Zigzag Idiot and the ladder of Objective Reason

[Zigzag Idiot]

6 minutes ago, tsuki said:

You are not cringeworthy at all. I find that you are one of the most genuine people in here and I enjoy your company tremendously.
In fact, I kind of look up to you and this is why I wanted to comment. The parts that I underscored sound like you are reacting to your past that you could work through. Like you are protecting something.

This is not the place from your past. Nobody can hurt you if you integrate what you now consider flaws.

Thank you. You're very kind.

A part of me or maybe rather a part of my shadow comes from not really developing a healthy stable personality as a young adult. I sometimes observe how this has created an obstruction in work on myself. Trying to transcend an unstable personality instead of transcending a healthy personality. Hence a lot of integration that should have taken place earlier in life. But I also feel like it's ok and that in a lot of things, integration comes more easily later in life (sometimes not) but in our relative existence, there are two sides of a coin and a price to pay, so to speak.

Your observations are accurate in that I'm guarded about a variety of issues related to the past. And I agree that more thourghly integrating issues connected to shadow help stability and capacity to have basic trust. I'm a work in progress,,,, 

[tsuki]

21 minutes ago, Zigzag Idiot said:

Your observations are accurate in that I'm guarded about a variety of issues related to the past. And I agree that more thourghly integrating issues connected to shadow help stability and capacity to have basic trust. I'm a work in progress,,,, 

@Zigzag Idiot I was hoping to invite you to open up, but you chose agreeableness instead. 
I'll take it as a no and not press any further. If you ever feel like it, I'm here for you.

Edited March 28, 2019 by tsuki

[Zigzag Idiot]

@Marc Schinkel Thank you. It's nice to be able to make connections and relate with others here.

@tsuki In addition to being a slow thinker, My spontaneity is better as the day goes on and after I have satisfied my morning coffee addiction. There's a good chance I'll open up later after reflecting some. If an issue is on your mind, press away,,, ??

I appreciate the feedback!

[tsuki]

9 minutes ago, Zigzag Idiot said:

@tsuki In addition to being a slow thinker, My spontaneity is better as the day goes on and after I have satisfied my morning coffee addiction. There's a good chance I'll open up later after reflecting some. If an issue is on your mind, press away,,, ??

I appreciate the feedback!

@Zigzag Idiot Still agreeable. My wife is like that, but much less skillful than you are.
When I'm trying to touch her shadow, it looks like she spreads thin, like a person that is stretched across the whole room.
You sound like that when you're nice sometimes. Are you sure that you're not type 9?

You are not a slow thinker, stop putting that spell on yourself to show humility.

[Zigzag Idiot]

@tsuki 6 goes to 3 when under stress and operates out of 9 in security. I feel like my statement of being a slow thinker is accurate. Deliberate may be a better description. Deliberate like a mountain goat. A mountain goat who abstracts,,,,

[tsuki]

@Zigzag Idiot Oh, now we're talking . Now I get it. Thanks.

[tsuki]

1 hour ago, Zigzag Idiot said:

Deliberate like a mountain goat. A mountain goat who abstracts,,,,

@Zigzag Idiot I think that ambiguity can be weaponized by idiots.

[Zigzag Idiot]

4 minutes ago, tsuki said:

@Zigzag Idiot I think that ambiguity can be weaponized by idiots.

Idiots who practice the Art of Controlled Folly.

[Zigzag Idiot]

 

Just discovered and began watching,,,,

 

 

[Wisebaxter]

On 23/03/2019 at 1:44 PM, Zigzag Idiot said:

Thanks! @Wisebaxter

Yes, investigating this revealed that snorting it produces a long trip. Next time I would like to try smoking it so it's just an intense 20 minute trip. 

