Are psychedelics my next step?

[wingsofwax]

I've been wondering about my next step is in my spiritual development. My current plan is simply to continue my current regimen, but if anyone has any suggestions, I am open to them. I'm thinking that psychedelics might be a good idea for me. Let me describe my situation.

I've been meditating daily (1 hour minimum) for close to 2 years now and have developed a good level of concentration. I'm doing concentration meditation with intermittent bouts of insight meditation.

I'm also doing yoga on a daily basis - simple poses like those described by Gary Weber.

I'm reading a lot. Maybe half of Leo's book list. Currently reading Daniel Ingram's Mastering the core teachings of the Buddha, and it is amazing. Perfect for me at this point.

I've had some spiritual experiences (6 months of kriyas), but no real direct experience of non-duality.

So what other parameters are important when figuring out if psychedelics are right for me?

 

 

Edited November 19, 2018 by wingsofwax
spelling

[zambize]

Hmmmm,  I think you should really be trying acid and shrooms, I'd say go with either.   I've had more experience with acid than shrooms so i'll give you a sense of how I think of the drug and my use of it.  I think for the trips there are two parts of it, there is kind of times when the drug is still kicking in or falling off, you feel like you have one foot still in reality even though you can clearly tell you are high.  In this stage it doesn't really matter, I personally last time really focused on getting better at channeling love for the universe, because I tend towards a bit too rational and unemotional, which I want to work.  So I was just sitting on the bed channeling this loving energy/acceptance into my abdomen where most of my emotions tend to bubble up, hoping that I can get some really strong stuff to come out.  These emotions can be accompanied by closed eyed visuals even when the drug is still kicking in.  As with weed and what not, close your eyes and it's quite a bit stronger of a drug.  The other case is when you've taken a tab and a half or more, probably like an eighth of shrooms or more, and at that point my best results come from surrendering the fuck over to the moment, because otherwise I'm sure I'd get steamrolled trying to hold onto everything.  Also don't worry if the visuals get kind of gross or even hellish...  I definitely saw some really gorey stuff, but just kind of laughed it off as ridiculous, and within twenty minutes I was back to having more cosmic and beautiful visuals. 

If you're worried and are a control freak, maybe do a contemplation with just a fraction of a tab, say 1/4.

If you are confident in your ability to surrender and are general mentally healthy, love yourself etc.  I see no reason you couldn't take a tab or more, but I don't necessarily see any harm in ramping up.  So maybe start with one, and then after that if you feel ready, a tab and a half to two tabs would probably be really beneficial moving forward with your development. 

Also for professional opinion compared to mine...

Best of Luck!

 

 

[Leo Gura]

@wingsofwax You are more than ready. Your mind will be blown.

[Joseph Maynor]

Give yourself time.  Remember, all that matters is your vision.  It's a stubbornness to being you that eventually brings you to success in personal development. 

Edited November 19, 2018 by Joseph Maynor

[Nahm]

@wingsofwax Sound ready. Start with small doses. ? Excited for ya man. 

[wingsofwax]

Thank you all. Can you say something about which psychedelic will be most helpful considering my situation? Do they all create the same result?

[Tetcher]

I think you should keep doing your work. You seem very dedicated, you managed to follow such discipline without prior use of psychedelics.

Psychedelics will take you in another direction. If you get there with psychedelics you will be dependent on them to have experiences. If you get there through meditation it will be a highway for growth.

Try them if you wish but there is no guarantee it will not close doors for you.

[zambize]

3 minutes ago, Tetcher said:

If you get there with psychedelics you will be dependent on them to have experiences.

Could you source this or explain the reasoning behind this?  I personally have not felt this way about the drug, but i'd be interested in seeing why you feel this way. My guess is that this stems somewhat from the idea that there are no magic pills, and that magic pills are in some way immoral or the improper route of growth.  For me, fuck that, acid has allowed me to see some beautiful things, and those doors seem as open as ever. It's been a while since I could sit in the window sill and just enjoy the rays of sun coming in to hit my skin, and that's the direction acid takes me in more and more after each experience.  Anyways, best of luck, and you are completely right that it is impressive how much he has accomplished without psychedelics, just really think it's worth it

[Forestluv]

1 hour ago, Tetcher said:

If you get there with psychedelics you will be dependent on them to have experiences. If you get there through meditation it will be a highway for growth.

Psychedelics are among the lowest dependency substances (as shown by various studies). Psychedelic dependency is well below caffeine dependency. There are risks with psychedelics, yet dependency is way down on the list.

