2 Stage Green Women Beheaded

[Fairy]

2 Scandinavian women , what you would consider '' stage green people '' on the spiral dynamics were beheaded in Morocco this week while camping in the outdoors. A couple of men waited until night time to sneak into their tents to then brutally behead the two women with big machetes.

What can stage green people do against this? Stage green is too open, too trusting and too loving that it forgets that reality can be an extremely dangerous place. Stage Green people seem to forget that there's stage Red people that exist in every corner of the world waiting to do evil.

This is why stage orange is extremely resistant towards moving to stage green. Stage orange is mostly about maximizing the SELF's ability at survival through materialism while stage green is the opposite of that, and i strongly believe that stage green should only be transitioned with great caution. It's too big of a leap for only a 1 stage transition.

This is trend that just keeps repeating itself over and over again, we keep seeing stage orange people transition to stage green and then those people go in remote dangerous locations wanting to spread their love and happiness and philosophy of life and they end up getting killed.

The answer would be that most people in North America/Europe never actually went through stage Beige/Purple/Red, they immediately started off as a stage orange person so they never got to learn and implement the lessons of the stages below it and therefor are ignorant.

Those 2 Scandinavian Women were born into a stage green environment , this is what they knew their entire lives. As for the killers, they were born in stage red and this is all they know.

* Leo is too hard on stage orange, i wonder why he never covered stage purple & red in his video series on spiral dynamics. His work could potentially put a lot of people in physical danger. If he wanted to go into spiral dynamics he should have covered all the stages and not have started with stage blue.

Here below is the article of the incident and the NSFW video of the event. Actually analyze the event and take your precautions stage green people! Implement all the previous stages lessons and move carefully! The world is a dangerous place!

 

Article :

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6504783/Bodies-2-Scandinavian-women-Morocco.html

Video :

https://files.catbox.moe/pad10b.mp4

Edited December 20, 2018 by Fairy

[Cepzeu]

following

[Emerald]

First off, if a person is in stage Green, they have already integrated Orange and all the stages prior to it... unless of course they are reacting against it.

But more-so, how does deciding to go camping equal gullibility? Unless, Morocco is known for women being killed while camping, it doesn't really seem fair to characterize that as gullibility.

I mean, bad things happen all the time. You can't stop living just because there could be murderers everywhere. 

There's always a chance that bad things could happen, but to hide away from the world just because of this takes all the joy out of living.

Edited December 20, 2018 by Emerald

[TheAvatarState]

@Fairy Wow. This is such a misuse of spiral dynamics. It's apparent that you don't know what it is or how to correctly apply it. 

Two Scandinavian girls went camping in Morocco and got their throats slit. What does "being green" (also an assumption) have to do with this? Do orange people not go camping in Morocco? 

"What can green people do about this?" Really? I can see the green in you, who's morally repulsed by this act, and your tendencies to freak out and protest about things you know nothing about... Spiral dynamics tells us there's nothing green CAN do about it, and that it's just a fact of life. Fighting violence only leads to more violence. 

And Leo is somehow responsible for misinformation?!?! Because he didn't waste his time going over purple and red, which are much less relevant? That's up to the viewer to educate himself. Come on now.... Lmaooo

[Cepzeu]

Its not a matter of them being gullible, its a matter of them being naive. As OP mentioned, the girls had no experience of anything but stage green, for the sake of the discussion.

I was thinking about a similar topic yesterday, which was the refugee influx into European countries.

From a stage Blue/Orange perspective: There is an influx of uneducated savages who are breeding like rabbits and raping people in the street, and are asking the government for money, which the taxpayers are paying for.

From a stage Green perspective: There is an influx of victims of war and violence and we need to provide them with love and shelter. They are victims of oppressors who started the war there and we, as a county with more resources should share them with the oppressed.

From a stage Yellow perspective: There is an influx of Purple/Red/Blue victims of violence into predominantly Blue/Orange/Green countries. Where there is a match in level, say Blue refugees into a Blue/early Orange city there is potential for a "my religion is superior" conflict. Where there is influx into an Orange or Green city there is potential for a value conflict to arise. 

We should aim to raise the consciousness of everyone but the risk is that the mismatch in values between Red/Blue and Orange/Green could lead to an ego backlash, preventing transition to and through Green. 

Like Leo said, the stage of the culture is a big driver for individuals. When you dilute an Orange/Green (entering worldcentric) society with Red/Blue (ethnocentric) there can be a regression back from green into Orange as the ego gets threatened. 

It's important to help the refugees but also prevent an ego backlash from the people living there.

