Can smoking cannabis be apart of my Spiral Dynamics evolution?

[VictorB02]

Preface: I made another post last night about how smoking cannabis makes me feel connected, whole, and loving, and when I'm sober I do not feel this way.

My question is this: If you need to integrate a stage fully before being able to transcend it to move onto the next, how can I ever integrate stage green fully (which I vividly remember Leo saying it includes psychedelics, smoking cannabis, etc..) if I "know" cannabis, psychedelics, etc. are not going to help me in the long run? 

Is smoking cannabis a phase I need to go through and into more in depth, or is this the ego playing tricks? How can I know what is the actuality of the situation?

How can I possibly integrate green if I keep running away from the things I need to integrate because it's the "wise" thing to do? If I keep avoiding weed because I "know" it will not solve my problems?

I realize this is a big paradox. I know cannabis won't solve my problems, but I have reached a point where it seems like to fully integrate stage green, I need to accept weed fully and not run from it, not care about smoking it or not. I remember in Leos video about "True growth vs. fake growth" he talks about how you truly integrate and grow when a problem does not become a problem anymore.

Any advice is appreciated, thank you.

[ivory]

I decided that I wanted to have a healthy relationship with smoking weed. It makes me introspective, but it can also make me feel lazy. So, I only smoke it in the evening after everything I need to do is complete. I don't smoke it to make me feel better or if I'm bored. I like to take a puff, then sit down with a pen and get my thoughts on paper.

 

Does smoking weed make you introspective? Or does it make you feel dull and lazy? Do you smoke it to get a pleasant feeling out of it or perhaps for entertainment? Are you still doing the things you need to do? These are questions you need to ask yourself. Get clear on what a healthy relationship with smoking looks like.

[ajasatya]

@VictorB02 you remind me of myself when i was younger and used to drink alcohol. i would get high and my shyness would disappear like magic. so i said to myself:

i don't want to depend on alcohol to be relaxed and confident.

then i worked towards that goal while sober on the following week. i repeated this loop until i finally had it down.

my advice is always towards depending on very little to be happy. make happiness an easy thing, accessible anytime without the need of external substances/validations. living will be much easier and tasteful, i guarantee.

Edited December 28, 2018 by ajasatya

[zambize]

I think it really depends on the person, while I agree you shouldn't be depending on these things, personally for whatever reason weed just really helps me find things I'm hiding from myself, and in that way is very curative.  You gotta be the judge for yourself on this one I think

[Wisebaxter]

@VictorB02 When you're ready to stop smoking cannabis, if at all, you will stop it. Trying to force this to happen through neurotic tendencies, will only cause more suffering. You're not in control of anything, at least your ego isn't, so using the ego to resist what's happening will make the matter worse. Check out Leo's video on free will vs determinism to get the low down on this. 

There's nothing wrong with smoking cannabis. There's no good or bad, only thinking makes it so. Stop resisting what is and just follow the path that seems right to you for now. Resistance is the thing to avoid. There's nothing to say weed will not help you in the long run. Anything you do will help you in the long run as there is always a lesson you're being taught by the universe. the beauty of it is that there are no wrong moves. If it is a phase, then so be it, only time will tell. 

As for moving up the spiral, I'm a little confused about your train of thought. Are you saying that you think that smoking weed will keep you locked into a stage? Also, are you saying you think weed is a stage green tool or something? So you have to accept that to progress? I wouldn't read so much into weed's potential effect on your journey up the spiral. Your progression will be more based upon how open minded you can be to new ideas, the kind of practices you're doing, your capacity to love unconditionally and to see the bigger picture without judging. Also, I think you can move up the spiral without fully mastering a stage.  You just might not integrate the new stage fully. For example you can be a bit green, a bit orange, a bit turquoise. It's never as simple as saying someone is just one particular stage. 

[VictorB02]

@ivory I agree. I will do some self inquiry and see what I find.

@ajasatya Thanks for your advice! So you drank/smoked on weekends, then tried to implement the following week? Did this system work well?

@zambize I believe you are correct

@Wisebaxter Thank you for this answer. I believe this act of non-doing and following the flow of life is what the call in Zen, Wu-Wei. I am going to try to follow this flow more closely. I will commit to not resisting life. 

