Qur'anic verse, need explanation.

[Truth Addict]

I'm really interested in this figure (Ibrahim). He's claimed to be one of the greatest grandfathers of Mohammad. And he's enlightened.

Imo, every verse that mentions him is very important.

Any non-dual explanation for this?

[How to be wise]

@Truth Addict I would suggest that you don’t place too much importance to the Quran. It’s not a very clear guide to enlightenment.

[Preetom]

This needs further clarifications on the backstory to understand the context first.

[Truth Addict]

2 hours ago, How to be wise said:

@Truth Addict I would suggest that you don’t place too much importance to the Quran. It’s not a very clear guide to enlightenment.

Enlightenment is everywhere if you know how to look. And I'm familiar with the Qur'an since I was a kid. I want to recontextualize it in a non-dual way, maybe then I'll get a better understanding.

But thank you anyway.

1 hour ago, Preetom said:

This needs further clarifications on the backstory to understand the context first.

I looked it up in the internet for 'tafseer' (scholar explanation), they talked about the other story of Ibrahim when he went to some king known as 'Namrud' and had a debate with him, here's a screenshot:

Namrud claims to give life and cause death, by giving orders to kill or not, equating himself to God.

Ibrahim knows that Allah can actually give life and cause death, but maybe he wasn't certain, or he couldn't understand how.

Also, the actual story of my original post, according to scholars, is that Ibrahim must kill the birds and merge their dead corpses together, and then split the mix in different mountains. So, that he could see how God gives life after death.

Does that help?

[How to be wise]

@Truth Addict Sorry for discrediting the Quran. I was wrong.

Btw, the story of Namrud is unrelated with the first story you showed. They happened at different times.

[Truth Addict]

24 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

@Truth Addict Sorry for discrediting the Quran. I was wrong.

Btw, the story of Namrud is unrelated with the first story you showed. They happened at different times.

I know.

[Preetom]

@Truth Addict

I agree that almost everything can be interpreted in nondual fashion as everything is in the eye of the beholder.

But this particular verse doesn't really give any clear line of interpretation. Enlightenment shows that there is no such thing as life in the first place. Thus the counter part called death automatically becomes invalid.

Maybe this verse is about increasing the conviction and faith of a devotee on God. 

Or another more nondual way of seeing it could be that there is no actual distinction between life and death for Allah. That is why it can turn dead corpses alive again without any real consequences. Thus Allah stays unaffected from the cycle of seeming life and death.

Also it hints the unlimited power of the pure potentiality of Allah which is beyond all reason or cause.

Edited January 18, 2019 by Preetom

[Truth Addict]

@Preetom

Amazing! Thank you 

[Pouya]

@How to be wise i think the Quran as a metaphor book. It's still nice tho but people take it literally.

[Nahm]

He is saying there is infinite intelligence, always present, not birds.

[Aakash]

its saying that the birds will always come back to the source of their life. Know that allah is the mighty and wise source. In my opinion. 

just like you will seek to go back to source yourself, there is no difference between yourself and the birds in this quote. you are both the bird and the human and the infinite in non-dual terms. 

[Truth Addict]

@Nahm

You mean the intelligence of creation? It's a metaphor for Allah's ability to give life? And that everything is alive and intelligent?

[Truth Addict]

@Aakash

Nice! Thank you 

[Nahm]

@Truth Addict 

All there is, is intelligence / Allah / etc / you. Reminds me of the Actuality episode. Saying the birds will come to you from many mountains, invites Ibrahim to realize this is unexplainable. How did the birds know where I was, he might say? It is not possible, yet I witnessed it, just as Allah said. 

How is it there is a hand ‘here?!?!  How in the f*uck is my finger moving!?!? You might say. 

Surely things are not only as they appear. 

Including, and foremost relatively, Ibrahim himself.

When this is realized, there is no more life & death.

?

[Truth Addict]

@Nahm

Man, I love you! Thanks 

[Nahm]

@Truth Addict I love you too!