Meditation Benefits Without Formal Meditation

[Wouter]

Shinzen Young (who is a spiritual teacher) defines meditation as "an(y) activity which "improves" the baselevel of concentration". According to him there are people who meditate (according to this defenition) while doing other activities than formal meditation. But he doesn't tell anything more about it (as far as I understand/know). So now I am wondering if it is possible for everyone getting this "meditation without meditating"-benefits by adopting "the right" mindsets. For example I play table tennis as a hobby, and while I do it, I feel that I am in different mental mode. I could certainly believe that it is possible making this a meditation; if I had more insight in this topic. Is there anybody who can help?

 

 

[SkyPanther]

What he is talking about is "walking" meditation.

There is a formal version of it, which you can look up on YouTube.

The informal version is being mindful of everything you, your body, and the surroundings are doing.

Be in the present moment and observe as much as you can without commenting on it.

When you hear something, know you heard it, when you see something, know you saw it, etc. Do all of this without the constant commentary that runs through most people's mind. "A bird song, I wonder what kind of bird that is? I remember my grandmothers bird, that thing was pretty old", etc. 

Observe, but don't lable or engage in conceptual proliferation.

 

[cetus]

@Wouter Doing- without a doer is a practice of meditation. That being said, it's not cherry picking what is to be put to practice. Every moment presents itself as an opportunity.

[Isle of View]

@Wouter

The state you describe, when playing ping pong, is called the state of flow. It is also called "being in the zone".

 

Also note the Japanese masters of many arts, gardening, cooking and many many other disciplines, many of them use it as a way to reach Satori.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satori#Attaining_satori

 

Put involvement into any activity and you will reach meditative states.

 

~Chris

 

Edited April 9, 2016 by Isle of View

[Azrael]

22 minutes ago, Wouter said:

So now I am wondering if it is possible for everyone getting this "meditation without meditating"-benefits by adopting "the right" mindsets.

You can definitely meditate informally throughout the day. I commonly do it in the subway, while listening to lectures in university, sometimes while talking to other people or just going around, cleaning, whatever. This nowadays is very simple for me because of my existing meditation habit. I can just raise my concentration + relaxation to a level where I feel this tingling sensation in my body while being totally concentrated and in flow w/ whatever I do.

However, this would be probably very difficult to manifest if I hadn't implemented the formal meditation. If I think back, I needed a few months - I'd say 4-5 - to get to the level where I could easily meditate in any - or let's say most normal - situations. So, yes it can definitely be done. The question is whether you can do it w/o a formal practice. For me, that would be harder.

Find out for yourself. However, I think a formal daily practice has a lot of benefits - so consider that too. It's kind of like the root from which all my spiritual and also productive life growth originates from.

[Wouter]

@SkyPanther The method of walking meditation seems interesting and resonates with me. I watched a video on it. (How To Meditate III - Walking Meditation by Yuttadhammo Bhikkhu). The formal proces he describes seems for advanced and commited meditators (I am also commited but it is only my 9th consecutive day I meditate). I am defenitely gonna try the informal practice you describe. Do you have further recommendatations or advice related to this topic?

@Isle of View Do you think states of flow automatically carry  over (signifantly)  in the rest of your life? I like your remider "Put involvement into any activity" to live an intense live :-). Do you know about specific instructions to increase the carry over from the flow state to the rest of your life?

@Arik  "If I advance enough doing formal meditation practice, it wil become more or less obvious  with time how to expand the practice to everyday life". Do you get you mean if my main takaway from what you said is what I quoted ? I already started formal meditation. Today is the 9th consecutive day I do formal meditation (20 minutes each day). And I feel like it has already an impact on my (that is why I was curious about how to expand the practice).  I start noticing (this may be an inapropriate word since it could also be "experiencing the placebo effect") I am more compassionate. As an example: today I met someone who lived in an orphanage. And I felt really sorry that she couldn't live with her parents (even without she telling that she didn't like it, so I also made a judgment/assumption there), in a more explicit way than before. Do you think this is placebo effect? What where the first effects of your meditation practice you noticed? And in what time span? 

[Isle of View]

Just now, Wouter said:

 

@Isle of View Do you think states of flow automatically carry  over (signifantly)  in the rest of your life? I like your remider "Put involvement into any activity" to live an intense live :-). Do you know about specific instructions to increase the carry over from the flow state to the rest of your life?

Yes.

Generally it has to do with 3 things: Focus and Attitude, and Emotion. These 3 factors produce a vibrational wavelenght around you body (and in your body). The higher the emotion, the better the attitude towards life and the stronger the focus. At a medium level your Focus is out of your control, that's a state of "overthinking", "daydreaming" etc. That's where there is no flow in your desired direction. To some degree the person starts to be "not there" and is not really in present time. Below this level all the person does is contrary to what she actually desires. So in short: work on high emotions, good attitude and on your focus. That's a short version.

But there is more. For instance, in order to be in flow on a guitar, you need to start with the basics (even the best guitar players train regularly their basics). Master the pieces and then master it all.

It's actually the same in any desired area of your life.

Meditation is helpful. Practice with focus and the right attitude is helpful.

When you encounter stopping blocks, your flow diminishes. Master the block once, master it twice. You've mastered it.

It's not done overnight.

Ask Tiger Woods how he manages to be in the right focus, attitude and emotion where he is able to make a small hole appear in his conciousness as big as a swimming pool. Practice, focus and attitude in a high mood.

 

Kind reards, 
Chris

 

 

[SkyPanther]

16 minutes ago, Wouter said:

@SkyPanther The method of walking meditation seems interesting and resonates with me. I watched a video on it. (How To Meditate III - Walking Meditation by Yuttadhammo Bhikkhu). The formal proces he describes seems for advanced and commited meditators (I am also commited but it is only my 9th consecutive day I meditate). I am defenitely gonna try the informal practice you describe. Do you have further recommendatations or advice related to this topic?

