Thoughts Loops on LSD = Ego Death?

[Wisebaxter]

I'm really wanting to experience ego death when I trip for the first time. Something I keep reading about is thought loops, which seems pretty common on acid, where you have the same thoughts happening on repeat over and over and you can't break out of it, like you get short term memory loss. 

One guy said:

"Your mind is firing on all cylinders. If you fight it, it will terrify you. If you let it happen and spiral out with each sequential loop, you gain more clarity and unity with the universe and ego begins to slip away. My last trip completely changed my perception of reality."

So thought loops can lead to ego death? I want one!! I don't quite know what he means by let it 'spiral out with each sequential loop' though. If I get one of these loops can someone help me to understand how it can lead to ego death? I'm guessing it's related to the short term memory loss somehow. Are there other ways I can make ego death more likely on acid. People say the loops are quite terrifying but maybe it's because they fight it, like they guy said.  

Edited December 10, 2018 by Wisebaxter

[Bluebird]

Quote

Your mind is firing on all cylinders. If you fight it, it will terrify you. If you let it happen and spiral out with each sequential loop, you gain more clarity and unity with the universe and ego begins to slip away. My last trip completely changed my perception of reality

Can confirm. I've been through everything he said. 

Thought loops (if you keep going deeper into them) lead to ego death. Go deeper into the loops, into the darkness.

He says spiral out, I say go deeper. Same thing, different words.

Also, the odds of experiecing a full ego death on you're first trip is fucking low. On top of that, you probably don't want to. Better off getting used to the substance a bit first and then going ego-death.

Ego death is more likely at higher doses (my first full crazy ego-death was 600ug) but now I experience it much lower than that (150ug) and probably lower. 

Read my last trip report to get a better idea of what I mean, I've got like 3 or so reports.

 

Loops are terrifying, and I don't know if there is a way to induce them except maybe self-inquiry. They start to literally make you go insane and panic, but beneath all that terror is universal love. And when you're in that, you'll realise (or not) that you've had an ego death.

The way it felt to me was my life was an entire dream and I had finally woken up, I think I cried at the beauty of it all. I'd forgotten I had taken acid. Of course, I came back down, and here I am now. But I had questioned before, was that ego death.

If you had to question it, it probably didn't happen.

[Wisebaxter]

20 hours ago, Bluebird said:

He says spiral out, I say go deeper. Same thing, different words.

How do you go deeper? 

20 hours ago, Bluebird said:

Ego death is more likely at higher doses

I'm only doing 150ug first time so might not happen then. Might I still get thought loops at that dose and just no ego death? Or no loops until higher doses? 

20 hours ago, Bluebird said:

 

 

20 hours ago, Bluebird said:

I'd forgotten I had taken acid

Just had a thought. May I could set an intermittent timer to go off during my trip, with a message saying, you're on acid. So I don't forget and freak out. Or do you think its necessary to forget you're tripping to have ego death?

Edited December 11, 2018 by Wisebaxter

[Forestluv]

@Wisebaxter Thought loops are a trap of confusion, not clarity. It's trapped in a loop of thoughts, actions and emotions that repeat themselves over and over. They are very disorienting and caused by psychedelic-induced loss of short-term memory. Here is an example of one of my thought loops:

Ok, it's kickin' in, what shall I do? I'll watch the movie Dr. Strange. Maybe I should make some popcorn. I should drink some water. I better use the toilet before drinking water. My face looks weird in the mirror. What's that popping sound? Wasn't I suppose to be doing something? Oh yea, the movie. I better use the toilet before the movie. Was I just in the bathroom looking at my face? Or is this the first time? Did I ever leave the bathroom, or have I been here the whole time? And why do I smell popcorn? Oh, the movie Dr. Strange is playing. Did I just watch it? I don't remember, I might as well watch it. Wouldn't it be nice to have some popcorn? How am I back in the bathroom looking in the mirror? Did I ever leave the bathroom? Was I just asking myself that question? I should drink some water, but I better pee first. Why can't I pee? 

Most thought loops I've had only last a few minutes. This one lasted over an hour. . . 

[Wisebaxter]

@Serotoninluv Would just emptying your mind help maybe, when you become aware it's happening? Like sitting and meditating for a bit? Coming into the moment?

[Forestluv]

@Wisebaxter Yea. The best way to get out of it is to just sit down and let it go. Then the trip can continue on. I’ve only been caught in loops over 5min twice - before I knew what they were. I had thought it was part of the deal . And I tend to be absent-minded to begin with.

The other references to the thread sound different than my understanding of thought loops. We may be talking about different phenomena. Yet, when I google psychedelic thought loops it’s about the loss of short-term memory.

I didn’t find it to be a “bad” place. Just disorienting and confusing. They can be kinda funny, yet also annoying. I was blind-sided at first, yet was able to recognize it after that. 

[Wisebaxter]

@Serotoninluv I found that comment about ego death on a reddit forum. One other guy had mentioned ego death in relation to these loops and also Bluebird above. I guess when we're trying to communicate these experiences using language we might end up referring to different phenomena like you say. Plus everyone's mind is so different. Then we have to factor in wishful thinking and people having no other frame of reference when they label a phenomena this or that. 