What I mean as far as the spiral goes, is if I have to embrace my desire to smoke weed to evolve. But the rest of your post clarified that for me as I see that it is not a big deal and Spiral Dynamics is not so linear as I had previously thought.

[Matt8800]

2 hours ago, VictorB02 said:

Preface: I made another post last night about how smoking cannabis makes me feel connected, whole, and loving, and when I'm sober I do not feel this way.

My question is this: If you need to integrate a stage fully before being able to transcend it to move onto the next, how can I ever integrate stage green fully (which I vividly remember Leo saying it includes psychedelics, smoking cannabis, etc..) if I "know" cannabis, psychedelics, etc. are not going to help me in the long run? 

Is smoking cannabis a phase I need to go through and into more in depth, or is this the ego playing tricks? How can I know what is the actuality of the situation?

How can I possibly integrate green if I keep running away from the things I need to integrate because it's the "wise" thing to do? If I keep avoiding weed because I "know" it will not solve my problems?

I realize this is a big paradox. I know cannabis won't solve my problems, but I have reached a point where it seems like to fully integrate stage green, I need to accept weed fully and not run from it, not care about smoking it or not. I remember in Leos video about "True growth vs. fake growth" he talks about how you truly integrate and grow when a problem does not become a problem anymore.

Any advice is appreciated, thank you.

I cant speak for others but smoking cannabis contributes to my spiritual journey. When it stops being being an asset to my life, Ill stop. Until then, I see no reason to stop.

A good tree bears good fruit. Dont let anyone tell you something that contradicts your direct experience.

[ajasatya]

1 hour ago, VictorB02 said:

@ajasatya Thanks for your advice! So you drank/smoked on weekends, then tried to implement the following week? Did this system work well?

it did work well because i had a crystal clear goal to ditch those crutches. they offered me a vision and it was my job to implement it without them. i quit alcohol in 2 months and weed in less than 3 months.

[VictorB02]

@Matt8800 thank you, I agree with you.

@ajasatya I see, thank you

[ZZZZ]

You don't have to do everything mentioned in a stage to enter that stage (and eventually transcend it). One can have habits at any stage, even if they are explicitly mentioned as being common in one part of the spiral. Think of embodying "stoner culture" more than the habit itself as something that is indicative of stage green, and maybe that will help reframe it for you. Flower power and the hippie movement, not necessarily the consumption of a psychedelic substance. 

Leo uses and promotes psychedelics, but I doubt he is stuck in stage green at this point. 

Edited December 29, 2018 by ZZZZ

[VictorB02]

@ZZZZ thank you for your insight. I get what you mean about the culture vs. actually smoking

[Consilience]

11 hours ago, Wisebaxter said:

@VictorB02 When you're ready to stop smoking cannabis, if at all, you will stop it. Trying to force this to happen through neurotic tendencies, will only cause more suffering. You're not in control of anything, at least your ego isn't, so using the ego to resist what's happening will make the matter worse. Check out Leo's video on free will vs determinism to get the low down on this. 

There's nothing wrong with smoking cannabis. There's no good or bad, only thinking makes it so. Stop resisting what is and just follow the path that seems right to you for now. Resistance is the thing to avoid. There's nothing to say weed will not help you in the long run. Anything you do will help you in the long run as there is always a lesson you're being taught by the universe. the beauty of it is that there are no wrong moves. If it is a phase, then so be it, only time will tell. 

As for moving up the spiral, I'm a little confused about your train of thought. Are you saying that you think that smoking weed will keep you locked into a stage? Also, are you saying you think weed is a stage green tool or something? So you have to accept that to progress? I wouldn't read so much into weed's potential effect on your journey up the spiral. Your progression will be more based upon how open minded you can be to new ideas, the kind of practices you're doing, your capacity to love unconditionally and to see the bigger picture without judging. Also, I think you can move up the spiral without fully mastering a stage.  You just might not integrate the new stage fully. For example you can be a bit green, a bit orange, a bit turquoise. It's never as simple as saying someone is just one particular stage. 

This 100%