How is wisdom transferred?

[Forestluv]

Everything really really means Everything. 

[Anton Rogachevski]

9 minutes ago, SOUL said:

Remember me talking about the mistaken perception of the primitive mind seeing a duality that really isn't what it all exists as? Yea, it's hard to break that conditioning even when one tries to go 'non-dual'.

I don't seem to recall, yet I would love for you to elaborate.

I like what you did there with the infinite perspectives. The cool part is that true non-duality (understood properly) is not a perspective and so it changes the game. As I said it's a state dependant vision. You can't take two entirely different states and compare the two, or explain the one with the other, and start spouting how non of us really exist. (which is what happens to the dude cult here.)

The proper way is to see both as legitimate and not mix the unmixable. That's what's meant when saying that existence both exists and doesn't. 

[Anton Rogachevski]

15 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

Everything really really means Everything. 

I'm afraid I've lost you there. Please tell me more master.

[purerogue]

Omg, this form is eating each of us alive, good lesson though , we need some no formal way to communicate where we do not get on each others throats when we disagree with each other. 

 

[Forestluv]

9 minutes ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

I'm afraid I've lost you there. Please tell me more master.

 

11 minutes ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

The cool part is that true non-duality (understood properly) is not a perspective and so it changes the game.

Nonduality cannot be understood, yet includes all understandings.

Nonduality is not a perspective, yet includes all perspectives.

Everything = No thing = Nothing

 

 

[Elysian]

 

Here he touches on what he calls two paths. Embodying Absolute Truth, Buddha. Turning towards the suffering of others and embracing it, Jesus. Where Ken Wilber made the mistake is by calling them two different paths, when in reality it's the same path at different stages. 

Buddha recognized Absolute Truth, and embodied it for his entire life. Jesus recognized Absolute Truth, but decided if he was going to continue being a part of this existence regardless of where it comes from, he was going to continue to grow through spreading unity. 

You can stop where Buddha did, or you can continue on to become a part of the leading edge of evolution, the leading edge of love.

[Anton Rogachevski]

56 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

 

Nonduality cannot be understood, yet includes all understandings.

Nonduality is not a perspective, yet includes all perspectives.

Everything = No thing = Nothing

 

 

How could it be so, if from a non-dual state there are no understandings and no perspectives? These things are dualistic after all.

[Elysian]

1 minute ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

How could it be so, if from a non-dual state there are no understandings and no perspectives? These things are dualistic after all.

What they're saying is nondual masturbation.

Edited December 6, 2018 by Elysian
Grammar

[Anton Rogachevski]

3 minutes ago, Elysian said:

It's nondual masturbation.

These kind of statements without explanations are like throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

Edited December 6, 2018 by Anton Rogachevski

[purerogue]

You could say this reality is built on dualism perspective, but it does not mean that you have to look at it like that. 

Edited December 6, 2018 by purerogue

[Nahm]

 

33 minutes ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

How could it be so, if from a non-dual state there are no understandings and no perspectives? These things are dualistic after all.

The barrier is ‘objective reality’. Maya is relentless in conflating. The illusion is that anything or anyone is not you, then there is a thing, then there is a thing to think about, this slippery slope results in identification with or not with said thing, then there is meaning, then there can be reason, rationality, ideology, suffering. But there was only you. 

Nondual.   “Not two”.

MU!

[Elysian]

43 minutes ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

These kind of statements without explanations are like throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

All you need to know about nonduality is that it is the realization on the highest level you are one with everything. Everything within your experience is you, because you are God. Anything your told beyond this is nondual masturbation. It serves no purpose and only complicates your spiritual growth.

The real question is, once you reach the pinnacle of nondual awareness, where do you go from there? That's only the second step of the spiritual path, the first being enlightenment. Most enlightened individuals fall into dogma and stunt their growth by assuming nondual is the finish line of spirituality, when they only just started the race.

The real challenge comes in the next step, which is paradoxically integrating the nondual perspective with duality. Ken Wilber touches on this, even though he doesn't fully understand how to do it. Absolute and Relative Truth have to be merged, that's the next step in our evolution. Christ was a good example of these two merging, Buddha is an example of getting stuck in a nondual rut.

The Integration of Relative and Absolute Truth is Coral. It's beyond nondual dogma and since some of the best teachings for spiritual development only take one to nondual you have very few that ever reach it. It's probably somewhere around .001% of the population. And reaching Coral is only just the beginning, so don't let yourself get stuck down at what 2000 to 3000 year old books point towards. Considering how many enlightened individuals are stuck behind dogma, it makes it even more difficult for deeper Truth to come out.

 

 

Edited December 6, 2018 by Elysian
Grammar

[Forestluv]

1 hour ago, Serotoninluv said:

Nonduality cannot be understood, yet includes all understandings.

