Do nothing + general meditation questions

[Jamie Universe]

1) if you sneeze or laugh accidently during do-nothing meditation, why does it make you go out of the state? (why is moving bad), and also if I'm not supposed to move, why is breathing ok

2) How am I supposed to know if I'm doing do-nothing right? I know I can wait maybe a couple of years and check to see if theres benefits, but especially with Leo saying about how if your going to be doing it for decades, you want to make sure its right, how can you know if your doing it +full benefits, and not be deluded by some benefits. Or should I even worry about this?

3) If you do do-nothing and mindfulness why are you doing both - what are the benefits

[Truth Addict]

Here's the trick:

What are all spiritual techniques aiming towards?

Death, aka no experience.

How do you achieve death while you are still alive?

Less activities, less stimulations.

Take 'fasting' for example, you deprive yourself from food and/or water so you get closer to death.

Why death? Because, I assume, awareness alone is the death of all experience. Death of the lies so you can see the Truth.

I have a theory, kind of a map.

Thoughts, bodily sensations, movement, and basically anything that creates experience upon awareness. Those are the main obstacles towards realising the Truth.

So, what we're aiming towards through this process is to have the no-experience experience.

Thoughts must stop, body must numb down, movement must stop, etc...

I think that's what psychedelics do after all.

I'm just assuming, need confirmation from more experienced people.

@Leo Gura @Nahm you're the first that came to mind.

Edited December 29, 2018 by Truth Addict

[ground]

4 hours ago, Jamie Universe said:

1) if you sneeze or laugh accidently during do-nothing meditation, why does it make you go out of the state? (why is moving bad), and also if I'm not supposed to move, why is breathing ok

Actually when you sneeze there is a short moment when awareness shines through. If moving is disturbing then the state you are in is artificial. Doing meditation is artificial. Nevertheless the 'I' seems to need that artificiality in the beginning to experience calm and no thought etc. Later when awareness has been registered it is more important to integrate awareness and movement.

 

4 hours ago, Jamie Universe said:

2) How am I supposed to know if I'm doing do-nothing right? I know I can wait maybe a couple of years and check to see if theres benefits, but especially with Leo saying about how if your going to be doing it for decades, you want to make sure its right, how can you know if your doing it +full benefits, and not be deluded by some benefits. Or should I even worry about this?

It is impossible to do do-nothing right as it is impossible to do do-nothing wrong. If there is the sentiment of watching or paying attention during do-nothing then there is doing. So the difficulty of do-nothing is this super-relaxation which is totally alien. This super-relaxation eventually will let awareness shine through as a flash of knowing without there being anybody that knows. But do no wait for it or watch or pay attention whether the flash arises because that would undermine the super-relaxation.

4 hours ago, Jamie Universe said:

3) If you do do-nothing and mindfulness why are you doing both - what are the benefits

Once awareness has been registered one may be mindful of being integrated with it or having slipped out of it to re-integrate with it. Before awareness has been registered mindfulness is important to avoid getting carried way by thought or emotions. So mindfulness is always important and should ideally be permanent.

 

This has been my explanation. If you are following Leo's teaching then you should only follow his explanations and instructions.

 

Edited December 29, 2018 by ground

[Anton Rogachevski]

@Jamie Universe

Hello dear Jamie,

Do nothing is not Strong Determination (SDS), so you can move from time to time. It's basically just sitting and being aware, without any manipulations. It is the most simple of them all. Also meditation, in my opinion, as rule of thumb should not be too complicated.

Please watch more of Leo's videos on meditation (he has many, and also a live guided meditation), it appears you haven't understood it's basis yet, and so obviously you might get lost.

Describe very carefully step by step what you are doing, and we may be of more help.

Also good luck on your journey,
Meditation is an amazing tool!

 

 

 

[peanutspathtotruth]

@Jamie Universe Hey bro! I struggled for a long time with the whole do nothing topic. There are certain things that greatly helped me get there. One is just experience. Do it everyday and keep the basic principles in mind whenever you catch yourself doing something like being swept away by thoughts. 

Regarding the principles the one thing that conceptually helped me the most was the book "True Meditation" by Adyashanti. It's an amazingly lucid take on that topic.

Of course, you have to drop all those ideas when actually being in the meditation. But they might be of great help. 

Also don't forcefully try to always get it right. You will get there

[Nahm]

In addition to what’s been said and the resources posted here,  a perspective...

The average person is not going to take a hero’s dose, due to fear.

Practices can certainly ‘get you’ to nondual realization, like Fred Flintstone’s car technically got him from point a to point b.

 

 

[Jack River]

Do-nothing in this case implies Effort/duality. 

