I refers to the body

[Dodo]

34 minutes ago, DrewNows said:

@DodoUsually spiritual comes after material wealth/desire...looks like you have some seeking/work to be done yet before you can turn back to self inquiry 

When you can begin Truth seeking these obstacles will no longer be in the mind. If you want more material wealth/success you can investigate your beliefs surrounding these matters...

How can you end and create a belief? Is it possible to embody the idea of a successful person if you still have limiting beliefs surrounding it? How are you not being completely 100% honest with yourself? 

I just need a million bucks to drop from somewhere and I'll show you how I can embody that idea. It's easy ti make money when you have money. 

Edited November 11, 2018 by Dodo

[Dodo]

36 minutes ago, DrewNows said:

@DodoUsually spiritual comes after material wealth/desire...looks like you have some seeking/work to be done yet before you can turn back to self inquiry 

When you can begin Truth seeking these obstacles will no longer be in the mind. If you want more material wealth/success you can investigate your beliefs surrounding these matters...

How can you end and create a belief? Is it possible to embody the idea of a successful person if you still have limiting beliefs surrounding it? How are you not being completely 100% honest with yourself? 

I don't want to seek Truth. It's dumb to seek Truth. Truth is always here now,why should I seek it? It's only logical to seek that which you do not have. If I already have it I do not need to seek it. That's why I seek money.

 

[DrewNows]

6 minutes ago, Dodo said:

I just need a million bucks to drop from somewhere and I'll show you how I can embody that idea. It's easy ti make money when you have money. 

just as it is easy to lose im sure. What can money bring you? 

Do you think that maybe your desire for money is what's preventing you from attaining it? I'd look into those beliefs 

[Shadowraix]

2 hours ago, Hellspeed said:

No Body, No Awareness. 

The identification with the outside of one's body is the dogma of the east. Same dogma happens in Christianity in different images. 

Awareness is an inherent feature. The separation between us as considered living things and considered non-living isn't that great. 

The identification other than the body is about realizing separation is a perception. Its a useful tool but does not mean it exists in the absolute.

[FoxFoxFox]

@Dodo In the absolute, there is no such thing as "I", "awareness", "hunger", "thoughts", "emotions", "feelings" etc. Awareness is just is. In the words of Sri Ramana: "I am that I am." meaning that awareness which is already you, simply is. You are not the words you use to describe the qualities of experience. Therefore you are not hungry, thirsty etc. but just are. The ultimate goal here, is to BE awareness, not KNOW awareness in the traditional sense of knowing it with your logic. Look at a flower without there being someone who is looking, something that is being looked at, and ultimately the act of "looking." Enlightenment is a very simple thing. All one has to do, is to realize that there is no such thing as an "I". I recommend the self-inquiry method. In this practice, whenever there is a thought or feeling or emotion arises, you simply ask, "who is it that is becoming aware of this thought/emotion/feeling?" You will automatically answer: "I am." By inquiring into the nature of this "I" and realizing that it itself is a thought, that arises for no one, you shall realize yourself to be a field of awareness rather than a concept. 

[Dodo]

2 hours ago, FoxFoxFox said:

@Dodo In the absolute, there is no such thing as "I", "awareness", "hunger", "thoughts", "emotions", "feelings" etc. Awareness is just is. In the words of Sri Ramana: "I am that I am." meaning that awareness which is already you, simply is. You are not the words you use to describe the qualities of experience. Therefore you are not hungry, thirsty etc. but just are. The ultimate goal here, is to BE awareness, not KNOW awareness in the traditional sense of knowing it with your logic. Look at a flower without there being someone who is looking, something that is being looked at, and ultimately the act of "looking." Enlightenment is a very simple thing. All one has to do, is to realize that there is no such thing as an "I". I recommend the self-inquiry method. In this practice, whenever there is a thought or feeling or emotion arises, you simply ask, "who is it that is becoming aware of this thought/emotion/feeling?" You will automatically answer: "I am." By inquiring into the nature of this "I" and realizing that it itself is a thought, that arises for no one, you shall realize yourself to be a field of awareness rather than a concept. 

I am never identified as 'hungry'. That is just misunderstanding. 

Ofcourse my identity is not "Hungry". But I am feeling hungry!!  You are over simplifying things because you read some Ramana Maharshi or Eckhart Tolle. 

Ofcourse I am not the hunger, but I still need to put food in my stomach or i will suffer, no matter how much I manipulate myself into believing I am not hungry,  the feeling of hunger doesnt care what my identity is.

Perhaps your suggestion is a fast track to anorexia. I dont want that. 