There are lots of different spiritual tools: meditation, yoga, cultural immersion, retreats, self inquiry, contemplation journaling, psychedelics, shamanic breathing etc. They ALL have value. Which tools are of most value is dependent upon an individual and their place in life. 

Self exploration is great to discover which tools a person resonates with and which combination. For example, someone might have a foundation of daily meditation, combined with contemplative journaling twice a week and a psychedelic trip once every two months. There are lots of possibilities.

I would just recommend respecting psychedelics and to do research and preparation prior to the first trip. And if you are under 24, I would have a bit more caution.

[Scholar]

2 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

Psychedelics are among the lowest dependency substances (as shown by various studies). Psychedelic dependency is well below caffeine dependency. There are risks with psychedelics, yet dependency is way down on the list.

There are lots of different spiritual tools: meditation, yoga, cultural immersion, retreats, self inquiry, contemplation journaling, psychedelics, shamanic breathing etc. They ALL have value. Which tools are of most value is dependent upon an individual and their place in life. 

Self exploration is great to discover which tools a person resonates with and which combination. For example, someone might have a foundation of daily meditation, combined with contemplative journaling twice a week and a psychedelic trip once every two months. There are lots of possibilities.

I would just recommend respecting psychedelics and to do research and preparation prior to the first trip. And if you are under 24, I would have a bit more caution.

I think he meant that taking psychedelics might make you unable to properly get to non-dual states by traditional means, in which case you will need more psychedelics to properly develop. The shortcut would "steal" emotional growth that otherwise you would have have to go through to get such an experience.

 

[SgtPepper]

you are more than ready. Psychedelics can certainly be your next step, but that is up to you.

 

[Forestluv]

1 hour ago, Scholar said:

I think he meant that taking psychedelics might make you unable to properly get to non-dual states by traditional means, in which case you will need more psychedelics to properly develop. The shortcut would "steal" emotional growth that otherwise you would have have to go through to get such an experience.

 

Looks like I misinterpreted. Thanks for the clarity.

For this, I would say psychedelics are nearly guaranteed to create a nondual experience. It is also a "fast track" in a sense. And I would agree that many seekers will want to use psychedelics as a tool over time - perhaps one trip per month for a while. The risk of dependency/addiction would be low tho.

[Tetcher]

15 hours ago, zambize said:

Could you source this or explain the reasoning behind this?  I personally have not felt this way about the drug, but i'd be interested in seeing why you feel this way. My guess is that this stems somewhat from the idea that there are no magic pills, and that magic pills are in some way immoral or the improper route of growth.  For me, fuck that, acid has allowed me to see some beautiful things, and those doors seem as open as ever. It's been a while since I could sit in the window sill and just enjoy the rays of sun coming in to hit my skin, and that's the direction acid takes me in more and more after each experience.  Anyways, best of luck, and you are completely right that it is impressive how much he has accomplished without psychedelics, just really think it's worth it

Psychedelics will show you their own things in their own way. Even if you experience ego wash the background feeling of the whole trip, during the trip or after ego reforms, is still very psychedelic in nature. And once you falsely think you attained to truth there is no guarantee that you will be able to get higher order of truth through stable meditation.

Typically look at the enlightenment video from Leo. He's having some experience, at the beginning he is very excited and in awe then near the end he's getting more depressed and bored, the swing of mood is caused by the psychedelic, this is not different than alcohol. And this mood is the important point actually not the content of the trip that he's describing.

Leo is an intense seeker and he may arrive to the ultimate someday but so far I am not convinced. Actualized.org is a nice cozy place that he built for himself and others, but he built it at a time when he was not taking psychedelics, since then he's taking them and I don't see much growth, he simply living in the continuity of what he initiated then.

The psychedelics, by giving him a sense of being in truth, enabled him to get a very assertive and dismissive tone on this forum and in his videos and I can see he's enjoying it a lot. But he better be sure he's not missing the point entirely.

The worst part is that he knows what I'm speaking about. In a video he described actualized.org as "solid shit " as opposed to the liquid shit of mainstream culture. That is in line with my understanding. But despite knowing this he still decides to be complacent with it...

So yes, I think op is closer to enlightenment than psychonautes because without support of any kind he was able to do the practices for 2years, he shouldn't waste that. Psychedelics will only make him hallucinatory.

 

 

Edited November 20, 2018 by Tetcher