Nonduality is not a perspective, yet includes all perspectives.

Everything = No thing = Nothing

 

52 minutes ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

How could it be so, if from a non-dual state there are no understandings and no perspectives? These things are dualistic after all.

Because Everything includes every thing as One. Everything really really means Everything, including all perceptions of things. There is no thing outside of Everything. There is no thing you or anyone can think, feel or do outside of Everything. There is no object or concept outside of Everything. Thus, Everything = No thing = Nothing. 

Everything / Nothing is Absolute. There is no conceptual escape hatch. Concepts of nonduality and duality collapse into Everything / Nothing.

[Forestluv]

15 minutes ago, Elysian said:

All you need to know about nonduality is that it is the realization on the highest level you are one with everything. Everything within your experience is you, because you are God. Anything your told beyond this is nondual masturbation. It serves no purpose and only complicates your spiritual growth.

Pointers can be helpful for human minds to awaken. Yet, it's best to speak of it delicately. As you wrote, pontification can be a distraction.

[Anton Rogachevski]

5 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

 

Because Everything includes every thing as One. Everything really really means Everything, including all perceptions of things. There is no thing outside of Everything. There is no thing you or anyone can think, feel or do outside of Everything. There is no object or concept outside of Everything. Thus, Everything = No thing = Nothing. 

Everything / Nothing is Absolute. There is no conceptual escape hatch.

We're getting somewhere! Mind Bent. Can't fathom this. There really is a shift occurring in my experience right now. I guess this contemplation wasn't fruitless after all. There's no Non-duality, nor duality, except ideas about them. There's nothing but ideas, and ideas are everything. Holy smokes!

[Nahm]

@Anton Rogachevski ???????❤️?

[Forestluv]

10 minutes ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

We're getting somewhere! Mind Bent. Can't fathom this. There really is a shift occurring in my experience right now. I guess this contemplation wasn't fruitless after all. There's no Non-duality, nor duality, except ideas about them. There's nothing but ideas, and ideas are everything. Holy smokes!

A glimpse of the Ox's tail!!  

[Nahm]

 

37 minutes ago, Elysian said:

All you need to know about nonduality is that it is the realization on the highest level you are one with everything. Everything within your experience is you, because you are God. Anything your told beyond this is nondual masturbation. It serves no purpose and only complicates your spiritual growth.

The real question is, once you reach the pinnacle of nondual awareness, where do you go from there? That's only the second step of the spiritual path, the first being enlightenment. Most enlightened individuals fall into dogma and stunt their growth by assuming nondual is the finish line of spirituality, when they only just started the race.

The real challenge comes in the next step, which is paradoxically integrating the nondual perspective with duality. Ken Wilber touches on this, even though he doesn't fully understand how to do it. Absolute and Relative Truth have to be merged, that's the next step in our evolution. Christ was a good example of these two merging, Buddha is an example of getting stuck in a nondual rut.

The Integration of Relative and Absolute Truth is Coral. It's beyond nondual dogma and since some of the best teachings for spiritual development only take one to nondual you have very few that ever reach it. It's probably somewhere around .001% of the population. And reaching Coral is only just the beginning, so don't let yourself get stuck down at what 2000 to 3000 year old books point towards. Considering how many enlightened individuals are stuck behind dogma, it makes it even more difficult for deeper Truth to come out.

Can you share your thoughts on how absolute and relative truths are merged? 

Who are you referring to, that .001%?

Also, who are some examples of coral? 

Thanks. 

[SOUL]

Another trip down the mystical rabbit hole..... It is but it isn't! It's understanding that can't be comprehended! Everything and nothing! Spiraling stages of mental masturbation chasing the Ox's butt hoping to get a glimpse.

I'm a fulfilled and at peace with liberation so leave the esoteric knowledge to others. Anyone who is reading this and wondering if they need any of that stuff to cease suffering I can genuinely say from my own experience, no, it's not needed.

Simple awareness of being in the present moment, anything more than that is the maze of maya and is distraction.

[Forestluv]

4 minutes ago, SOUL said:

Another trip down the mystical rabbit hole..... It is but it isn't! It's understanding that can't be comprehended! Everything and nothing! Spiraling stages of mental masturbation chasing the Ox's butt hoping to get a glimpse.

I'm a fulfilled and at peace with liberation so leave the esoteric knowledge to others. Anyone who is reading this and wondering if they need any of that stuff to cease suffering I can genuinely say from my own experience, no, it's not needed.

Simple awareness of being in the present moment, anything more than that is the maze of maya and is distraction.

Absolute Peace and Freedom is unconditional, it is not dependent on circumstances.