how to improve thought quality

[Aakash]

how does one improve thought quality then? 

[Salvijus]

You can do that with meditation. But not all meditations do the trick. Usually Yoga does.

[Sahil Pandit]

@Aakash Stillness, quiet observation, and non attachment. 

[Arhattobe]

Practicing the 4 yogas. The yamas, niyamas.

Or the 8 fold path. 

[How to be wise]

@Aakash The Work of Byron Katie.

[Nahm]

4 hours ago, Aakash said:

how does one improve thought quality then? 

Quality...Drop any serious perspective and see the fun in playing the inner game....of choosing a better feeling, yet true for you, thought. With enough practice, your perspective & the actually-too-good-to-believe truth become closer in vibrational proximity. Then you experience “tapping into it”, “connection”, “unification” “higher self”  (whatever term you like) thoughts - and thus you have insights, epiphanies, revelations, and “enlightenment”. (Using quotes as it was you all along....full circle). In playing the ‘better thought’ game, you will naturally witness the weeding out of judgment, envy, greed, etc, etc...while simultaneously becoming more aware of the resonance between thought quality and emotional well being.   

Quantity...Overthinking imo is the result of the finite mind identified as a separate self, auto-attempting to resolve this falsity every which way but directly. It’s perpetuated of course by the ignorance (ignor-ance / ignoring) that the finite mind is not an identity, and the finite mind perceiving in a manor which justify’s “it’s identity”.

For the deeper neurological pathways, such as past trauma’s, there seems to be two paths: Genuinly stop repeating the thought/memory and sooner or later it simply just isn’t a part of the now anymore - or go into & through it by “doing the work” which results in an entirely different (and happier) perspective. Either way, the end result is no longer identifying with the thoughts. 

Stomach breathing awareness meditation creates space between thoughts, making all of the above strategies much easier.

Also...food is mood, and health is wealth.

[How to be wise]

44 minutes ago, Nahm said:

Stomach breathing awareness meditation creates space between thoughts, making all of the above strategies much easier.

I agree that meditation can put you in a space where you’re detached from thoughts, but can it bring it over to your everyday experience? That is the question.

[Nahm]

@How to be wise Yes. Of course. Meditation (the space realized / thought detachment) drops conditioned perspectives which are adhered to / repeated, and opens the mind to new perspectives. Then the falsities begin to disintegrate in Truth. However, at the core of dream is of course uncertainty, that is the gift. One is free to meditate in the morning, clearing the conditioning, and resume it with low quality thoughts throughout the day, essentially undoing the work that was done. Who would want to do this. 

 

[How to be wise]

@Nahm But how do you explain the fact that many people have been meditating for thirty years without getting any lasting non-dual insights? 

Well, at least that’s what I’ve been hearing.

[Aakash]

my guess they get lost in the mesh of blackness and trying to transcend or being put in a trance as opposed to identifying what is that thing that feels like myself.  i've always wondered why this would happen myself

[TheAvatarState]

@Aakash your thoughts, your level of Consciousness, and your environment are all intimately connected. Changing one can influence the other two, but not equally. Consciousness comes prior to everything else, is fundamentally everything else, therefore, it's the best knob to turn to 11. 

Trying to focus on your thoughts directly would be like trying to optimize sound quality by only changing the acoustics of the room. Go to the source and fine tune the speaker instead. You are the speaker whose job it is to play music the best it can... don't be concerned with how your sound bounces off the walls. 

[Aakash]

Thank you all i will start changing some things now   

[Nahm]

23 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

@Nahm But how do you explain the fact that many people have been meditating for thirty years without getting any lasting non-dual insights? 

Well, at least that’s what I’ve been hearing.

I haven’t come accross that or heard that from anyone. To give an answer though, look at this (it may initially seem semantical).....

1 hour ago, How to be wise said:

I agree that meditation can put you in a space where you’re detached from thoughts, but can it bring it over to your everyday experience? That is the question.

And consider what’s said is actually this...