To move away from what-is perpetually(effort-duality)

 

 

 

 

[peanutspathtotruth]

21 minutes ago, Jack River said:

Do-nothing in this case implies Effort/duality. 

To move away from what-is perpetually(effort-duality)

That is true! As far as my own observation goes, this stage is necessary though. One has to go through that (be it for a short or long time) to "arrive at" the letting go of effort. It's not that easily grasped in the mind (not at all actually), so you have to do and do and do until you see that ANY movement and/or involvement in movement is not a non-doing. This is so so subtle until you see it. At least I had to find that out for myself (of course many teachers' pointers helped me greatly) through trial and error. 

It is the same notion of "Just observe what is true in this moment, but don't interfere in any way." that I repeatedly heard in different styles of expression. The understanding of it still gradually gets deeper and deeper the more I dive into this investigation.

I know that guys like Rupert say you can see it right now. And certainly one can. But so often I feel the people asking him those questions can't really go where he thinks it is so easy to arrive by "just seeing it objectively". They say they do but it feels like they don't want to feel stupid and just go along. Mentally it might click but experientally I don't think so. Just my own experience and perception of this whole topic, can be wrong of course  

[ivory]

Out of curiosity did you choose the do-nothing meditation? I'd have picked some type of breath meditation if I were you. With breath meditation you start to see the benefits in a very short period of time.

[Jack River]

10 minutes ago, peanutspathtotruth said:

As far as my own observation goes, this stage is necessary though. One has to go through that (be it for a short or long time) to "arrive at" the letting go of effort

The self is effort. 

The me tends to move within the field of effort(time) because that effort itself sustains the continuity of the me(time). 

There is an inability to stay with what is by a mind seeking security in dependence(abstraction-time) or becoming or not becoming.

Many say effort is necessary or not necessary. That is besides the point/fact. 

The fact/reality is effort is resistance away from what is. 

 

 

Edited December 29, 2018 by Jack River

[Jack River]

Many people say they understand intellectually/mentally, but that isn’t understanding. That is resistance. 

To see this is simple, to simple for a mind in resistance to what is. 

 

Edited December 29, 2018 by Jack River

[peanutspathtotruth]

7 minutes ago, Jack River said:

Many say effort is necessary or not necessary. That is besides the point/fact. 

The fact/reality is effort is resistance away from what is. 

That is the reality, I agree. That does not do anything in the realm of practically grasping this though. I'm not saying effort is necessary per se. But to get what you are describing, you can't just read it and go "Oh yeah, I get it" and your false self dissolves just like that. We have to distinguish between linguistically expressed thoughts that help us understand the nature of reality (what you just did) and an endeavor to help people experientally grasp what is pointed at. It's easy to say all movement is the self, but what should anyone do with this then? I feel you, I had this same insight myself and we had some conversations about it. But for the sake of helping other people out, there must be a way to guide them towards this themselves, besides from dropping facts. "You are infinite." Bam. Are all you readers seeing that now? Just kidding  
 

6 minutes ago, Jack River said:

To see this is simple, to simple for a mind in resistance to what is. 

That is precisely true. That's why one has to see the resistance and let it unfold itself so it can reveal its illusory nature. 

Not trying to say you're wrong, just expanding <3 

[Jack River]

2 minutes ago, peanutspathtotruth said:

But to get what you are describing, you can't just read it and go "Oh yeah, I get it"

No, it’s seen when observed in ourselves. 

[Jack River]

To ask for help is itself resistance (effort). 

No one can help us (guide us). 

It takes a mind free without dependence to see what is. 

[Jack River]

The self will say effort is necessary or not necessary, the self will not move without concluding on either or...this is what binds(enslaves). 

Edited December 29, 2018 by Jack River

[peanutspathtotruth]

Just now, Jack River said:

 

No one can help us (guide us). 

It takes a mind free without dependence to see what is. 

Ultimately, that is also true. But to see THAT, surely people can help other people see it more clearly. 

I mean why else does this forum exist? Why do gurus exist? Yes, in the end, you are your own guru (the inner guru). We really have to see though that this path has different stages and especially in the beginning stages, guidance can be very helpful, don't you think? Even if it can't guide you to absolute truth, it can show you a direction or point out that you're lost in xyz. I don't know if we are talking about two different things here actually  

[Jack River]

To discuss things amongst each other is only possible without effort as well. 

Notice how every step we take is away from what is. Manifests in the form of “help me”, “what should I do”, “how do I” and such. 

Not seeing that by doing so, we get caught in the trap. Trap of duality. 

Edited December 29, 2018 by Jack River

[purerogue]

I will join with video. 

[peanutspathtotruth]

Well said. I wish you a great day my friend. 

[Jack River]

@peanutspathtotruth you as well dude