Failed at Stage Orange - how do I go back?

[Wisebaxter]

@Nahm If we're one and the same how can you be Maya? Is this some kind of paradox? 

[Nahm]

@Wisebaxter There might be a few people in your dreams at night, but when you wake up, there’s only one. This too, is a “dream”. (Just using the quotes because there’s not a word for the actuality, or rather, if I say a word to you, or you to me, then the point to be communicated is already falsified. The word nonduality is possibly the best pointer)

Don’t start thinking about this though, as that’ll only take you further from ‘seeing’ what I’m saying. The usual suspects are the way (practices, psychedelics, retreats, etc). Thinking is the opposite ‘direction’. However, that silence you’re “in” - same over here (still an analogy though). 

[Wisebaxter]

@Serotoninluv Forgot to say, thank you for this great explanation RE the process of shifting stages 

[non_nothing]

On 11/20/2018 at 5:24 AM, Wisebaxter said:

So I kept getting sacked from jobs all the time or just quitting. I've always disliked Orange as my family are Orange and they're a bunch of shallow ass-clowns. I feel like I'm balls-deep in Yellow with my tip in Turquoise at the moment as I'm reading lots, seeing the bigger picture, unravelling my ego,

Keep the work going (meditation), but be aware, you're so much having definitions over each sentence, defining you, even a bit worse is defining that you're improving. It's very okay to mentally feedback and affirm yourself to you're improving but I must warn you of EGO's trap "the process"

On 11/20/2018 at 5:24 AM, Wisebaxter said:

Do I really need to dive into that shit and learn how to make some money? My music isn't making me money yet as I'm not advanced enough at it. 

As for Green, I did do a care job for a couple of years and looked after mentally ill people and I've always cared about others, but my social skills suck ass.

Look this is the first time actually me having conceptualizing this, but yeah you gave me point to begin this. Other people in other threads are welcome to have benefit and point to this post also.

 

Orange is very well specialized in "CAPITAL". He is the master, ruler, runs the whole WORLD's economy, doings, things, processes. There's no other stage that's far near Orange when it comes to this. Every stage will obey and fall after Orange. Sorry to tell you that Green will suck ass very badly when it battles against Orange and Orange will dominate him. I believe there's a misconception in you that you think upper stages are somehow better than its predecessor. No.

Think of when you're comparing orange against any other stage as a shark tries to battle with a lion on desert. You're very much trying to claim a war that's on their lands that already lost. Orange is what it is. Orange's weapon is money, economy, modern-slavery.

I don't mean you shouldn't pursue when I say "you're already lost" but there're sure other ways for sure. I'm putting it in this way especially exceptional just for your case here.

I'm sorry to tell you the following but I have to kick you in your ass, right now you're living in your comfort zone things are going great. Your mom might making all kind of cookies and sugars, GF giving blow jobs. You're living in your little dorm room whatever with your cute relationship going on. The reality is that nobody gives a single fuck about you, how you're right about your vision, what the fuck your emotions inside, how well you smoke weed, how green is the right stage, turquoise, you're actualizing bla bla, but the green is the ultimate goal of peace and happiness. You hate orange and O really? Those all one another fucking story you're telling to yourself of the whole post . You did the care-taker or whatever job because you seek comfort and approval, deep inside you know it you did. It was just another mask you were wearing because you hated your family and your psyche needed approval in such twisted way. Now that's why you're pursuing this mostly but something is smoking underneath. World is a cruel place. It smokes. And the best way of your psyche putting this in that way is through spiral dynamics. Because you hold a position where you're somewhat greater but you wish if this little thing was non existant the obstacle in front of you, the obstacle of orange. Ahh the fucking ass-clowns right? Well I guess I've made my point clear. 

