Views on God

[Angelo John Gage]

Me trying to explain to those stuck in Abrahamic faiths what "god" actually is... You'll notice what is a combination of teachings from Leo, Alan Watts and Marcus Aurelius. 

 

I use a white board and actually draw it all out.

 

What do you guys think?

 

 

Edited January 15, 2019 by Angelo John Gage

[Sockrattes]

Sorry. Massive error:

No buddhist scolar ever said there is a God.

[Angelo John Gage]

I don't think I say in the video that they did.. but i'm saying that what we should call "god" they would call what is

 

[Sockrattes]

I phrased wrong, what i actually wanted to say. My fault.

You said that non-duality is buddhist and then you have tried to encompass God in it.

That's a little petty of me now, but buddhist non-dualism (Mahayana) doesn't have a God. In fact many of them are fighting everyone who uses this terminology..^^

Hinduism or better say Advaita Vedanta or Kashmir Shaivism is non-dualism with God.

 

I know exactly what you want to say because i already know all those terms, and you are not wrong about them. But it is hard to get those fine distinctions you want to make. So i would suggest you should use terms like immanent and transcendent to describe the essence and the localisation of God. I think this way, it is way easier.

[Angelo John Gage]

Indeed. I appreciate the feedback. 

[Sockrattes]

2 minutes ago, Angelo John Gage said:

Indeed. I appreciate the feedback. 

You're welcome. And nice video. I'm still watching. 

[Angelo John Gage]

I think I do clear up what you think I said incorrectly towards the end lol.

[Leo Gura]

@Angelo John Gage A decent explanation of a very tricky topic.

I noticed you saying several times that you "believe" this.

What is your direct experience of God?

If I was shooting a video like this (and I do have this topic planned for the future as a video), I would make sure to stress that God is not a belief, or a theory, or a speculation, but a direct experience which the viewer can have. This is what's most amazing about God: you can realize it for yourself! This is what most people misunderstand. A newbie watching your video would walk away with the idea that what you're talking about it is just a philosophical theory of God. The viewer would think, "Well, how does this guy know? He's just theorizing. This is just his opinion."

It's absolutely critical to plant the seed in the viewer's mind that consciousness of God is a real thing and requires doing concrete practices. Otherwise God forever remains an idea. The whole point of such a video would be to get people to realize that they must start doing the necessary practices.

Other distinctions which might have been useful are realism vs idealism, and esoteric vs exoteric versions of religion. Really what your video was debunking were the exoteric versions of God. All mainstream religions are exoteric. Most religious people don't even know that esoteric religion is possible.

It's a very tricky topic, so you did a decent job.

The tricky thing about God is, it's both deeply personal and impersonal, encompassing every set of attributes.

[Angelo John Gage]

@Leo Gura   thanks for your feedback, I really appreciate that you liked it.

The reason why I say "believe" is because I'm trying to be unbiased in the video, (I say In my opinion, etc) and not act like I know for a fact, even though I personally experienced what "God" is (at least partially): I have done DMT and other psychedelics; so I have seen what probably most of us who have done it have seen. I have been to that green room of infinite eyes; experienced the timelessness of the trip, the vast infinite fractals...I know there is more, but the totality of the absolute infinity is unknowable.

I know I don't have as much experience as you have in this regard; I know you've done entire retreats and way more DMT trips than myself lol (I have no 5-Meo DMT source) but even my one trip I got a glimpse of knowing that there is something within lead me to find your videos and the works of many others to help communicate these ideas.

And you're right, any interlocutor would challenge my absolute statement that "god is real" and ask me to prove it...all I would have is my subjective experience. I know we don't have to prove it to anyone, nor could we (they would have to experience it themselves), but this is why I put a "logical examination" in the title. All we have is logic and language to try to explain things.

My only goals in this video was to let viewers see the other ways to look at God, see the inconsistencies and contradictions within their own religious beliefs, and hopes to help them break from the spell logically, until they go experience it themselves, directly.

Edited January 16, 2019 by Angelo John Gage
spelling

[Toby]

 

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Angelo John Gage said:

The reason why I say "believe" is because I'm trying to be unbiased in the video, (I say In my opinion, etc) and not act like I know for a fact,

I get that.

Then again, it's almost a lie then. Because in fact for you it is more than a belief.

But maybe I'm just splitting hairs here.

The trick when talking about God is that you're damned if you do and damned if you don't. If you say it's just your opinion or belief, that is untrue and gives the wrong impression. If you say that it is Absolute Truth, that makes you sounds like a fundamentalist nutcase, and also gives the wrong impression.

It's like we are afraid to say the truth because we know no one would believe us. So we play coy.

Just food for thought.

[Angelo John Gage]

@Leo Gura  Got it. Thanks brother.

[Forestluv]

12 hours ago, Angelo John Gage said:

All we have is logic and language to try to explain things.

There are post-logical and nonverbal states of being, communication and explanations. Yet most of society has not evolved or developed those levels of consciousness.

I've found that trying to explain the post-rational in rational terms to rationalists is not very effective. A mind needs to be open and willing to explore post-rational areas. 

Most minds are conditioned to focus on the pointer, not to relax into the direct experience of the ineffable nature of what is being pointed to. The words and concepts are the arm and hand - most minds get immersed in trying to make sense of the arm and hand. Human minds become fixated on the arm/hand pointer. The more words and concepts used, the stronger that fixation becomes. I've found it more effective to use the minimal amount of words and concepts and at times sprinkle in some post-rational essence to throw their logical mind off it's game.

[How to be wise]

@Leo Gura I would like to express my gratitude towards you for helping us increase our consciousness and live the best life possible. Thank you very much!

[Garuda]

17 hours ago, Angelo John Gage said:

@Leo Gura  

My only goals in this video was to let viewers see the other ways to look at God, see the inconsistencies and contradictions within their own religious beliefs, and hopes to help them break from the spell logically, until they go experience it themselves, directly.

From a 'Hinduism' point of view I saw several ways to counteract the inconsistencies showed in your video. But it wont get anywhere. 

Even after experiencing God directly they would argue their philosophy  as if its absolute. 

I've noticed all Enlightened beings from India that fall under 'Hinduism' come under 1 absolute GOD but when they express it philosophically its gets all tangled up.

 

[Angelo John Gage]

@Serotoninluv That I understand, my point being is that all we have to communicate that makes any sense between us is logic. I know its impossible for me to totally explain any spiritual experience.

[Joseph Maynor]

On 1/15/2019 at 8:29 PM, Leo Gura said:

It's absolutely critical to plant the seed in the viewer's mind that consciousness of God is a real thing and requires doing concrete practices. Otherwise God forever remains an idea. The whole point of such a video would be to get people to realize that they must start doing the necessary practices.

Why cling to God in the first place? 

Edited January 29, 2019 by Joseph Maynor

[Forestluv]

1 hour ago, Angelo John Gage said:

@Serotoninluv That I understand, my point being is that all we have to communicate that makes any sense between us is logic. I know its impossible for me to totally explain any spiritual experience.

If your audience is Orange and confined to logic, then yes. Once someone reaches Green and higher, all sorts of communication modes start opening up.