconciling this. I want to let go, surrender, and listen to the part of me that wants to align with passion and service. Is it not ok to want to make the world a better place? I just want to make sure that this is not still the Devil in disguise. How do I trust that my life decisions are correct when the devil has made me fail so many times?

I'm just frustrated because I thought that I was becoming very aware of my (and other people's) ego, and making good strides to get past it. But, I feel like the more aware I am of the "chimpery" in the world, the more I realize how insignificant we are, and that everything is a construction of the mind - the less interest I have in everything that I used to, and ultimately find it harder to follow my passions, and it leads to more suffering and despair. 

My therapist wants me to unite my conscious and sub-conscious mind to find a compromise. Is this a waste of time? Can I not relieve suffering that way?

[Highest]

Yeah, I have meet him too. He is very very real and I know that for certain. I know the devil is none other than I. I didn't know it before but now I do for I am the non-dual awarness, the non-dual consciousness. All I know is Myself by Being Myself trough Myself, and I know I am All, I am Everything. If the Devil, if evil and darkness didn't exist, I wouldn't be God, I wouldn't be infinite. 

[Leo Gura]

7 hours ago, JayG84 said:

I'm having trouble reconciling this. I want to let go, surrender, and listen to the part of me that wants to align with passion and service. Is it not ok to want to make the world a better place? I just want to make sure that this is not still the Devil in disguise. How do I trust that my life decisions are correct when the devil has made me fail so many times?

Don't get ahead of your skiis here.

For practical purposes, yes, you CAN rely on your intuition and follow your genuine passions and your heart. We might call this the "higher self" or "the soul". This is still not the full True Self, but it's good enough to bootstrap your life.

Yes, it is okay to want to make the world a better place, just don't go overboard. Don't turn it into a mad crusade. And don't neglect your inner work, the Greater Jihad.

Yes, it can be useful to explore your subconscious mind and to integrate various fragmented parts of your psyche. It's not the ultimate solution, but it's a decent starting point.

You have to realize that this work has many parts. Not everything is about awaking up. There are also more practical aspects to life and even to your mind and psychology which need to be worked on. For example, maybe you have some childhood trauma that needs to be ironed out. This not going to enlighten you, nor will it end all your suffering, but it's still important to do because all of that psychological baggage adds up and constricts your ability to awaken.

There is no escape from the devil. The forces of devilry are always at work. So you must always stay vigilant and study the devil's ways. But at the same time, don't get paranoid. Generally speaking, follow your heart. Sometimes the devil will trick you even when you try to follow your heart. That's okay, you will get better and better at avoiding his tricks.

And with some deep enlightenments, the devil's grip over you will significantly diminish. Not totally, but significantly.

See my video: The Paradox Of Developing Self-Trust

[JayG84]

@Leo Gura Thanks Leo, your advice really helped me put it all in perspective. I have perfectionistic tendencies, and I get caught up in trying to do it all at once and as soon as possible. I have to remember to take it one step at a time. Much appreciated.

[JayG84]

Would psychedelics been a good idea to try with such a powerful subconscious mind? Or would that not help at all? Can it help you to face your subconscious to have a dialogue with it, or would it just overwhelm me at this point in my spiritual journey? 

I'd like to find out, but I'm afraid of what I might see in there.