If you have hard time conceptualizing this, let me pamper your intellectual mind in this way. If you were a hunter-gatherer, you had no choice but to hunt for food. Now the centruies later, human society (orange) developed a system for exchanging values. The money and economy. You've been put to this comfort stage by this system actually. I'd say you're a thankless wretch. Now the thing is money is the currency for exchanging values. What is value? A property, that human generates for an object.  For your primal needs, that equivalents some amount of money. Farmers produce food. Food is valuable. So they exchange it with money. Now you gotta put your ass off to generate value to the world in order for an exchange for money. That's all about it. Nobody cares about your meditations btw. But keep it going. 

[tenta]

Green builds on top of orange, and experiencing how unfair orange is, is what causes green

[tsuki]

Quote

Failed at Stage Orange - how do I go back?

@Wisebaxter You have failed only if you have given up.

[Wisebaxter]

@non_nothing Lol is that you dad? No seriously you got me over a barrel, you know me too well. I'm an ungrateful snivelling little wretch stuck in ego, concept land. I did do that care job for approval as I felt like I was a worthless son of a bitch and it made me feel better about myself. Hey, I still feel good about doing it though  So, I'm just trying to summarise your actual 'advice' aside from all the brutal 'home truths' and ass kickings. You're saying to man the fuck up and go and nail orange? 
Thanks for pointing out that I was assuming higher stages were somehow better than lower ones. I was falling into a classic trap there. Thanks for taking the time for write all of that too and helping me out 

Edited November 29, 2018 by Wisebaxter

[Wisebaxter]

@tenta

On 26/11/2018 at 11:00 AM, tenta said:

Green builds on top of orange, and experiencing how unfair orange is, is what causes green

I like this answer. It makes me feel like I don't have to go and dick around with Orange any more. But I have a bad feeling it just appeals to my sense of weakness and laziness, and to my misconception that Green is somehow better so I'm above Orange. The more I think about it the more I know, deep down, that I need to go back to Orange and do it properly, in my own way 

[zambize]

On 11/19/2018 at 8:24 PM, Wisebaxter said:

I could never settle into stage Orange as I was too much of a goddam hippy rebel and kept smoking too much weed and not giving a shit about conforming or listening to authority. So I kept getting sacked from jobs all the time or just quitting. I've always disliked Orange as my family are Orange and they're a bunch of shallow ass-clowns. I feel like I'm balls-deep in Yellow with my tip in Turquoise at the moment as I'm reading lots, seeing the bigger picture, unravelling my ego, meditating every day and spending all my time self-actualising. However my finances just aren't there. I claim benefits and live with my girlfriend, who works while I do the house work haha. I can still afford to eat, I have a gym membership and not working does give me plenty of time to self-actualize and work on my life purpose (music production) but the spectre of Orange still haunts me. Do I really need to dive into that shit and learn how to make some money? My music isn't making me money yet as I'm not advanced enough at it. 

As for Green, I did do a care job for a couple of years and looked after mentally ill people and I've always cared about others, but my social skills suck ass. I have no friends, no social life and so my ability to feel love for others and experience an emotional range through having deep relationships just isn't there. 

I feel happy where I am and making great progress with meditation and not giving a shit about success or having lots of money (although I'm not completely detached from that need yet) so do I really need to go and do orange? Like, don my suit and go and work in an office with a bunch of apes? Maybe it would be good for me as I could nail some green too whilst I'm there (be an agony aunt for the apes) and also afford some nootropics and psychedelics. Taking psychedelics could help me shed any remaining fixations I have with money and help be figure out what's going wrong with my social skills...

What are your thoughts? 