There are several factors which made it a somewhat of a bad trip. Uncertainty and doubt for one. At the time I didn't even know it was Dmt. The friend of a friend who gave it to me just said "it's a synthesized mushroom from the Middle East". Thinking, what the hell, I'll give it a try, I was really too cavalier about it all. Even though I knew about dmt from being a fan of Terrence McKenna Youtubes, it wasn't until after the trip that I found out what it was. So there was this complete uncertainty about what I was getting into. Also, in a weird synchronicity, the friend I asked to babysit me, through an extremely unfortunate event in timing kind of turned against me in a way or so I thought,,, yes, but not really. One of those hard to explain situations between old friends. A misunderstanding in other words. This happens not long after I snorted it. So here I am starting to trip but at the same time, feel the need to start explaining or defending myself in regards to another situation. This is what really put the screws to me. Thank goodness my friend really is a friend and she waited for another day in order for me to make clear about this other misunderstanding . The timing of all this though caused me to completely fight back and resist the trip. It's hard to fully explain the stress this caused me. I ended up alternating between laying flat out on the couch/floor/ground getting lost in this other world anytime I closed my eyes and then clinging to my friend like a juvenile monkey hanging onto its mother. I remember her laughing as she went from room to room in the house or outside and I tagged along holding on to her with one hand or both arms around her. Probably also the shit I was saying was cracking her up. It seemed like half an eternity before it came to an end. Thank goodness also that my friend really proved her friendship in shelving the issue at the beginning of the trip and did lookout for me while I was kinda helpless. But the tone that was set at the beginning on top of the uncertainty of what I had even sorted made for way too much ambiguity. I live and learn.

Afterward I was able to track down the friend of a friend who gave it. He let me look at the label on the foil like pouch he still had and I was able to barely make out the word dimethyltryptamine.

Man what a time for her to bring up something like that, or maybe she didn't realise it would have such a drastic effect. Also, if you hadn't been expecting a trip of that magnitude it must have really thrown you. I'm nervous about trying DMT. I might skip to 5-MeO instead as I don't know if I can handle how warped it is, with all the alien entities etc. For me LSD is strong as hell and I'm only done up to 300ug. Each trip is a life-changing experience and is do damn intense, if DMT is much much stronger than that....well, maybe I should be brave. Have you tried it again since? 

[Zigzag Idiot]

1 hour ago, Wisebaxter said:

Have you tried it again since? 

No, but I think I'm ready though. Gonna be sending you a PM here shortly,,,

Just finished watching Leo's latest update. Wow! I'm still kinda tumbling through space. As I'm watching this, Leo begins to cry. It's really beautiful or rather it's beautiful to watch Leo experience something so beautiful that it just melts him. Thank you Leo for not editing this out and instead just breathing through and keep going. I'm really inspired by all that he said,,,,

[Zigzag Idiot]

6 minutes -  Graham Hancock on a good rant about the suppression of psychedelics and in the process points out the collective ego.  He doesn't use the phrase collective ego but he nails it nonetheless.

 

[Zigzag Idiot]

On 2/23/2019 at 0:21 PM, Zigzag Idiot said:

A couple of excepts and links to articles on the Strange Attractor 

Most of us are still right left symmetrical because our left brain so totally dominates the right. We have to shift our emphasis from cosmos to chaos, from left brain dominance, to right brain balance. Then the right is not just an imitation of the left, it is different, unique. The entirely new vistas of data open up to us. The last symmetry is gone and the two asymmetrical sides can then cohere in a new singularity.

Right brain coherence comes through receptivity to the workings of the Strange attractors, to constrained chance. In the moments when this is realized, when we are in a coherent flow with the unpredictable turbulence of the World, we have attained the birthright of Man. We have realized the potential to self organize to a higher stage of evolution. As a whole being, in touch with both sides of ourself and others, we transcend the left-right animal symmetry. With two fully developed, yet distinctly different brains, we are autonomous, asymmetrical, truly free from outside manipulation. We have attained a higher inner coherence, a self organization in the midst of chaos. We surf the tidal wave of information – with comprehension, not fear. To animal man we seem like Strange attractors indeed. On the surface, and in the moment, our actions may appear haphazard and foolhardy, but over time the wisdom and beauty of the Human Man will be apparent to all. The beauty of the Information Age will shine!