@Isle of View Do you think states of flow automatically carry  over (signifantly)  in the rest of your life? I like your remider "Put involvement into any activity" to live an intense live :-). Do you know about specific instructions to increase the carry over from the flow state to the rest of your life?

@Arik  "If I advance enough doing formal meditation practice, it wil become more or less obvious  with time how to expand the practice to everyday life". Do you get you mean if my main takaway from what you said is what I quoted ? I already started formal meditation. Today is the 9th consecutive day I do formal meditation (20 minutes each day). And I feel like it has already an impact on my (that is why I was curious about how to expand the practice).  I start noticing (this may be an inapropriate word since it could also be "experiencing the placebo effect") I am more compassionate. As an example: today I met someone who lived in an orphanage. And I felt really sorry that she couldn't live with her parents (even without she telling that she didn't like it, so I also made a judgment/assumption there), in a more explicit way than before. Do you think this is placebo effect? What where the first effects of your meditation practice you noticed? And in what time span? 

I apologize for the short description, I am on my phone, so makes it a bit harder to expand the thought, etc.

There is a book I really like called "Life is Meditation - Meditation is Life: A Practical Guide to the "Emancipation Proclamation" of the Anapanasati Sutta and Loving-Kindness Meditation"

It has instructions for informal walking meditation, and applying it to everyday life.

In short "mindfulness" is just observing the mind, and recognizing that it has strayed from its object of focus. Once you recognize that, you release the thought, or interruption, and bring mind back to its object. 

There are more steps to that, like tranqulizing the body, and bringing up a wholesome mind state (a smile or focusing on Metta), but on the whole it is just recognizing you are thinking, releasing it(take focus away from it, do not push or suppress it) and come back to the breath,  Metta, or mantra, etc.

The focus can be washing the dishes, Sweeping, cleaning, etc.

Edited April 9, 2016 by SkyPanther

[Azrael]

9 hours ago, Wouter said:

"If I advance enough doing formal meditation practice, it wil become more or less obvious  with time how to expand the practice to everyday life"

Yeah, kind of. Though you don't even have to advance like you were doing something wrong now and in two month you advanced to something other. Does your experience while meditating change w/ time? Definitely. I started out feeling very bored, shitty, sometimes pissed, scared and now after a year I sit down for an hour and for most time it is pure bliss. Even if I have a meditation in which a lot of shit purges out of my head, it is still bliss to me. I can sit in a lotus-like posture w/o any pains whatsoever.

But this needs to develop over time. I'm not more advanced than you, I just probably purged more shit out of my system so my meditation manifests a little different. So, the takeaway is: Be patient. Everything else comes with time.

Personally, my meditation benefits - or let's say nice side effects - started a week after I started the practice. I stopped biting my finger nails w/o intending to do so, after I did it since I can remember. This is typical, because meditation lets inner stress go. The second "achievement" was that I stopped smoking cigarettes two months later w/o intending to do so too - and I was a very passionate full-time smoker. I just got up one day and had the sudden realization that I can't go on this way.

A few weeks after that relaxation + concentration levels started to get over the top and since then I experienced a lot of similar stuff - deep meditative states, seeing glimpses of the self, having deep realizations about reality and life and so on. Basically, I go through different phases every month that peal away the layers of bullshit I built up over the years and show me kinda artfully what is out there.

You will encounter with enough practice what for "not-meditating human beings" can seem like super powers (to some extend). Like feeling extremely comfortable in high-stress environments, being on purpose highly relaxed and/or concentrated, start hallucinating on purpose like you are on acid/shrooms and a lot of similar stuff. With meditation all of these are stages you go through and you will be amazed by them.

So to the sum this up, no it's probably not placebo with your first benefits. I used to think that too in the beginning because one is not experienced with what is coming with meditation. So lay back, and enjoy the ride. You are definitely doing the right thing here. 

Cheers, Arik

[Naviy]

@Wouter Well, try just noticing your breath throughout the day - as often as you can. Notice 2-3 breaths an then go on your day. Try to do this during any activities. Eckhart Tolle suggests it. When you notice your breath, you automatically become mindful. It is not so important for how long you can focus on your breath, it is more important - how often. With this exercise you will improve mindfulness significantly.

After some time you will be able to directly become mindful, without focusing on breathing. This is what I do currently. I call this "constant mindfulness practice". By becoming mindful I mean looking at the whole real-time current spectre of thoughts, feelings and emotions. They are always moving, so it is like a stream or river. Just look at the stream of percieved objects (hearing, thougths, feelings, emotions, will, arising, going away, etc.) for several seconds. 

I do 2 types of this looking:

1) Looking at the whole spectrum of all currently percieved objects at once. Kind of zoom out and look at everything.

2) Conentrating on one particular object. For example, when I cut a tomato, I concentrate on the sound of the knife hitting the table.

I have noticed that mindful looking you can significantly improve by doing formal Mindfulness meditation from this video:

 

I think this is the second hardest meditation from all Leo's videos about meditation (after level 3 from "How do Meditate Deeper" video). But after doing it for a month or two, you will remember this feeling and action of looking at an object (emotion, thought, feeling, etc.) while being detached from it and keeping your concentration on this object for several seconds. You can use this learnt skill in your "constant mindfulness practice". Actually, you will naturally become more mindful after doing this meditation technique. I've done it for 1,5 month (31 minutes every day), then I switched to another meditation technique, and only now I start to notice how this meditation technique has improved my "constant mindfulness". I definetely need to do more of this technique (it is hard though).