I don't want to overuse spiral dynamics too much because I feel like it already is over applied. However, my thoughts are just where does this road lead for you.  Some of the language used like "work in an office with a bunch of apes?" makes me think that there is a fairly strong negative attitude towards these people.  This road leads to love, and not just love of love, but love of mankind.  I understand the darkside of orange, but there is also a lot of beauty to capitalism.  It brought wealth and technology, which in turn gave us the money and time of day to be on these forum discussing these "orange apes".  I really believe moving forward will entail being able to love these apes, and truly seek to raise their level of consciousness.  Remember, while they may come off as apes, a lot of them lived loveless childhoods and only ever learned about achievement from their parents.  Some kids don't get affection, and some kids grow up in other parts of the world that don't have the niceties we have to develop as far as we have.  You've been blessed with a gift, you are on a forums with multiple enlightened people, and access to any knowledge from the internet you could possibly need. I think me and you should use that blessing to help instead of complain that we have to deal with others who weren't as  blessed as us.  I would totally recommend taking psychedelics, doesn't hurt to work into them slowly, really depends on how confident you feel and your mental state, although maybe you've done them? Anyways, much love and I wish you the best in figuring this out

[Wisebaxter]

48 minutes ago, zambize said:

I don't want to overuse spiral dynamics too much because I feel like it already is over applied. However, my thoughts are just where does this road lead for you.  Some of the language used like "work in an office with a bunch of apes?" makes me think that there is a fairly strong negative attitude towards these people.  This road leads to love, and not just love of love, but love of mankind.  I understand the darkside of orange, but there is also a lot of beauty to capitalism.  It brought wealth and technology, which in turn gave us the money and time of day to be on these forum discussing these "orange apes".  I really believe moving forward will entail being able to love these apes, and truly seek to raise their level of consciousness.  Remember, while they may come off as apes, a lot of them lived loveless childhoods and only ever learned about achievement from their parents.  Some kids don't get affection, and some kids grow up in other parts of the world that don't have the niceties we have to develop as far as we have.  You've been blessed with a gift, you are on a forums with multiple enlightened people, and access to any knowledge from the internet you could possibly need. I think me and you should use that blessing to help instead of complain that we have to deal with others who weren't as  blessed as us.  I would totally recommend taking psychedelics, doesn't hurt to work into them slowly, really depends on how confident you feel and your mental state, although maybe you've done them? Anyways, much love and I wish you the best in figuring this out

Very well said, thank you very much for pointing out the harsh nature of my language to me. Part of it is for humour and effect but there's definitely some hang ups there so you're not wrong. I had some pretty awful experiences working in offices wherein I felt really rejected and deflated but if I'm honest I had it coming and also I only suffered in my pride. I'm come along way since then and I now believe in showing love and kindness to everybody no matter what, so I don't know what happened with my post. Well, I kind of do...I guess I still have some baggage tucked away. 

I'm working my way up to psychedelics and plan to take some AL-LAD just after Christmas. I've been doing some shadow work to rid myself of some of these issues and if there's anything left by that time then the substance will show me what it is - I'm hoping. 

I am blessed like you say and moving forward I don't want to judge, ever. I'm going to go to these Orange people with my heart open and treat them as equals. Everyone can teach you something right? 

[zambize]

2 minutes ago, Wisebaxter said:

Very well said, thank you very much for pointing out the harsh nature of my language to me. Part of it is for humour and effect but there's definitely some hang ups there so you're not wrong. I had some pretty awful experiences working in offices wherein I felt really rejected and deflated but if I'm honest I had it coming and also I only suffered in my pride. I'm come along way since then and I now believe in showing love and kindness to everybody no matter what, so I don't know what happened with my post. Well, I kind of do...I guess I still have some baggage tucked away. 

I'm working my way up to psychedelics and plan to take some AL-LAD just after Christmas. I've been doing some shadow work to rid myself of some of these issues and if there's anything left by that time then the substance will show me what it is - I'm hoping. 

I am blessed like you say and moving forward I don't want to judge, ever. I'm going to go to these Orange people with my heart open and treat them as equals. Everyone can teach you something right? 

