Isn't spiral dynamics just a way of putting people in boxes?

[EvilAngel]

I don't think it's useful to categorise people and conceptualise that some people are more or less "advanced" than others due to their beliefs or way of life. 

[Bluebird]

It's not really about being advanced. It's just increasingly more integrative and wide perspectives.

Green can still be incredibly dysfunctional, especially at the personal level. I wouldn't call that advanced.

[Forestluv]

@EvilAngel In school systems it’s helpful to categorize children into “grades” as children. 8 yr. olds are placed in 2nd grade, 12 yr olds are placed in 6th grade. At an individual level, it woukd be silly to say that a 6th grade child is somehow “better” than the 2nd grade child. Yet at the social level, sometimes it’s helpful to create groups of children based on their developmental level. 

[Maya_0]

It is a useful map of spiritual development. The categorization is not done with a disparaging intent.

[Esoteric]

It's a great asset and tool for evolving as a human and getting different perspectives. The problem arises when people use it to elevate themselves and put others down which I see frequently on this forum. Bragging on a message board how they are transitioning to coral and other silly stuff.

[Aaron p]

@EvilAngel spiritually is not the *repression* of human categorical and ideological thinking...it is only the understanding of it (which then removes the ideological thinking naturally and healthily). 

There's nothing wrong with categorising people, whats important is the understanding that the categorisation is not real, and discovering this authentically through meditative practises.

[Forestluv]

13 minutes ago, Mikael89 said:

What do you think for example Ramana Maharshi would've said about spiral dynamics? Oh it would've been awesome to hear him annihilate spiral dynamics with one single sentence ?

@Mikael89  Who do you think would win between Godzilla and King King? I bet Godzilla would annihilate King Kong with one single fire breath.

[Leo Gura]

@EvilAngel You are not understanding Spiral Dynamics.

[EvilAngel]

3 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

@EvilAngel In school systems it’s helpful to categorize children into “grades” as children. 8 yr. olds are placed in 2nd grade, 12 yr olds are placed in 6th grade. At an individual level, it woukd be silly to say that a 6th grade child is somehow “better” than the 2nd grade child. Yet at the social level, sometimes it’s helpful to create groups of children based on their developmental level. 

I disagree that spirituality is a kind of linear continuum. I disagree that, for example, a Muslim or Mormon (apparently stage blue??) is at a lower developmental level. It's an incredibly facile way of looking at things,

[EvilAngel]

4 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

A lower developmental level than what?

Then, say, a hippy. Or anyone. Why should one way of thinking be considered "more developed" than another?

[Forestluv]

@EvilAngel

Stage blue still has a considerable amount of irrationality about anthropomorphic gods, mythical thinking and a desire to own an objective universal morality based on literal interpretations of ancient scriptures. Stage Green and Turquoise individuals have matured beyond this developmental stage.   

Also, religion is not limited to stage blue. For example, there is a path to Turquoise-level Christ consciousness via Christianity. Yet those who have reached that developmental level had previously developed through a blue stage,  

[EvilAngel]

12 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

Stage blue still has a considerable amount of irrationality about anthropomorphic gods, mythical thinking and an desire to own an objective universal morality based in literal interpretations of ancient scriptures. . Stage Green and Turquoise individuals have matured beyond this developmental stage.   

Religion is not limited to stage blue. For example, there is a path to Turquoise Christ consciousness  via  Christianity. Yet, everyone who has reached that developmental level had previously developed through a blue stage,  

Spiral dynamics is ridiculous status-chasing nonsense which reeks of ego. 

Edited January 27, 2019 by EvilAngel

[Forestluv]

@EvilAngel  I can see how it may appear that way to some minds. 

[Truth Addict]

@EvilAngel It's not meant to be putting people in boxes. It's a map, use it wisely.

[Joseph Maynor]

This is a really good question.  Here's a good analogy: Take the DSM which is called the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual for Psychologists.  Now, any schlub off the street can buy a DSM and go around diagnosing everybody he wants to.  But that's gonna be very different from how a trained Psychologist uses the manual.  Spiral Dynamics is no different.  There's an old saying that a little bit of knowledge is dangerous.  This is true in the case of Spiral Dynamics.  But someone who is really solid in Spiral Dynamics realizes that it's just a model that's more or less useful depending on the context -- and it can be abused, misinterpreted, and used to demonize just like any other categorical label or "box" can.

Edited January 27, 2019 by Joseph Maynor

[WelcometoReality]

@EvilAngel Like any tool it can be misused. A shovel is great to dig holes in the ground but please don't hit people in the head with it.

Edited January 27, 2019 by WelcometoReality
Tpyo

[Rilles]

Heres a helpful way of thinking about

 

Purple helped us survive in nature by banding together

Red helped us get out of bands and start conquering the world

Blue helped us makes laws and society

Orange helped us with alot of problems that comes with society

etc etc

 

Now can you say that any of these were not useful or undeveloped? No

But would you want to live in a tribe or be a nomad today? Hell no

[EvilAngel]

3 hours ago, Rilles said:

Heres a helpful way of thinking about

 

Purple helped us survive in nature by banding together

Red helped us get out of bands and start conquering the world

Blue helped us makes laws and society

Orange helped us with alot of problems that comes with society

etc etc

 

Now can you say that any of these were not useful or undeveloped? No

But would you want to live in a tribe or be a nomad today? Hell no

I can see how it's useful to describe societies at certain points in history, but not individuals. 

 

[Rilles]

20 minutes ago, EvilAngel said:

I can see how it's useful to describe societies at certain points in history, but not individuals. 

 

Society is composed of these individuals. You cant separate history/individual/society from eachother. 

[EvilAngel]

3 hours ago, Rilles said:

Society is composed of these individuals. You cant separate history/individual/society from eachother. 

Yes you can. My beliefs, for example, are fluid and can change from day to day (even with the recognition that they are just beliefs). So I cannot be categorised as any particular colour. 

It's so, so dumb, and actually @Leo Gura I am understanding Spiral Dynamics, and it's nonsense.

I mean how do you explain someone who has traits of all the different "stages"? 

I could literally go through all stages in a day.

Maybe I'm a "rainbow person". 

 

Edited January 27, 2019 by EvilAngel