theoretical enlightenment VS actual enlightenment

[ivankiss]

Have you noticed the difference?

What are your opinions?

I'd say it is impossible for one not to notice actual enlightenment. It is, however, possible to get lost in a conceptual one.

A "theoretically enlightened" individual, to me, is one who connects concepts in such fashion, that they become one. Nevertheless, the individual stays lost in the entirety of this one concept and is unable to connect the final dot, so to speak. Unable to surrender.

Actual enlightenment are these words right here. I am present with them. I am them.

Actual enlightenment is not weight down by tons of theory and over-conceptualization.

It knows itself as flawless.

Every concept melts away miraculously.

All the theory becomes like an echo of your morning alarm, that rings in your right ear.

It was necessary for you to wake up; but now it's rather irrelevant. Until you go to sleep again.

Actual enlightenment is pure, genuine and proud of it's being. So proud it does not even pay attention to itself. It celebrates in joy and bliss. It is awaken now, after what seemed to be infinity.

It is a newborn.

At this moment, I feel like there are many who are awake with their one eye still closed.

I do not notice many guidelines for those who find themselves in that position. 

I feel like emphasizing this; possibly giving/receiving some useful hints and nudges.

Don't attack thoughts, pls.

Love.

 

Edited December 28, 2018 by ivankiss

[ground]

16 minutes ago, ivankiss said:

It is, however, possible to get lost in a conceptual one.

Especially if one gets involved with this forum

[Rilles]

Enlightenment is

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Aakash]

I think that i have had many theoretical enlightenments in the past, none the less they were awakenings that i could not hold onto for more than a couple of minutes and then i began the rebirth cycle again and circled all the way around until finally you are aware of your true nature. At this point there is no other choice but to denounce "who am i" and even then will rebirth if they have any other metaphysical questions that they want answering. until they understand they are the very thing themselves with no conceptualisation possible. this is actual enlightenment, however, you still have to maintain it and this is the "I am" . Thereafter, you have to let go and even let go of what you are thinking of, so you are only with the now always. The wandering mind get trapped again, but the enlightened one knows there is only one. 

[Aakash]

My point is, you should be able to explain the process, to know the enlightened one. sorry i forgot to write this in there

[ivankiss]

The conceptual one has a need to keep reminding itself it is, in fact, the one.

The actual one has no such need.

It is possible for the conceptual one and actual one to coexist.

This coexistence creates a third reality; in which the I has new qulities, abilities, properties.

The switch is on. The switch is off.

Nothing is controlling it.

The longer the switch is on, the easier to notice when it's off.

[Aakash]

 I have ponder upon your words for quite some time since your post, I am a bit hesitant to say i get it however, it is clear to me i still have some letting go to achieve. 

Thank you 

[Elysian]

As far I can tell enlightenment has a function,  only one function, that I don't ever see mentioned:

To better equip the individual to help others heal, leading to love and unity. You recognize the pain of others as your pain, and because of that are more likely to help them work through it. 

At the deepest level, at least within this universe, the point of existence is to move towards unity. And there is a point, no matter what a nondualist lost in dogma believes. You can experience that point directly. All enlightenment does is help us move towards unity with more ease.

Unfortunately, many beings seek enlightenment before growing enough vibrationally to even recognize it's true purpose. And what's even worse, most enlightened beings (but who is it that's enlightened nondual dogma might chime) operate at a low vibration, making them incapable of even fully comprehending what it is they experienced/experience. Then they go into spiritual circles talking about enlightenment without having any clue what it is they're talking about.

It's like a 5 year old recognizing that Calculus could probably be useful somehow, then trying to explain it's purpose.

Understanding existence on a deeper level requires operating at a higher vibration, and that includes when attempting to understand enlightenment. Because there is actually something to understand about it, even if someone is currently incapable of doing so.

Edited December 29, 2018 by Elysian
Grammar

[Arkandeus]

A week now is as long as a month before activation  

To me new years eve is a loooooooong way, I aint even close yet

There will be oceans of energy before I get there

Edited December 29, 2018 by Arkandeus

[Joseph Maynor]

I notice it now.  It's plain to see.  But I also realize that it's a necessary part of the Path too.  You have to consume something so utterly that you get so satiated with it and bored with it that the Ego backs out of it and gets interested in something else.  But in that you got a growth.  It's like losing a religion is the best way I can describe it.  Losing spirituality even.  All that goes away and everything is exactly as it's always been.  But this is the way we do everything.  We consume everything.  We go into it and then we come out of it.

Edited December 29, 2018 by Joseph Maynor

[Anton Rogachevski]

@Joseph Maynor

I resonate with your words.