I personally don't live in Europe anymore so I am free to armchair philosophise. But from friends and family living in Germany and Poland I can see that they do have backlash against this. Germans because they sway towards Orange ("why are there refugees in MY neighbourhood, breeding like rabbits, my taxes give them free money") and Polish around the Blue/Orange stage ("why are there so many Muslims and blacks on the streets")

Even though I can look at it from this perspective, I can predict the parts of me that are Orange would ring bells more, if there was an influx of refugees into my city. 

The question is how do we evolve both groups, while limiting a collective ego backlash.

[Cepzeu]

I just want to point out that, while the OP may be misguided in their original post, lets not attack them for it. They are a new member and we don't want to alienate them from a forum that can help them and everyone else grow

 

[Fairy]

1 hour ago, Winter said:

This thread is a great example of misuse of spiral dynamics.

I do not believe so, feel free to explain why you think so if you would like to point out something.

The same thing seems to apply to people of all walks in life. Steve Jobs, a cutthroat stage orange materialist who was only focused on progress and improvement suddenly tried to move to stage green when he felt ill, declined stage orange medical treatment and tried juice fasts and other holistic approaches but it was too late, he lead his entire life stuck in this one stage and died because of this.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/apple/8841347/Steve-Jobs-regretted-trying-to-beat-cancer-with-alternative-medicine-for-so-long.html

 

Most people get into spirituality because of major issues, otherwise most humans naturally peak at orange in this current era. Green is still a very new thing. Most of the green stuff is banned by the government. Stage green has to be the most difficult stage to actualize.

[Forestluv]

@Fairy Stage Green has embodied Orange. Green can utilize Orange-level modes such as logic and science. Green also adds in modes such as cultural relativism, empathy, intuition etc.

After one learns Calculus, they can still use Algebra.

[DnoReally]

1 hour ago, Winter said:

This thread is a great example of misuse of spiral dynamics.

this

/thread

[Leo Gura]

Guess what? You can be killed at any time by anyone anywhere, regardless of what stage you are.

[Quicksilver]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Guess what? You can be killed at any time by anyone anywhere, regardless of what stage you are.

Not for the same reasons and not in the same way. 

OP is right to point out that this killing is culturally motivated and had a lot to do with spiral dynamics. 

[Leo Gura]

@Quicksilver 3rd world countries definitely come with more dangers, since they are by definition less conscious, less openminded, and operating more from base survival needs.

A Washington Post journalist was dismembered in a Turkish embassy recently. So yeah... watch your ass in underdeveloped places.

[Quicksilver]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

@Quicksilver 3rd world countries definitely come with more dangers, since they are by definition less conscious, less openminded, and operating more from base survival needs.

A Washington Post journalist was dismembered in a Turkish embassy recently. So yeah... watch your ass in underdeveloped places.

Not just 3rd world countries. 

The general lesson here is watch your ass around stage red (or red-blue) and below people and communities. Especially around those who don't consider you "one of their own". 

[CreamCat]

10 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

@Fairy Stage Green has embodied Orange. Green can utilize Orange-level modes such as logic and science. Green also adds in modes such as cultural relativism, empathy, intuition etc.

After one learns Calculus, they can still use Algebra.

Many people have lower stages underdeveloped. For example, when Orange people graduate Orange into Green, they do so without properly integrating Orange. I can feel that I haven't properly integrated Beige, Purple, Red, and Blue.

Edited December 21, 2018 by CreamCat

[Angelite]

True. Don't be a fool. Mind your safety wherever you're at. Know when to draw a line between being open minded and defending your safety/your values. 

But Leo, what is ISIS really? Did they genuinely believe what they're doing is right? Or is it intentional? ?

 

 

Morocco is known for it's vibrance and beauty. Rich in culture. With beautiful people. I haven't been there, but it's on my wishlist. It has been fine all these while.....

 

I went to a few middle eastern countries this year. I did went to a war conflict country, but we are guided by the locals. It's on the safe side. Stayed for a few weeks. It's a beautiful and profound experience. The locals are kind to us. And we visited ancient buildings that are more than 2000years old. But I don't know if it is still safe now. Beware of the war area though...

Then we went to Dubai, on the surface it might seems like an orange country. But actually, the population consist of mostly immigrant who works there, not that many Dubai locals, the rest are tourist who went there for leisure and shopping....

Then we went to Oman. I think it is the best country i've ever went to.... Oman is the epitome of true balance......the manifestation of real Islam. 

And lastly, I lived in Egypt once in my early childhood. It was really fun and vibrant. But be smart.

Especially if you're a tourist from the west. Egyptians are really fun to be with, but you gotta be smart. 

I miss Egypt....

 

Another thing I would like to remind, wherever you are(especially if it's a country that is foreign to you) make sure that you are accompanied by a man. In the middle east/india especially. It is part of the culture there, they respect you more. (some unethical guys might see u as vulnerable if you're alone). 

But don't get me wrong, most of the places that i've been to, it is safe.I do explore alone sometimes. But don't be totally mindless either.

