The Game

[ivankiss]

How do you play the game after realizing and fully integrating the fact that you are playing a game?

Do you dedicate yourself to waking "others" up and triggering them into their version of the same realization? Or is this attempt paradoxical and/or even impossible to achieve? Is it a "waste of time"? 

Do you keep on expressing the Self and planting seeds for everyone? Or do you simply allow the unfolding? 

Do you play the game while intentionally not breaking character or do you try exposing the fact that everyone is a character within the game?

Is there a point after the point? 

Should you become even more self-oriented after this realization or open up yourself for service to "others" and serve only?

Should you just simply be? Or should you be a conscious co-creator?

How do you play the game?

I am honestly curious.

Edited November 24, 2018 by ivankiss

[FoxFoxFox]

The question does not arise if the Self is correctly realized. 

[ivankiss]

@FoxFoxFox Is the game complete once the Self is correctly realized?

Edited November 24, 2018 by ivankiss

[Strikr]

depend where do you want to lead the game, the thing is, you have already a character and special characteristic, you cannot play others games than yourself.

 

[ivankiss]

@Strikr Can my way of playing the game affect anyone? Or is this illusory and deliberately "made" to seem so? Is this the ultimate definition of freedom or is it a trap? 

[Strikr]

8 minutes ago, ivankiss said:

@Strikr Can my way of playing the game affect anyone? Or is this illusory and deliberately "made" to seem so? Is this the ultimate definition of freedom or is it a trap? 

I m reading currently, "karma yoga" by   Swami Vivekananda

maybe some of your answers about doing or not doing are in here. ( if you can find it ask me mp )

grossly : no matter what you do, you'll be doing what're fit for, so go for it with force and love for the game.

humm the answer is, nothing really have changed in reality, even if it looks like, but maybe it has, go try for yourself if your "new theory" work.

Imagination is not direct experience, even the plane you think you are on currently is maybe another lie.

I wouldn't call it a trap, more of a mirror.

believe it or not every act, act upon another thing, forget about evil/good.

For me it's more of : your actions reflect upon yourself.

Edited November 24, 2018 by Strikr

[Nahm]

51 minutes ago, ivankiss said:

How do you play the game after realizing and fully integrating the fact that you are playing a game? Carefree, in love.

Do you dedicate yourself to waking others up and triggering them into their version of the same realization? If you want.  Or is this attempt paradoxical and/or even impossible to achieve? Yes paradox. Yes impossible. Yes possible. Is it a "waste of time"? Time?  Waste? Snuffleupagus?

Do you keep on expressing the self and planting seeds for everyone? Or do you simply allow the unfolding? They’re the same.

Do you play the game while intentionally not breaking character or do you try exposing the fact that everyone is a character within the game? Can’t expose what’s not there.

Is there a point after the point? What point?

Should you become even more self-oriented after this realization or open up yourself for service to others and serve only? Also the same.

Should you just simply be? Or should you be a conscious co-creator? Also the same.

How do you play the game? Humility, love, appreciation, wonder, intention, anticipation, satisfied.    and hilarity.     What about you?

I am honestly curious. That’s deep.

 

6 minutes ago, ivankiss said:

@Strikr Can my way of playing the game affect anyone? It’s up to them.  Or is this illusory and deliberately "made" to seem so? If it’s illusory, that’s up to you. Is this the ultimate definition of freedom or is it a trap? Up to you.

Totally loving where you’re at with these questions. You’ve been rockin the contemplation. 

 

[ground]

"Playing a game" is not an appropriate expression because in conventional parlance this may imply "to pretend" or even "to cheat".

In the abiding reality of primordial awareness everything is empty of inherent existence and thus empty of inherently existing as truth and this includes everything said and done and perceived, the one who says and does and perceives. Since awareness and emptiness are indivisible there cannot arise a sentiment of "playing a game". If such a sentiment is present then integration of awareness and "everyday life" has ceased and dormant habits have again gained control. That's not an issue since practice is about stabilizing this integration.

