Is Enlightment Permanent or Not?

[SQAAD]

I am NOT talking just about enlightment experiences.

 

But instead let's say you suddenly become enlightened and it it remains that way for weeks or even months. Is it possible after this to "lose" that non dual state?

 

What's your experience with this ?

[Hellspeed]

Is permanent if you are willing to go with the change, otherwise it will settle in a dormant blisfull state and one will live at most 100 years. 

[SoonHei]

@SQAAD

Think of it this way...

Even with your dualist POV of the world. A world where you were BORN.

Every since your oldest memory which you can recall... has there ever been a pause in experiencing life? Your awareness is present in each passing moment.

Enlightenment is just the realization of this ever-present awareness moment by moment. 

So yes, awareness is always permanent.

But you may not be always watching from the ultimate POV.

[Tistepiste]

@Hellspeed Ehm. What do you mean one will live at most 100 years, implying immortal for enligtenment. It's not as if you're enlightened your body doesn't age

Edited December 25, 2018 by Tistepiste

[ground]

4 hours ago, SQAAD said:

I am NOT talking just about enlightment experiences.

 

But instead let's say you suddenly become enlightened and it it remains that way for weeks or even months. Is it possible after this to "lose" that non dual state?

 

What's your experience with this ?

It is not a matter of losing. Once you are enlightened what may be judged as 'losing' by non-enlightened ones isn't 'losing' from the perspective of enlightened ones.

[SBB4746]

From a enlightened perspective, you were never not enlightened, you just become aware that this is the case. It’s a deep understanding of how your mind keeps you in delusion. 

Of course you will never understand this when your in the egoic trance so don’t waste time looking for an answer to your question. 

[Enlightenment]

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In the course of reaching out to PNSE individuals, the research project attracted 17 individuals who claimed that they formerly experienced PNSE. The range of persistency reported was from 1 year to 23 years.

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Three of these individuals reported loss of persistency due to brain injury or illness. Nine of the individuals reported losing PNSE during an extremely stressful time in their lives. The other five did not have any specific event or occurrence that explained it.

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Virtually all of the participants initially expressed the belief that ‘true’ PNSE could never be lost. They stated that normal experience could obscure it, but that PNSE would always be present as the foundation of experience. Many of them believed this was the case for everyone, not just themselves. However, participants who personally knew someone who had lost PNSE were more likely to accept that it could happen to them, as were participants who had read or heard of accounts of this occurring.

 

[Hellspeed]

2 hours ago, Tistepiste said:

@Hellspeed Ehm. What do you mean one will live at most 100 years, implying immortal for enligtenment. It's not as if you're enlightened your body doesn't age

There is a way that the body will not age, but you will think is false because 99.9% believes the same  

 

[Tistepiste]

@Hellspeed so why does Eckhart Tolle age like a normal person?

It's not because 99.99% believes the same.  In that way you can argument anything to be true.

"I'm superman, but I know you won't believe me because 99.99% doesn't anyways 'but trust me ;)'"

 

There's many enlightened folks you can follow and I have yet to see anyone that doesnt age

Edited December 26, 2018 by Tistepiste

[purerogue]

22 minutes ago, Tistepiste said:

@Hellspeed so why does Eckhart Tolle age like a normal person?

It's not because 99.99% believes the same.  In that way you can argument anything to be true.

"I'm superman, but I know you won't believe me because 99.99% doesn't anyways 'but trust me ;)'"

 

There's many enlightened folks you can follow and I have yet to see anyone that doesnt age

 Enlightenment has nothing to do with your body aging, but there probably are ways you can extend your life span trough techniques that give access to control your body functions, some people say it is possible to swap bodies, but again it is technique which might be true , might not, have not seen any proof of it. 

 

 

[Joseph Maynor]

Yeah it’s permanent.  Enlightenment Work has a path to it, but once you get to a certain attainment, it becomes permanent.  And that attainment has nothing to do with theory.  It’s something that the theory helps bring about in you.  Paradoxically, people stuck in Enlightenment theory are not quite there.  The pendulum needs to swing into theory and then out of theory with Enlightenment Work.  It’s when the pendulum swings out of theory and you see that your Enlightenment remains without the theory that you start to be able to get what Enlightenment really is and how Non-Egoic Personal Development mediates and complements Egoic Personal Development.

Edited December 26, 2018 by Joseph Maynor

[Tistepiste]

@purerogue Well he claims it is, since the topic is about enlightenment

[clouffy]

@Joseph Maynor how do you respond to the idea that "englightenment is a practice/ spiritualitiy is like a muscle", that you have to train it in order to maintain some kind of mental clarity. i find that to be true. otherwise we won't be discussing spirituality in so much depth if an "instant" guarantees permanence

but i do agree that "catching a glimpse" of what it's like to be enlightened, or just a visceral reaction to being able to see things clearly, is enough to get your spirits "hooked" to the path to enlightenment, haha

[Hellspeed]

On 26.12.2018 at 0:00 PM, Tistepiste said:

@Hellspeed so why does Eckhart Tolle age like a normal person?

It's not because 99.99% believes the same.  In that way you can argument anything to be true.

"I'm superman, but I know you won't believe me because 99.99% doesn't anyways 'but trust me ;)'"

 

There's many enlightened folks you can follow and I have yet to see anyone that doesnt age

Because Eckhart Tolle and the majority of "realized" individuals, is just that, a realization, the awakening of the mind. Right hand path awakened folks, Egoic Enlightenment. 

Wanna see someone bypasses aging? You are reading it now.  

I know this seems bullshit for the majority, but who cares after he/she discovered it? hahahaha

The mob wants proof, and the awakened will just laugh.

Edited December 27, 2018 by Hellspeed

[Tistepiste]

@Hellspeed well, that's just empty words man.. can't just say those things and not show anything

[Forestluv]

@SQAAD I would be mindful of creating an “enlightenment story”. This can create expectations and a sense of something to be acheived. I.e. an assumption that some type of event happens to a person.

Perhaps shift the original question and contemplate “Is what is permanent or not?”. 

[Hellspeed]

2 hours ago, Tistepiste said:

@Hellspeed well, that's just empty words man.. can't just say those things and not show anything

Cannot be showen, only experienced it or by initiation. 

What do you want me to show you? How i use Kundalini and Chakras and rejuvenate? Wanna see grass growing?  

[Anton Rogachevski]

Is an apple always a fruit?

Edited December 27, 2018 by Anton Rogachevski

[Tistepiste]

@Hellspeed actually, yes

[Aakash]

does wind need to know that it's moving, for it to know its wind?