How to talk about enlightenment to people who don't see the real value of it?

[Tistepiste]

Well I've been trying to talk about the topic of enlightenment to my partner, but he says stuff such as

"People like to believe in stories, right"

Or just nods but doesn't really seem to catch any of his interest?

My partner is very artistic and very creative. Also very empathic but sometimes I just can't get through him. It's as if he just doesn't believe in anything other than his own direct experience. Which surprises me due to his artistic nature.

But he also suffers a lot, worries often, oftenly about other people but also he feels "lost" in life in general sometimes.

And I feel like this path could help him tremendously but I feel like he is not open to it. What should I do? Just let it be and ignore it? Or try to approach it another way?

Edited January 3, 2019 by Tistepiste

[ajasatya]

6 minutes ago, Tistepiste said:

he just doesn't believe in anything other than his own direct experience

can't you see the value of this? this is gold.

6 minutes ago, Tistepiste said:

But he also suffers a lot, worries often, oftenly about other people but also he feels "lost" in life in general sometimes.

And I feel like this path could help him tremendously but I feel like he is not open to it. What should I do? Just let it be and ignore it? Or try to approach it another way?

consolidate your own meditation practice and invite him sometimes.

don't try to fill his head with your stories. let his own experiences speak for themselves.

focus on meditation only and let go of concepts. this will also help you.

the most honest way to seek enlightenment is by facing your own suffering.

Edited January 3, 2019 by ajasatya

[Tistepiste]

@ajasatya i do see the value of it, while I wrote it, it is very good. But he just doesn't see any reason to *start*.

 

But good idea. I will invite him!

Edited January 3, 2019 by Tistepiste

[Aakash]

Pain, the key to the first ever awakening is pain. Pain on the metaphysical level. the kind of pain that makes you question your very decisions in life and who  you are as a person 

I call this shock induced enlightenment (its what i went through, but is a rare phenonomen in my opinion)

the other kinds of awakening is theory hunting enlightenment.

where you hear of the idea and you take mushrooms and psychadelics 

but from what i've noticed the third is you have to just be very involved with your future and what efffect you want to have after you die 

they mainly subcategorise to any metaphysical questions

[ajasatya]

Just now, Tistepiste said:

@ajasatya i do see the value of it, while I wrote it, it is very good. But he just doesn't see any reason to *start*

then let him be. focus on your own practice. if your practice is solid enough and you actually start to live in a more present state of mind, he'll notice and maybe he'll deliberately invite himself to meditate with you.

[ivankiss]

Instead of trying to talk about enlightenment, if it seems dificult; try being and example of an enlightened being.

Try to shine more light into his direct experience 

New spheres then might be born; a space for you to talk about light, honestly, without forcing anything.

Good luck!

Edited January 3, 2019 by ivankiss

[Preetom]

20 minutes ago, Tistepiste said:

It's as if he just doesn't believe in anything other than his own direct experience.

He would be already enlightened if this was actually the case lol!

Ask him what he knows for sure in life and from where that knowledge came from. Basically, show him over and over again through inquiry that what he calls a rational life is actually a veneer over unquestioned assumptions and beliefs which even he wouldn't know where they came from.
 

The work by Byron Katie can be good place to start

Edited January 3, 2019 by Preetom

[Sockrattes]

36 minutes ago, Tistepiste said:

What should I do? Just let it be and ignore it? Or try to approach it another way?

He will develop interest in it, when he is ready.

Until beginning of 2017 i wasn't interested in spirituality at all. It was just fantasy or sci-fi for me.

That changed in a single day. In retrospect i'm sure that no one and nothing could have convinced me before that day. I think it is a natural maybe even a predetermined process to establish interest in spirituality. So you should stop trying to convince him. It probably won't lead you anywhere.

[Nahm]

There’s a paradox at play, in that those closest to us offer the deepest teaching, yet we try to teach those closest to us - like a mirror so close, so clear, we unknowingly trying to ‘comb the hair’ of the mirror. 

Ask yourself what is to be learned from him. The humility will initially be perplexing, and then quite eye opening. 

Then, yet again paradoxically, once you have embraced and embodied this ‘teaching’ “from him” (as a mirror), he will take notice and be very interested in what transpired, what was transcended, in you. 

[lostmedstudent]

You can never force someone to believe the things you do. Thinking it will help him is only part of your belief systems. I think the best way is to work on yourself and the work you put into enlightenment will show through your actions and relationships and will help him too. If ever he gets interests, then talk to him about it but if he doesn’t seem open right now, let it be 

[Anton Rogachevski]

Hi there,
It's a very good and common question.

I would say, don't talk at all. Be a flower and shine unconditional beauty, and all will be done for you.

[Viking]

after a long time believing in enlightenment i stopped believing it and started inquiring into my direct experience. i have a feeling you believe in enlightenment.

[Jack River]

We can talk about enlightenment with others but there is natural/mechanical tendency to chase that abstraction as well. 

What if we talk about what prevents an enlightened seeing? The what is as it is apparent. 

Could that be another way to go about communication? 

Edited January 3, 2019 by Jack River

[Tistepiste]

@Viking why would you stop believing in it?

[Joseph Maynor]

54 minutes ago, Viking said:

after a long time believing in enlightenment i stopped believing it and started inquiring into my direct experience. i have a feeling you believe in enlightenment.

Good for you.

[Sunil Kumar]

@Tistepiste I suggest not to force too much anyone. They will learn the practices and ask you to share with when they will prepare to. So, its just simple as that. Although its very tempting to share the nuggets with others so that they can also be benefited with that. But that's okay. Let him follow his unique path. 

[Joseph Maynor]

I don't think I've ever personally talked to anyone about Enlightenment who didn’t already know something about it.  It's never actually come up for me.

Edited January 4, 2019 by Joseph Maynor

[outlandish]

4 hours ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

It's a very good and common question.

I would say, don't talk at all. Be a flower and shine unconditional beauty, and all will be done for you.

Agreed. Talk cheapens it anyways. 

There's really no experience aside from direct experience, the rest is abstraction (which is actually just another variety of direct experience of the mind/thought/intellect/etc).

[NoSelfSelf]

You cant because they are not at the level development or really stuck in life to find a way put....

[Aaron p]

@Tistepiste i honestly trust God with these things. Somehow when I do so with situations and issues that arise in my life, things always work out for my good. I allow the holy spirit to energise my being in the direction of success and spiritual success. 

"Trying" isint always the answer. You can communicate with god, you just need to hear his voice a few times to be able to discern when he is speaking. Learn how to read the matrix. Everything is like this. Physical pain is a widely known phenomenon, you experience pain in your back...ask yourself: "what is the message behind this experience?" It may be "STOP MOVING, SOMETHING IS UNCOMFORTABLE." Or the emotion of "sadness"...what might the message be behind that? Depending on the circumstance it may be "I miss my family member that passed away."

In the same way you can let go of your knowledge and human thinking and function from these expressions of god's own presence. Eventually you'll read something and the message will be "DO THIS, it will help." And it'll feel like it's just you...but the thing is, it is just you! You just don't realise who you are yet...the "real you" is the literal god and creator of the universe...so you can trust it and it'll get easier and easier to hear. Just bring your awareness to the situation and allow god's power to flow over your confusion and change the deep vibrations of the foundations of your partners reality. 

"Lean not unto your own understanding, in all your ways acknowledge Him and He shall direct your path."