Edited November 24, 2018 by ground

[ivankiss]

Thank you @Nahm. (for the laughs as well )

How can I be certain that there is such a thing as "them"? Is there a way for me to have some sort of a confirmation from my limited point of view?

And why does this question bring a sense of panic on a level beyond the character? Am I overlooking something? Am I asking these questions from a "wrong" place? Why does this leave me with a sense of solitude on a level beyond the character? Why do I feel like I am confusing this with my ego's fears while I simultaneously and honestly feel like it is not coming from that place. Is God lonely?

Edited November 24, 2018 by ivankiss

[ivankiss]

4 hours ago, Strikr said:

I m reading currently, "karma yoga" by   Swami Vivekananda

maybe some of your answers about doing or not doing are in here. ( if you can find it ask me mp )

grossly : no matter what you do, you'll be doing what're fit for, so go for it with force and love for the game.

humm the answer is, nothing really have changed in reality, even if it looks like, but maybe it has, go try for yourself if your "new theory" work.

Imagination is not direct experience, even the plane you think you are on currently is maybe another lie.

I wouldn't call it a trap, more of a mirror.

believe it or not every act, act upon another thing, forget about evil/good.

For me it's more of : your actions reflect upon yourself.

Mirror is the perfect word, yes. I know nothing has changed in reality. That is why I am confused about how to continue creating it. I know I want to be Love and be Light, and I know the importance of diversity. But I want to know am I truly sharing any of this with anyone? Or does it simply reflect back onto "me" from the mirror?

Thank you for your suggestion on the book, will check it out  

[Strikr]

it depend what you call love.

"happiness" for you, doesn't mean "happiness" for me.

but that doesn't mean, you can't carve the life you expect, charity & help people is a way, maybe the truth you need to carve yourself on.

this is where the exploration begin, try to carve the life you expect, and see how much it work.

there is no "wrong way", only yours.

when I realized the "truth" in early stage, I was feeling I was "a pharaon" for 5 days, expect a big mindfuck to come if you change hard.

feeling "bad" is just a story, be strong, and you'll get on with this, trust the process.

Edited November 24, 2018 by Strikr

[Nahm]

1 minute ago, ivankiss said:

Thank you @Nahm. (for the laughs as well )

How can I be certain that there is such a thing as "them"? Is there a way for me to have some sort of a confirmation from my limited point of view?

And why does this question bring a sense of panic on a level beyond the character? Am I overlooking something? Am I asking these questions from a "wrong" place? Why does this leave me with sense of solitude on a level beyond the character? Why do I feel like I am confusing this with my ego's fears while I simultaneously and honestly feel like it is not coming from that place. Is God lonely?

You’re in the middle, the confusion, like static between radio stations. This is good, all is well. 

You made a trap of:

If there is “them”, everything is ok.

If there is not “them”, everything is not ok.

The brain does that “duality”.

The heart doesn’t care about duality, rather, it wants only to know, to experience, and to express love more deeply. 

Just look around the room, and have a good laugh when you notice this is just thinking, and you are fine ‘either way’. Practices will certainly expedite through the middle. Inquire into it, learn from it - when it doesn’t feel good, notice it’s your thinking, you’re applying duality, dividing, separating. Find perspectives of unity, harmony, inclusion. 

When a ‘concern’ arises, when life gives you lemons, when situations ‘blow up’, that is the call for your self discovery, your expansion. There is nothing sweeter nor more satisfying than the experiencing of rising to that challenge, that calling. Except, maybe, the knowing that such challenges in life are the means to the greatness of life experience - when the come. You know? Being in the storm, knowing you are the calm, appreciating the storm. 

[ivankiss]

3 hours ago, Nahm said:

You’re in the middle, the confusion, like static between radio stations. This is good, all is well. 

You made a trap of:

If there is “them”, everything is ok.

If there is not “them”, everything is not ok.

The brain does that “duality”.