[Dodo]

2 hours ago, FoxFoxFox said:

@Dodo In the absolute, there is no such thing as "I", "awareness", "hunger", "thoughts", "emotions", "feelings" etc. Awareness is just is. In the words of Sri Ramana: "I am that I am." meaning that awareness which is already you, simply is. You are not the words you use to describe the qualities of experience. Therefore you are not hungry, thirsty etc. but just are. The ultimate goal here, is to BE awareness, not KNOW awareness in the traditional sense of knowing it with your logic. Look at a flower without there being someone who is looking, something that is being looked at, and ultimately the act of "looking." Enlightenment is a very simple thing. All one has to do, is to realize that there is no such thing as an "I". I recommend the self-inquiry method. In this practice, whenever there is a thought or feeling or emotion arises, you simply ask, "who is it that is becoming aware of this thought/emotion/feeling?" You will automatically answer: "I am." By inquiring into the nature of this "I" and realizing that it itself is a thought, that arises for no one, you shall realize yourself to be a field of awareness rather than a concept. 

I am a human being and a human being has needs such as hunger, thirst etcetera which need to be met. If they arent met, the life that a human is will fade.and i have no evidence of life apart from this one human life ai am experiencing. 

This life as pure awareness that doesnt need anything is just a sales pitch that is given to a human being in suffering so as to make the human confused. It doesnt solve the humans problems. It is my experience that I am an alive human being and there is something magical about trusting your experience.

Part of that magic is not dropping dead from hunger and thirst because you are identified as an empty space of awareness. The space is there, yes, but it is not me, the space of awareness is God!! The creator, the one that allows the human to exist.

[FoxFoxFox]

@Dodo The idea is not to manipulate the body to not feeling hungry. That is not it at all. The idea is to let go of all identification with an ego, the "I" who thinks is the one experiencing hunger. Let go of "I". Let go of the thought of hunger. Let go of all the names you use to label pockets of reality. In doing so your identification with the objects of reality dissolves. What is left is pure being. Be that. The issue here is that we are trying to explain something very simple, something that you already are, and the tendency of the mind overcomplicate things.

[FoxFoxFox]

When this happens. The body will go about on its daily grind, drinking water, eating food etc. etc. All by itself. Of course, in the state i am describing, there is no longer a body who does anything. There is just reality.

[Dodo]

24 minutes ago, FoxFoxFox said:

When this happens. The body will go about on its daily grind, drinking water, eating food etc. etc. All by itself. Of course, in the state i am describing, there is no longer a body who does anything. There is just reality.

I am pretty sure that the body without a sense of self will just be like a baby - that type of person would need to be cared for by the others (more egoic) individuals, because such an entity that does not care for its existence cannot survive. 

The Buddha was staying under a tree not eating for many many days (allegedly), until an identified being came to him and forced him to eat. He was becoming insane. He needed some sanity. Then he started eating and all was well. He understood that being empty awareness alone is throwing the baby with the bath water. Identification with body IS NEEDED. 

[Dodo]

31 minutes ago, FoxFoxFox said:

@Dodo The idea is not to manipulate the body to not feeling hungry. That is not it at all. The idea is to let go of all identification with an ego, the "I" who thinks is the one experiencing hunger. Let go of "I". Let go of the thought of hunger. Let go of all the names you use to label pockets of reality. In doing so your identification with the objects of reality dissolves. What is left is pure being. Be that. The issue here is that we are trying to explain something very simple, something that you already are, and the tendency of the mind overcomplicate things.

There is no thought of hunger, there is just the feeling/sensation of hunger which is irrelevant to my thoughts. I could be thinking I am a clown living on mars, but hunger would still appear if I do not eat. I am a human irrelevant to what I think I am also. I was a human as a baby, even though I wasn't thinking I am a human. This problem of thinking does not apply to me, I can become free of thought by paying attention to the spaces between thoughts. This does not stop hunger. And I need to be identified with the body in order for the body to act as a unit and go do something about it. 

Sitting there expecting God to magically poof you a bowl of soup and spoon feed you is useless as it has never happened before and will never happen. You are either going to be saved by your own identification with the body or by another person's identification with body. If noone identified as a body, the body would die - period. You are saying to yourself you are not identified with the body and yet let me ask you a simple question: Do you have hands? If you do, then you are not awareness, but a human body. Let me remind you that awareness does not have hands. The simplicity of this fact is probably what makes it so hard for you to grasp!! You are human bro!!

[FoxFoxFox]

@Dodo There is two levels of identification here. Identification with thought, and identification with the body.

Things to consider:

First, regarding thoughts: having an empty mind is not the same as not identifying with thoughts. In fact, the mind could be very busy, but as long as there is no identification with it, then it's of no issue. In the absolute, the mind itself does not exist, nor do thoughts. For this to occur, you have to realize how thoughts are not reality, but an attempt at dividing reality into pieces. These pieces, are concepts, or thoughts. They are not the real thing, but mental representations. And Thought of thought is itself a thought! The sages say, that you are already enlightened. All that you have to do, is to get rid of believing that you are not, which is realizing that concepts you hold and believe to be are not the truth of who you are. Another way to put it, is that ignorance (as opposed to enlightenment) is only distraction with concepts. 