[SgtPepper]

2 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

@Wisebaxter Thought loops are a trap of confusion, not clarity. It's trapped in a loop of thoughts, actions and emotions that repeat themselves over and over. They are very disorienting and caused by psychedelic-induced loss of short-term memory. Here is an example of one of my thought loops:

Ok, it's kickin' in, what shall I do? I'll watch the movie Dr. Strange. Maybe I should make some popcorn. I should drink some water. I better use the toilet before drinking water. My face looks weird in the mirror. What's that popping sound? Wasn't I suppose to be doing something? Oh yea, the movie. I better use the toilet before the movie. Was I just in the bathroom looking at my face? Or is this the first time? Did I ever leave the bathroom, or have I been here the whole time? And why do I smell popcorn? Oh, the movie Dr. Strange is playing. Did I just watch it? I don't remember, I might as well watch it. Wouldn't it be nice to have some popcorn? How am I back in the bathroom looking in the mirror? Did I ever leave the bathroom? Was I just asking myself that question? I should drink some water, but I better pee first. Why can't I pee? 

Most thought loops I've had only last a few minutes. This one lasted over an hour. . . 

LOL.  very accurate.

Is that what people refer to as thought loops? Those things are harmless, its just like your unconscious to-do list fighting for your attention.

Honestly a repetition of a thought or a phrase, is just mantra meditation, which may explain the ego death like experience. 

[Forestluv]

30 minutes ago, SgtPepper said:

Honestly a repetition of a thought or a phrase, is just mantra meditation, which may explain the ego death like experience. 

Ahhh, very nice. I hadn’t thought of it like that - using a thought loop like a mantra to enter ego death. Well, that would make the process a lot smoother. 

[Strikr]

3 hours ago, Wisebaxter said:

@Serotoninluv Would just emptying your mind help maybe, when you become aware it's happening? Like sitting and meditating for a bit? Coming into the moment?

it's not scary, funny at the end.

just draw when things start weird, it will not be like this the all trip, maybe 1% of the trip.

Edited December 11, 2018 by Strikr

[Forestluv]

33 minutes ago, Strikr said:

just draw when things start weird, it will not be like this the all trip, maybe 1% of the trip.

Have you ever done artwork while tripping? I bet it would be amazing. 

[Strikr]

Just now, Serotoninluv said:

Have you ever done artwork while tripping? I bet it would be amazing. 

All forms of art, philosophy, drawing, ego work, even electronic music on a computer ( ain't easy but I had the set for it ! ) my ears was still there, I used total earth instead and observed my own self doing.

now my only drug is meditation though

 but it did helped at the right time for the right inquiry

[SgtPepper]

Terence McKenna recommended singing as a way to uplift yourself from a negative space. 

I honestly use my guitar as a way to soothe myself, something to fidget with, and I like making sounds, keeps me grounded in a way... sometimes humming along, letting my inner creativity bloom. This naturally stops thoughts and pulls you in deeper.

So find what that thing is for you. 

[Forestluv]

2 minutes ago, Strikr said:

All forms of art, philosophy, drawing, ego work, even electronic music on a computer ( ain't easy but I had the set for it ! ) my ears was still there, I used total earth instead and observed my own self doing.

now my only drug is meditation though

 but it did helped at the right time for the right inquiry

That sounds amazing

[SaWaSaurus]

Contemplate life purpose/destiny and your own death during the trip. Lose yourself in the flow of your contemplation.

[Wisebaxter]

4 hours ago, SgtPepper said:

I honestly use my guitar as a way to soothe myself, something to fidget with, and I like making sounds, keeps me grounded in a way... sometimes humming along, letting my inner creativity bloom. This naturally stops thoughts and pulls you in deeper.

I'll take my guitar with me then

@SaWaSaurus

4 hours ago, SaWaSaurus said:

Contemplate life purpose/destiny and your own death during the trip. Lose yourself in the flow of your contemplation.

Couldn't contemplating my own death potentially turn it into a bad trip? 

[Strikr]

now you're more than ready, stop overthinking, be with the flow

[Wisebaxter]

@Strikr

8 minutes ago, Strikr said:

now you're more than ready, stop overthinking, be with the flow

Yeah I think I've done enough research now. It's time to move into 'being' to prepare

[Bluebird]

Quote

Just had a thought. May I could set an intermittent timer to go off during my trip, with a message saying, you're on acid. So I forget and freak out. Or do you think its necessary to forget you're tripping to have ego death?

Yeah dude, don't try and induce a thought loop of any kind.

I'm just saying loops can take you deeper into infinite awareness, I'm not really sure how it works man. It mostly just happens or it doesn't for me.

Again, good luck trying to induce ego death. I've tried it before, it took a high dose for it to happen and the result was NOT pretty!

But now it happens easier.

[molosku]

Technique suggestion: stare at the closed-eye visuals and self-inquire about them and their meaning to the one that is perceiving. What you are looking for is a thought-loopy visual horror: the kind where you constantly plunge into mouths of horrific beasts and snakes and whatnot. then self-inquire: who is afraid? who is being attacked? who sends these visuals, because I don't? Who draws these shapes?

If you can face the visuals with no fear, a part of your defense mechanisms has been shut off. All my deepest inquiries on psychedelics have been like this.

Realize that just like anything you see can't hurt you, nothing in the outer world can hurt YOU: the source of all sensory experience

And don't we all want to "let go", if only we know HOW?! Well, surrendering to thought loops and visual loops is definitely one way to do it

Edited December 11, 2018 by molosku