Duality in Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing

[nado]

Hi,

"Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing" recently caught my attention and it's just bothering me how it smells of duality. Has anyone been able to understand it from a non-dual perspective?

Cheers!

Edited December 25, 2018 by nado

[cetus]

@nado That was the words Jesus spoke when hung on the cross. Maybe the message for humanity was that they were living a life of duality. Killing the flesh will never kill truth.

[Arhattobe]

Because Jesus wasn’t a non dual weirdo. He was beyond the traditional confines of non duality. Buddha, Jesus, Guru Nanak, Krishna all emphasised dharma. 

But now a bunch of dudes have some basic awakening. Do some psychedelics and think their so advanced.

A bunch of nihilistic, deluded, psychedelic induced highs masquerading as enlightenment.

There is sooo much more to life. To reality. 

 

Edited December 25, 2018 by Arhattobe

[Anton Rogachevski]

@Arhattobe Based on what I see, there's resentment in you towards ignorance. Any resentment, even if based on reality, is a hindrance of the love within you. Learn to love ignorance to death. Also forgive me for being frank : )

Surprisingly enough that's just what jesus tried to express in his famous words.

All is love, all is god's will, it's all ok, forgive the ignorant for they are the left hand of god. 

Edited December 25, 2018 by Anton Rogachevski

[nightrider1435]

@Anton Rogachevski We see these bodies and not this unconditional love. It takes effort on the minds part to align with this, we become so hardwired against it. 

[Arhattobe]

@Anton Rogachevski if you loved ignorance you would try to make it see reason.

I have been in what you guys call enlightenment for years and have seen beyond that. Grown so much after that point.

I am not here to learn, and sadly I realise very few will be affected and see reason due to my presence here. Due to many reasons. Yet I am still here, Precisely because I care. 

 

Edited December 25, 2018 by Arhattobe

[Anton Rogachevski]

@Arhattobe

Deep spiritual cleansing, which is what I'm talking about is way more important than enlightenment.

Also growing yourself up stages.

I see by your words that you have much work to do on humility, acceptance, being loving, and openmindedness. 

The very saying: "I'm not here to learn." Is extremely alarming, full of arrogance and ignorance.

Again please tell me if I'm being too frank. Because I see you are sincere and really want to look at things.

[Arhattobe]

@Anton Rogachevski You misunderstand me. My words, their meaning, my aim, and person.

[Anton Rogachevski]

1 minute ago, Arhattobe said:

@Anton Rogachevski You misunderstand me. My words, their meaning, my aim, and person.

I sure hope so, good luck on your journey!

[Matt8800]

5 hours ago, nado said:

Hi,

"Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing" recently caught my attention and it's just bothering me how it smells of duality. Has anyone been able to understand it from a non-dual perspective?

Cheers!

@nadoThe New Testament was written almost 100 years after Jesus was believed to live. 

Although a lot of people like to say that Jesus was an enlightened, non-dual teacher, there is no evidence of that. In reality, there is no evidence he said anything attributed to him.

I think people like to say that Jesus was some kind of great teacher because it makes them feel more tolerant of other people's sacred delusions.

Edited December 25, 2018 by Matt8800

[Hellspeed]

@nado I don't know. That being the reason all comes to me when i don't pay attention out there. 

[Leo Gura]

6 hours ago, nado said:

"Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing"

Lol

That is the epitome of the nondual perspective.

[nado]

47 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Lol

That is the epitome of the nondual perspective.

It might just be the phrasing tripping me up, but both "Father" and "them" seem to point to something separate from the speaker... Anyways I'm glad you see it as nonduality, I'll ponder it more.

[nado]

1 hour ago, Matt8800 said:

@nadoThe New Testament was written almost 100 years after Jesus was believed to live. 

Although a lot of people like to say that Jesus was an enlightened, non-dual teacher, there is no evidence of that. In reality, there is no evidence he said anything attributed to him.

I think people like to say that Jesus was some kind of great teacher because it makes them feel more tolerant of other people's sacred delusions.

Yes, I'm with you on the first 2 paragraphs. Old texts are like the telephone game, but they can still point towards points of interest.

I don't know what to think of the third paragraph, no opinion.

Edited December 25, 2018 by nado

[lmfao]

7 hours ago, nado said:

"Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing" 

Amen

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, nado said:

It might just be the phrasing tripping me up, but both "Father" and "them" seem to point to something separate from the speaker... Anyways I'm glad you see it as nonduality, I'll ponder it more.

If you bring a dualistic attitude to it, it will appear so to you.

But you could also not do that.

[stevegan928]

All language is duality. Notice how calling something non-dual distinguishes it from things that are dual, notice how I've done that in this very post.  

[now is forever]

why isn’t it: mother forgive them for they do not know what they are doing? or mother forgive them as they know what they are doing? - there are other ways stepping into the reflection of this sentence in a nondual direction, but this is one that’s often not the next one to think about.

Edited December 26, 2018 by now is forever

[Shadowraix]

"The Principle of Gender (see Lesson I. and other lessons to follow) is manifested on all planes of life, material mental and spiritual. But, as we have said before, "Gender" does not mean "Sex" sex is merely a material manifestation of gender. "Gender" means "relating to generation or creation." And whenever anything is generated or created, on any plane, the Principle of Gender must be manifested. And this is true even in the creation of Universes.

Now do not jump to the conclusion that we are teaching that there is a male and female God, or Creator. That idea is merely a distortion of the ancient teachings on the subject. The true teaching is that THE ALL, in itself, is above Gender, as it is above every other Law, including those of Time and Space. It is the Law, from which the Laws proceed, and it is not subject to them. But when THE ALL manifests on the plane of generation or creation, then it acts according to Law and Principle, for it is moving on a lower plane of Being. And consequently it manifests the Principle of Gender, in its Masculine and Feminine aspects, on the Mental Plane, of course.

This idea may seem startling to some of you who hear it for the first time, but you have all really passively accepted it in your everyday conceptions. You speak of the Fatherhood of God, and the Motherhood of Nature--of God, the Divine Father, and Nature the Universal Mother-- and have thus instinctively acknowledged the Principle of Gender in the Universe. Is this not so?

But, the Hermetic teaching does not imply a real duality--THE ALL is ONE--the Two Aspects are merely aspects of manifestation. The teaching is that The Masculine Principle manifested by THE ALL stands, in a way, apart from the actual mental creation of the Universe. It projects its Will toward the Feminine Principle (which may be called "Nature") whereupon the latter begins the actual work of the evolution of the Universe, from simple "centers of activity" on to man, and then on and on still higher, all according to well-established and firmly enforced Laws of Nature. If you prefer the old figures of thought, you may think of the Masculine Principle as GOD, the Father, and of the Feminine Principle as NATURE, the Universal Mother, from whose womb all things have been born. This is more than a mere poetic figure of speech-- it is an idea of the actual process of the creation of the Universe. But always remember, that THE ALL is but One, and that in its Infinite Mind the Universe is generated, created and exists."

~ The Kyballion

Hopefully this excerpt will clear it up for you.

[Shadowraix]

21 hours ago, Arhattobe said:

if you loved ignorance you would try to make it see reason.

This is a leap you are making in resistance to ignorance.

You can't force growth.

Ignorance is only a bad thing that must be changed if you want it to be that - or you could see ignorance as appropriately serving its purpose in infinity.