I agree meditation can put me in myself, where I’m detached from thoughts, I can bring my self into my everyday experience, so there is no question. 

[WelcometoReality]

@How to be wise @Nahm Extreme cases of course. 30+ years of meditation without a non dual experience probably won't happen to the average person but could it be that these people are not using the meditation techniques in the right way?

[bejapuskas]

It might be that the person is meditating for 30 years, but hasn't cleared their information intake at all  

[How to be wise]

@Nahm Thank you for the turnaround. 

8 hours ago, Nahm said:

I haven’t come accross that or heard that from anyone.

An example would be Rick Archer. He says that he has been doing transcendental meditation for 25 years without any lasting benefits. I’ve heard Byron Katie talk about people she did The Work with who have been meditating for 30 years prior to this, and they still attach to thoughts. Then there are all the people who go to vippassana retreats and are still not enlightened. 

I’m not fully sure about this, but that’s how I’ve understood it from these people. If you know differently, please fill me in.

[Truth Addict]

@Aakash

What do you mean exactly by the word "quality"?

[Truth Addict]

@How to be wise @Nahm

I live in a Muslim society, and I myself had been a Muslim for a good 5 years. Most people around me pray every single day five times at least. None of them is enlightened, not even the oldest and most wise of them, guaranteed.

I used to do the same for 5 consecutive years. I almost never skipped a prayer back then. Only to find myself nowhere near Allah. I even used to wake myself up at 3 or 4 a.m in the cold (which I am very sensitive to, since I have some thyroid problem) just so I don't miss the prayer.

I didn't know the essence of prayer, and I used to make it somehow imaginary, until I learned about meditation from Leo.

So, how can someone be meditating for 30 years without getting enlightened, or at least, make some progress?

Well, ask my parents and my "sheikh".

Prayer in my society, is done for egoic reasons, escaping an imaginary Hell and and winning an imaginary Paradise.

Also, it is done in a very rigid and dogmatic way, where your eyes must keep looking at the ground directly where your head touches the ground with your right hand is over the left one, and both are put on the belly, etc...

It's also irrelevant to the practical life, so you can lie and cheat and steal, and your prayers don't have anything to do with that. It doesn't make sense to my society that their prayers should inform their behaviour. For them, it's just irrelevant. (of course, in theory they can easily write an odyssey about the benefits of prayer, which nobody really knows about).

I am planning to return to my prayer practice when the winter is over.

I might find something of value there, since my consciousness now has expanded more than ever.

Edited January 21, 2019 by Truth Addict

[How to be wise]

@Truth Addict Thank you for your insight.

[Nahm]

7 hours ago, How to be wise said:

@Nahm Thank you for the turnaround. 

An example would be Rick Archer. He says that he has been doing transcendental meditation for 25 years without any lasting benefits. I’ve heard Byron Katie talk about people she did The Work with who have been meditating for 30 years prior to this, and they still attach to thoughts. Then there are all the people who go to vippassana retreats and are still not enlightened. 

I’m not fully sure about this, but that’s how I’ve understood it from these people. If you know differently, please fill me in.

This brings to mind what might be a big difference in perspective. I was meditating for around 20 years before the permanent change / oneness. I had never heard of it (enlightenment), never heard the word “nonduality” prior. I found this forum from googling the experience, trying to see if other people experienced it. Now it seems people are reading about this stuff on the forum and other places and more ‘working towards it’, than simply meditating for the daily benefits. So the mindset is very differenct than mine was, in the sense I actually didnt have an idea meditation was accumulative, and headed to anything “bigger”. There’s pro’s and con’s either way I guess, but it is a weird difference. After the oneness breakthrough, and then learning a lot from other people on the forum, I tried psychedelics. Having experienced what I have at this point, I can’t imagine why anyone wouldn’t just take psychedelics and do the daily practices, while focusing on living the best life they can. I’m not sure though, even if someone heard plenty about nonduality - when it is realized, or “happens” to you - it’s still probably like you never even heard of it.