Second, regarding the body: Again, the idea is not to get rid of the feeling of hunger, or the need for food, but rather losing identification with either of those concepts. In the absolute there is no such thing as 'feeling' or 'need for food'. Reality, you, simply is. That's we say, I am who I am. Nothing more, nothing less. But again, even "I am" does not exist in the absolute.The point is that reality exists by itself, independent of the various forms and names attributed to it. Realize this.

[non_nothing]

18 hours ago, Dodo said:

This is a quick and simple one: 
I am hungry. Awareness is not hungry, I am hungry and need to eat, so I go and get something to eat. If I didn't hold any identity that my body is "I" I would not be able to survive (The body would die, this form of life will die). [1]

I need to go to the toilet. Awareness does not need to go to the toilet. I need to go to the toilet so I go to the toilet. Awareness doesn't go anywhere, it stays present in all situations beyond space and time. The body goes to the toilet, and if I was not identified with the body one bit, I, the body, would piss itself every time. [2]

When it comes to the word/thought "I", it does not refer to awareness[3]. Awareness is God. I am a body-mind, all that I know is a world filtered through the perceptions of that body mind. Awareness is nothing, Ego is everything. Hmmm Or am I going crazy? Who is the I that is going crazy? It can't be awareness going crazy for sure!!! 

So is the only possibility of happiness to be a grass or a tree? Tell me please. Can one be happy as a human being? 

First, I did not read the whole thread maybe someone else had told the same but I'd tell you things to consider:

[1]: You still hold to an identity of "I don't eat", this is the exactly same as eating. i.e it's none to do with awareness, it doesn't mean if you don't identify with "eating" then you automaticaly identify with "awareness". actually you can't escape the duality that way, you go in circles. now you identified with "you ("I")  not eathing"

 

[2]: same goes here, you identify yourself with pissing everyhere. your play the same game here.

[3]: You have to go deeper in self-inquiry. Keep doing it. Read RM's work pdfs are all around online

EDIT: Useful fun and easy watch & understand video by Sri. Mooji

 

Edited November 12, 2018 by non_nothing

[Dodo]

59 minutes ago, non_nothing said:

First, I did not read the whole thread maybe someone else had told the same but I'd tell you things to consider:

[1]: You still hold to an identity of "I don't eat", this is the exactly same as eating. i.e it's none to do with awareness, it doesn't mean if you don't identify with "eating" then you automaticaly identify with "awareness". actually you can't escape the duality that way, you go in circles. now you identified with "you ("I")  not eathing"

 

[2]: same goes here, you identify yourself with pissing everyhere. your play the same game here.

[3]: You have to go deeper in self-inquiry. Keep doing it. Read RM's work pdfs are all around online

EDIT: Useful fun and easy watch & understand video by Sri. Mooji

 

I wouldnt be identifying with pissing my pants, I would just be doing it like an animal. See a tree and go piss. No waiting for a toilet, because you need to identify as human for that... 

[non_nothing]

Just now, Dodo said:

I wouldnt be identifying with pissing my pants, I would just be doing it like an animal. See a tree and go piss. No waiting for a toilet, because you need to identify as human for that... 

You couldn't be identified with anything if you did not wish it. That's the law destroys your assumption. If you stay in the heart, that I've given to you is the most powerful key in the whole universe.

[Flammable]

@Dodo The thought 'I am a human' is still perceived.  By whom?

Edited November 12, 2018 by Flammable

[Dodo]

1 hour ago, Flammable said:

@Dodo The thought 'I am a human' is still perceived.  By whom?

By the human that is not a thought. 

[Dodo]

1 hour ago, Flammable said:

@Dodo The thought 'I am a human' is still perceived.  By whom?

When you're having sex with your girlfriend, are you having sex with a thought?  There is a tangible human being which is not a thought. It's oversimplifying things to claim that human is just a thought!! 

All yor girlfriends are imaginary?

[Dodo]

1 hour ago, non_nothing said:

You couldn't be identified with anything if you did not wish it. That's the law destroys your assumption. If you stay in the heart, that I've given to you is the most powerful key in the whole universe.

I am identified as the body, because I am the body. If I wished to identify as a tree, it would be way harder, because I dont see the world through the perspective of a tree. 

If it smells like human, walks like human, talks like human, acts like human, then im pretty sure its human!!! (Me)

 

[Flammable]

9 minutes ago, Dodo said:

I am identified as the body, because I am the body. If I wished to identify as a tree, it would be way harder, because I dont see the world through the perspective of a tree. 

If it smells like human, walks like human, talks like human, acts like human, then im pretty sure its human!!! (Me)

 

Cool. You cracked it  I hope you become a millionaire 

Edited November 12, 2018 by Flammable