Excerpt from: https://schoolofwisdom.com/fractal-wisdom/meaning-of-the-universe/

 

 

 

God’s dice liberates us from the prison of determinism, the hopeless tedium of the cosmic clock and the inevitable death of entropy. We have instead an intelligent Universe, where ever new and evolving life forms thrive on Chaos, where negentropy creates higher order from decaying forms. The clock is not winding down as the second law of thermodynamics had thought, it is ever being created anew. God is back in the picture, not just as the creator of the machine who then left- the ghost in the machine – but as the Strange Attractor, the origin of inexplicable and unpredictable order from chance.

This is a new kind of order, a “fractal order,” based on a relatively few basic structural principals from which many transitory laws follow. The Laws of Wisdom we must learn for the journey to self realization are flexible, evolving. Like the common law, they are articulated afresh moment by moment, case by case.The laws are stable, but they do not stand still. Exactly how the basic principals will apply to form governing laws all depends upon the circumstances, the consciousness involved, the entities, the case.

The free will of the individual in connection with the infinite is now primary. All is not determined, everyone has a chance to decide their own fate. The philosophic implications of Chaos are positive and encouraging. The Universe is not a clock, its a game. Enjoy it!

excerpt from: https://schoolofwisdom.com/fractal-wisdom/benoit-b-mandelbrot/

 

 

yyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

 

This is a month old post I brought forward because of its relevance to Leo's talk earlier. The picture above is Benoit Mandelbrot. The mathematician mentioned when he was talking about fractals.

Edited March 30, 2019 by Zigzag Idiot

[Zigzag Idiot]

Nothing is simple

Everything is simple

Acting a fool can be dissociation or

Acting a fool can be Self Remembering and Unity Consciousness 

There is slavery in Idiocy

There is liberation in Idiocy

 

[Zigzag Idiot]

I'm reading in Leo's notes from his retreat and I remember Gurdjieff referring to God and the wholeness of Reality as an Ouroboros. 

Looking at Mandelbrot Fractals and pondering Infinity,,,,,, my realization was/is that Infinity is really big.  

Words don't quite capture it.

 

I found there to be hints of Ultimate Mercy In a Gurdjieff quote from a Will Mesa article. 
“God made only one mistake: He created the universe in the form of an umbrella instead of an enema.”

 

Benoit Mandelbrot 

Edited March 31, 2019 by Zigzag Idiot
Added Benoit Mandelbrot

[tsuki]

21 hours ago, Zigzag Idiot said:

Nothing is simple

Everything is simple

Nothing = Everything

Acting a fool can be dissociation or

Acting a fool can be Self Remembering and Unity Consciousness 

Disassociation = Self Remembering and Unity Consciousness

There is slavery in Idiocy

There is liberation in Idiocy

slavery = liberation

You get a fractal when you want to rationalize why two mirrors facing each other create a reflection. Do they, really?

[Zigzag Idiot]

28 minutes ago, tsuki said:

You get a fractal when you want to rationalize why two mirrors facing each other create a reflection. Do they, really?

?,,,,,

nothing + everything = simple

♣️/Unity Consciousness - ♦️/dissociation = ♠️/Self Remembering 

Idiocy - slavery = liberation = ♥️/Idiocy   

 ?♣️♦️♥️♠️?  ?‍♂️

 

[Zigzag Idiot]

What I was trying to convey the first time I posted in December

[Zigzag Idiot]

There is not one person in this forum who is completely awakened, myself included.

Inside Out Song lyrics.  

Be careful where you're walking
You might step in something rough            
         (Be mindful)

Be careful when you're talking
And saying all that stuff
 (Be careful about expressing negative emotion)

Take care when you are breathing 
Something's funny in the air
( Breath Consciously)

there's some things they're not saying
'bout what's happening out there
(Spiritual sleep)

It's inside out,,,,

There is not one person in this forum who is completely awakened, myself included.