It's all about being honest with yourself, as long as it quenches your thirst, drink from the fountain. Intuition is smarter than it appears, because sometimes what seems unreasonable leeds into the most reasonable outcome.

[ivankiss]

The conceptual one has to be complete in it's expression in order to surrender itself fully and become actual.

Look forward. There is nothing behind you. Everything is before you.

Nothing holds space for everything.

The Ego is not supposed to be deconstructed. It is supposed to be built to such an extent, that it becomes it's own and finds eternal peace.

Seizes to appear.

Thoughts, beliefs and emotions should not be denied or avoided. Rather, they should be simply recognized for what they are and be accepted. 

The story shall be written by you. Until it is able to write itself. 

Nothing and everything coexist. Forever.

You cannot change that. It is change itself.

@Joseph Maynor Agreed. Nicely put.

No real "losing" can occur though, from this point of view. That which seems to be lost is actually much more. A nescessary part. An integrated quality; flavour.

It goes unnoticed when there is no one there to notice it. 

Yet it is there. It works it's magic in harmony with the whole.

@Anton Rogachevski True words.

The fountain is there for you to drink from it.

Until you had enough and are no longer thirsty.

Unreasonty leads to reason, indeed. The two then merge and difference is no more.

Only impulse. Will. Passion. Forms and shapes. Eagerness. Peace. Stillness. Love.

@Arkandeus I feel you.

Time is fading out. Merging with the infinite now. 

I dig time though. I get why it's here. I let it do what it's designed for.

@Elysian Enlightenment is the ultimate function, so to speak.

In autenthic light, there is no individual to gain anything. It is a part of the unique expression. The expression needs no pause, to remember what it is. It simply is. Perfect. Flawless. 

Enlightenment is not to be understood as much as it is to be allowed. 

That depends on the unique expression itself and it's purpose, of course.

It may be relevant. 

Seekers may have a tough time understanding that there is nothing to seek.

However, any path is the ultimate, one and only, true path. 

There is a cosmic giggle. 

 

 

 

 

[Elysian]

1 hour ago, ivankiss said:

 

@Elysian Enlightenment is the ultimate function, so to speak.

In autenthic light, there is no individual to gain anything. It is a part of the unique expression. The expression needs no pause, to remember what it is. It simply is. Perfect. Flawless. 

Enlightenment is not to be understood as much as it is to be allowed. 

That depends on the unique expression itself and it's purpose, of course.

It may be relevant. 

Seekers may have a tough time understanding that there is nothing to seek.

However, any path is the ultimate, one and only, true path. 

There is a cosmic giggle. 

This is only true on one level, and is going down the proverbial nondual rabbit hole dogma.

Ironically, there is much deeper truth to this universe. And it appears it's very easy to get stuck in nondual thinking/being at This point in spiritual growth/awakening.

Recognizing oneness, recognizing infinity, recognizing I am'ness, there is much more to the story than these things, and I'm not talking about conceptual knowing. And almost counterintuitively, there is a story, a story of how things came to be, and where we are going. But a certain level of arrogance traps people in nondual dogma. 

"There couldn't possibly be some deeper reason, because X says so, because there isn't anything to be said."

A very slippery slope. Jesus was much more aligned with the true nature of reality than Buddha, alot of insight to be had in that.

Edited December 29, 2018 by Elysian
Grammar

[purerogue]

And this guys is what happens when you let emotions control your perspective, not use them as tool. 

[Elysian]

Only radiating love without blockages, and bringing light to deeper understanding. You're only projecting your own wounds on to what I say.

[WelcometoReality]

22 hours ago, ivankiss said:

I do not notice many guidelines for those who find themselves in that position. 

It can be hard to get them to see that it is not the complete thing. A nice guideline to everyone on the path is that it always goes deeper. Find the humbleness in those words. Because if you think you got it you are deceiving yourself.

[ivankiss]

@WelcometoReality There is nothing to get.

There is nobody who could get anything.

Yet there certainly is a one.

Mapping out new territory is key.

Be it illusory or real. 

I may not be. But love sure is.

Silent and humble.

[purerogue]

13 minutes ago, Elysian said:

Only radiating love without blockages, and bringing light to deeper understanding. You're only projecting your own wounds on to what I say.

It is easy to get lost in emotions, they have their place, I think you have some childhood trauma that makes you cling to love as only liberator.

[ivankiss]

@purerogue Define "love". Pls.

Edited December 29, 2018 by ivankiss

[purerogue]

11 minutes ago, ivankiss said:

@purerogue Define "love". Pls.

Definition has nothing to do with this, I can't define any emotions, only to some degree, there is infinite range of emotions,feelings. 

Edited December 29, 2018 by purerogue