The heart doesn’t care about duality, rather, it wants only to know, to experience, and to express love more deeply. 

Just look around the room, and have a good laugh when you notice this is just thinking, and you are fine ‘either way’. Practices will certainly expedite through the middle. Inquire into it, learn from it - when it doesn’t feel good, notice it’s your thinking, you’re applying duality, dividing, separating. Find perspectives of unity, harmony, inclusion. 

When a ‘concern’ arises, when life gives you lemons, when situations ‘blow up’, that is the call for your self discovery, your expansion. There is nothing sweeter nor more satisfying than the experiencing of rising to that challenge, that calling. Except, maybe, the knowing that such challenges in life are the means to the greatness of life experience - when the come. You know? Being in the storm, knowing you are the calm, appreciating the storm. 

How can I practice not forgetting that I am the calm appreciating the storm? How can I be the unconditional love allowing the expression to unfold?Will everything unfold on its own or do I need to participate? Why am I afraid of not having everything explained and put in right place before fully letting go? I know I seize to exist once I seize to think. But I am not powerful enough to "resist" the urge to eventually return to thinking and call my thoughts my own. Who will do "the work" if I let go? Nobody? Where do I create everything from? Only here and now? Do I create at all? Or is there meant to be observance and allowing only? 

[ivankiss]

9 hours ago, ground said:

"Playing a game" is not an appropriate expression because in conventional parlance this may imply "to pretend" or even "to cheat".

In the abiding reality of primordial awareness everything is empty of inherent existence and thus empty of inherently existing as truth and this includes everything said and done and perceived, the one who says and does and perceives. Since awareness and emptiness are indivisible there cannot arise a sentiment of "playing a game". If such a sentiment is present then integration of awareness and "everyday life" has ceased and dormant habits have again gained control. That's not an issue since practice is about stabilizing this integration.

What if playing the game is my highest desire? What if I choose to be involved in the "storm"? What if I choose to keep my one eye closed? Can I harm myself or postpone my evolution in any way by choosing to do so? Am I allowed to do so? Is there even anyone who can allow or disallow me to do so? Am I asking anything that makes sense? Should I stop asking? Should I be playing? Is wanting to experiment, have fun and express against anything? Is wanting to feel and be involved a bad thing? Thank you for your clarifications  

Edited November 24, 2018 by ivankiss

[Nahm]

A flashlight is believing it is it’s light on the wall. How can the flashlight know it is the flashlight?

There’s nothing to remember, it is natural to breathe and let thought go! On Krypton, Superman is nothing special, on earth he is a superhero. In a world of overthinkers, the stomach breather is unbound, limitless, and appears as “more”, but in actuality, is far  far less, whole, fullfilled; satisfied in being.

Has awareness, not the thought  “awareness”, been present in meditations yet? 

1 hour ago, ivankiss said:

How can I be the unconditional love

Is Love known? 

Is Love known more deeply within you than any thought could touch?

Is even single thought needed, really? Will it bring you closer to Love, honestly?

Wouldn’t you need to limit Love to see it, to hear it? Is Love omnipresent and limitless, regardless of thought?

Do you already know the infinite nature of Love? Has it not purified your doubt & fear when you have surrendered to it? Is it not your home?

Unseen, unheard; as it IS - without limit, it IS everywhere & everything, it IS the connection of everywhere & everything & everyone, always, allowing you. It rests eternally. It will wait even beyond this life, it has no reason to infringe, to impose limit, to undermine for any limelight ; it knows itself as infinite. 

How are you missing the love for the lamp? Has it not been dark enough for you yet?

How are you missing your love for alignment? Have you not suffered enough yet?

1 hour ago, ivankiss said:

Why am I afraid of not having everything explained and put in right place before fully letting go?

    Because you’ve been thinking depreciating thoughts of self.  Those are just thoughts, untrue & wrong. Let those go now. Now, is when you begin loving.  In an illusion of pieces, you can never find the whole. You must let go. You are the whole. Your infinitude is so loving, I would not put it past you to create a universe and appear within it, as Ivan. 