Spiritual sleep takes many forms which include our unconstrained imagination which ranges from blatant to extremely subtle. Leo made reference to these subtle forms in his last video. His 3 part series on self deception and his video Mankind is the Bullshiting animal go directly towards addressing this part of our nature. We lie to ourselves all the time and stay lost and polluted from imagination. Most everyone at times is sure that it doesn't really apply to them because they are unwittingly identified with their own ego. I do not exclude myself. This includes everyone and the more someone refuses to see it in themselves, the more asleep they are to their own ego. Because of our psychological blindspot in which we can most often see others but not our own, people are often convinced that they are a little more 'awake' than others.

Living in identification with one's beliefs is another form of spiritual sleep.

Spiritual sleep and the state of being identified involves the intellectual - emotional complex in ungrounded feedback loops. It happens when we are stuck in our head and ungrounded from absence of body awareness. Very many people live exclusively here and are completely unaware of it. 

 

The transition from the First Tier of Consciousness to the Yellow level of the Second Tier is a “momentous leap” according to Clare Graves ,,,,

 

One of my longest held work aims has been to not express negative emotions. I still fail continually, but I’ve noticed a lot about myself by trying to do this. Spiritually asleep people in the forums are the first to spout off - there is no self or there is no I. blah,blah,blah,,, Although, technically in a sense, this is true.

If I stay in the outer part of my centers, (Intellectual, emotional, Instinctive), on the surface of life, I’ll just be reactive with my attention dispersed and be controlled by negative associations. I’s that exist only in the outer part of the centers are reactive and have little understanding. To journey inwards is to become aware of my atmosphere and also to become actively responsible for my internal states. I have to work to make this atmosphere hermetically sealed as Maurice Nicoll  metaphorically puts it in the Gurdjieff Ouspensky Psychological Commentaries. When I’m able to seal my atmosphere (become teflon coated - another more modern metaphor) from the negative influences in the world, then it’s possible for me to enter the 3rd state. It’s also called creating moon in oneself. This is done by sensing the body and by particularly inhabiting the belly center. To do this I must take in air and impressions consciously and go to the inner parts of the centers. If we are negative, we cannot go there. I don’t take things in a negative way the deeper I go into the third state. My psychological blind spots with their reactive ignorance are stumbling blocks that distort unity and lands me back in the second state, Itoklanoz existence (2 centered existence of the intellectual emotional complex, disembodied and ungrounded).

 

Once we start experiencing the third state, ( three centered awareness) Fulasnitamnian existence, as Gurdjieff calls it in “The Tales”, we can gain an inner memory of it to help us return there. 

If one doesn't ground oneself through sensation in the body, our existence stays polluted from imagination. This is highly offensive to those who are convinced of their own Awakened state of awareness and will often become emotionally negative in defending their own imaginary Awakened state.

Truly Awakened people don't become emotionally negative. They don't take things in a negative way. They don't complain although they feel things more intensely than those in spiritual sleep. They understand what being in an identified state means and are objective in seeing it when it manifests within them and then are able to step back and address the identification, maybe or usually or sometimes, etc,,, It's simple but it's not.

Being Awakened or fully Conscious means getting rid of most of our ideas of what being Awakened means.

I started composing this last night. It is not aimed at anyone in particular. It is offered up for those who are able to aim it at themselves. We can't work on other people. One can only work on oneself.

Find the inner quiet in the innermost part of ones own being. It doesn't happen automatic or mechanically. That's why we meditate. Finding the deeper part of the centers in oneself means having all of our attention collected. It's also called being in the Collected state. Being in a collected state requires 3 centered awareness. It's a state of Impartiality.

 

[Zigzag Idiot]

In regards to my tendency for overcompensating and going into false humility I'm reminded of an old joke.

Says a patient to their Therapist, 

Doc, you say I have an inferiority complex.

But so far as inferiority complexes go,,,, Well, I imagine It's probably not much of one.