That sounds awesome, if you need advice on the future in terms of spiritual work on acid, me and a lot of other people on this forums have experience and would love to lend a hand.  On top of that, Leo specifically did a video on how to use psychedelics in a way that is based off of spiritual growth rather than just having fun, which I also recommend, music with eyes closed is so beautiful if you give yourself to the experience.  Also we all use language like that, I totally get it, I just wanted to make sure, sounds like you'll be kicking ass

[CreamCat]

If you mess up at lower stages, you will mess up at higher stages.

If you screw up at Beige(e.g. Not having enough sleep), everything you do is going to be futile.

You screwed up at Orange. You don't have enough money to meet your basic needs satisfactorily. You need at least financial comfort. But, you should make as much money as possible while doing what you like. You should also want success in mastering life. Orange is not just about money. It is about progress and success.

Until you master Orange, you won't be able to master Green and Yellow. (i.e. Can a starving man think about helping others?)

I think it's good to go down to lower stages and master them before moving up. You probably need to work on Beige and other lower stages, too.

Edited November 29, 2018 by CreamCat

[non_nothing]

5 hours ago, Wisebaxter said:

@non_nothing Lol is that you dad? No seriously you got me over a barrel, you know me too well. I'm an ungrateful snivelling little wretch stuck in ego, concept land. I did do that care job for approval as I felt like I was a worthless son of a bitch and it made me feel better about myself. Hey, I still feel good about doing it though  So, I'm just trying to summarise your actual 'advice' aside from all the brutal 'home truths' and ass kickings. You're saying to man the fuck up and go and nail orange? 
Thanks for pointing out that I was assuming higher stages were somehow better than lower ones. I was falling into a classic trap there. Thanks for taking the time for write all of that too and helping me out 

You have valuable keys held. It is been seen that you now going to achieve the life you want. On the path, stay tuned in and keep seeking the truth in heart.

[Wisebaxter]

@zambize

19 hours ago, zambize said:

That sounds awesome, if you need advice on the future in terms of spiritual work on acid, me and a lot of other people on this forums have experience and would love to lend a hand.  On top of that, Leo specifically did a video on how to use psychedelics in a way that is based off of spiritual growth rather than just having fun, which I also recommend, music with eyes closed is so beautiful if you give yourself to the experience.  Also we all use language like that, I totally get it, I just wanted to make sure, sounds like you'll be kicking ass

Hey man, yeah I've checked out Leo's videos on psychedelics, they're great aren't they. I'm doing what he suggested and taking the time to set my intention before I trip, the questions I want answers to etc. I bought some acid today actually so I'm gonna wait for the right time and get on the case with that. How often do you use psychedelics? Have you tried 5-Meo? That sounds like the holy grail. You sound like a really cool dude. Thanks for helping 

[Wisebaxter]

@zambize

19 hours ago, zambize said:

That sounds awesome, if you need advice on the future in terms of spiritual work on acid, me and a lot of other people on this forums have experience and would love to lend a hand.  On top of that, Leo specifically did a video on how to use psychedelics in a way that is based off of spiritual growth rather than just having fun, which I also recommend, music with eyes closed is so beautiful if you give yourself to the experience.  Also we all use language like that, I totally get it, I just wanted to make sure, sounds like you'll be kicking ass

Hey man, yeah I've checked out Leo's videos on psychedelics, they're great aren't they. I'm doing what he suggested and taking the time to set my intention before I trip, the questions I want answers to etc. I bought some acid today actually so I'm gonna wait for the right time and get on the case with that. How often do you use psychedelics? Have you tried 5-Meo? That sounds like the holy grail. You sound like a really cool dude. Thanks for helping 

16 hours ago, non_nothing said:

You have valuable keys held. It is been seen that you now going to achieve the life you want. On the path, stay tuned in and keep seeking the truth in heart.

@non_nothing Thanks man! Those are very encouraging words. much appreciated  

[Haumea2018]

Quote

Its a model, a fantastical depiction of a few swirls in the ocean of sociology which a few guys jumped on and made a language game about. And now we got hippies like you trying to see the whole personal development game through this language game. 

It's just another ego and status game.