1 hour ago, ivankiss said:

I know I seize to exist once I seize to think.

Oh ya? How do you know that is true?

1 hour ago, ivankiss said:

But I am not powerful enough to "resist" the urge to eventually return to thinking and call my thoughts my own.

See the counterintuitive; no power is needed, nothing to resist, thoughts are not yours. Millions of people exit The Tretyakov, without claiming it as theirs. Such are thoughts. They are of the museum, not of the admirers.   

1 hour ago, ivankiss said:

Who will do "the work" if I let go? Nobody? Where do I create everything from? Only here and now? Do I create at all? Or is there meant to be observance and allowing only?

The work is letting go. What is a somebody, what is a nobody - what would you even need such answers for? Will they take you somewhere else? Do you think there is somewhere more beautiful than being Ivan? Look at your hand. You can explain nothing! You can’t explain nothing! You can’t explain the first thing about how that is possible. Yet, you get to be it! Perhaps the magnitude of a miracle is that it appears ordinary. But the moment you stop taking it all for granted. 

1 hour ago, ivankiss said:

Where do I create everything from?

Now. 

1 hour ago, ivankiss said:

Do I create at all?

Do you create at all? Decide, Ivan. If you did not know English, nor me Russian, it would be really hard to come to know each other. Look at creating as a language.

A nice way to wake up, is to make your dreams come true. 

 

[ground]

18 minutes ago, ivankiss said:

What if plying the game is my highest desire? What if I choose to be involved in the "storm"? What if I choose to keep my one eye closed? Can I harm myself or postpone my evolution in any way by choosing to do so? Am I allowed to do so? Is there even anyone who can allow or disallow me do so? Am I asking anything that makes sense? Should I stop asking? Should I be playing? Is wanting to experiment, have fun and express against anything? Is wanting to feel and be involved a bad thing? Thank you for your clarifications  

Whatever you desire, choose or stop or pursue is not a question of being allowed or not being allowed. It is totally up to you. And whether what you desire, choose or stop or pursue has effects or not and if it has effects whether these are wanted or unwanted solely depends on whether there is delusion or not.

[Strikr]

I take my pleasure by increasing my knowledge, even the knowledge of not knowing or the knowledge of being nothing.  I m aware of it but they are CONCEPT, "I m eternal, and I m not."

My will remain strong as a rock, you can't wash what is true to the will, only the fear.

everything is a concept to the core, even being present, or being nothing.

believing you can "release free" people from their natural chain, is a delusion coming from the ego of some deluded guru.

everyone here is or deluded, or having fun. There is nothing to help or balance.

Nature balance itself, and you're it, so you can only balance yourself, alone or through your own echo.

or maybe we can separate us from nature, I can't say.

all concepts to my "I" could be true or pure mist, maybe god really give us free will.

we should try to know. that's the adventure.

free will, not free will, who fucking knows. No one, and if you think you have it trough some deluded experience, how can you know you aren't deluded ? you can't or you can. prove your model to yourself, if they work, they are "real"

there is many "yoga", karma yoga define me. ( but nothing I have been writting here is "real" )

Edited November 24, 2018 by Strikr

[ivankiss]

@Nahm That...Was...Intense...And...Extremely...Precise. Please be more gentle with me, haha. I needed to take a short walk to catch my breath. I noticed the subject starting to become an object. Everything got super synchronized. There is more fear. I guess I am not ready just yet, I want to take one step at a time. My cellular memory was not happy about this (if there is such a thing). I desperately needed to distract myself immediately...

I'll keep on reading through your answers day after day until I slowly merge with them. Thank you so much.

@ground Reading this, after the walk, grounded me a lot. Thank you.

@Strikr Thank you for your wisdom. I proved a lot to myself here, with your help. The question of free will is precisely that. A question.

Love you all so much.

No further questions.

Edited November 24, 2018 by ivankiss