 

Btw, Asia is fine.....

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 21, 2018 by Angelite

[brugluiz]

Green people can have Orange stage underdeveloped. At least it's what I understood with Leo's explanations. I have the impression there are some people assuming that, in order to be Green, you need to embody Orange at first.

[Angelite]

I actually couldn't categorize people in terms of the spiral. Maybe on the surface level, but as I tried to go deeper, it is not possible. Everyone is different really...uniquely different.

Even society at large....maybe it is just me who haven't understand the spiral.

For example, do you categorize a sage who is very rich and successful, while being spiritually developed a stage orange? But this person had the values of green too. 

Or aborigin people who are open to new ideas but are less educated as blue? 

Is spiral dynamic a tool for measuring someone's values & fears or the level of open mindedness? 

What about respect? It can make a big difference no matter what colour in the spiral a person is. There are cultural aspects too. Any colour from the spiral can be rich in culture. 

I think I can understand the complexity of every groups/ individual as a whole, but couldn't put them into categorization. Idk~

 

Edited December 21, 2018 by Angelite

[Forestluv]

@CreamCat @brugluiz

Yes, the model allows that individuals are a mix of stages along various developmental lines. Thus, individuals are said to be “centered” in a stage for each developmental line. 

As one moves up the spiral, ther is a maturation process. For example, beliefs that mythical stories literally happened dissolve as the person perceives more rationally. As well, values and motivations mature from to include egocentric to ethnocentric to world-centric. There is an expansion of views, community etc. 

It’s not like all preceding lessons and skills are rejected and discarded during the maturation process. Green still sees value in having laws, Green still uses bimodal and ligical thinking modes, Green can still value science as a tool to help humanity and the globe (e.g. global warming). 

Developing into a healthy Green that has embodied lower stages takes maturity, learning and effort. Someone doesn’t take a Yoga class and suddenly transform into Green during a triangle pose. It takes years of development.

As well, Green generally still has conflict, holds onto their perspective as “right” and is prone to demonizing lower stages as the root of problems. It’s not until the integral stages in yellow in which one can take a more objective meta view of the entire spiral. 

[brugluiz]

25 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

@CreamCat @brugluiz

Yes, the model allows that individuals are a mix of stages along various developmental lines. Thus, individuals are said to be “centered” in a stage for each developmental line. 

As one moves up the spiral, ther is a maturation process. For example, beliefs that mythical stories literally happened dissolve as the person perceives more rationally. As well, values and motivations mature from to include egocentric to ethnocentric to world-centric. There is an expansion of views, community etc. 

It’s not like all preceding lessons and skills are rejected and discarded during the maturation process. Green still sees value in having laws, Green still uses bimodal and ligical thinking modes, Green can still value science as a tool to help humanity and the globe (e.g. global warming). 

Developing into a healthy Green that has embodied lower stages takes maturity, learning and effort. Someone doesn’t take a Yoga class and suddenly transform into Green during a triangle pose. It takes years of development.

As well, Green generally still has conflict, holds onto their perspective as “right” and is prone to demonizing lower stages as the root of problems. It’s not until the integral stages in yellow in which one can take a more objective meta view of the entire spiral. 

Thank you, @Serotoninluv!

I really thought that being Green was more about open-mindedness and values. If a person is open-minded to embrace Green concepts, she's more about Green. I don't know how much effort it takes to become Green, but an Orange guy would need to put his efforts onto the right things in order to evolve to Green. Blind effort would teach him/her nothing.

That's probably why there are many psychiatrists and doctors stuck in Orange mentality. They had put a lot of effort on their Orange paradigm that they can't open their minds to go to another level.

Now I wonder if this effort idea is really true. Is it more about open-mindedness or more about effort and hard work? Interesting, right?

Edit: Jordan Peterson is an example of a person who built his entire life around Blue and Orange concepts and still can't evolve to another level. Jim Carrey, on the other hand, achieved a deeper level of understanding about spirituality.

Edited December 21, 2018 by brugluiz

[Forestluv]

@brugluiz Good points. Open-mindedness is essential to mature into each new stage.

By saying “effort”, I don’t mean a strained/fored type of effort like going on a diet and forcing yourself to eat foods you don’t like. Rather, the effort of engaging in growth practices that might be uncomfortable at times. 

There is an intellectual Green developmental line, yet also other lines such as emotional and spiritual development. Imo, one needs to actually engage in practices to develop these lines. For example, an orange-level westerner may immerse themself in a third world village for three months. Or, an upper-orange man may open up, become vulnerable and share an insecurity with his girlfriend (and perhaps even cry - gasp!). Or a psycology student entrenched in theory might volunteer with patients in a psychiatric unit and connect with the human emotions associated with psychosis. It takes openness as well as effort to engage in such activities.