Posted February 9, 2019 (edited) @winterknight i totally agree with you, in a sense yes i am talking about a system like the eight fold path because self-inquiry doesn't ensure that you develop in this way. it ensures that you find the true nature of the self which is the buddah nature in my opinion. yes other hindu systems exsist, but how comes self-inquiry (the method itself, while doing it) isn't able to encorporate such values and beliefs. to me its pure direct cut to the truth. but enlightenment doesn't garuntee development or maturation of the self and the method of self inquiry does not either. where as the method of reaching your buddahood has it incorporated into the structure as a whole. i guess what i'm really asking if enligthenment is enlightenment without any distinction is the end of self inquiry the same as reaching buddahnature? or does it exclude the development in certain areas. Edited February 9, 2019 by Aakash Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 14 minutes ago, Aakash said: @winterknight i totally agree with you, in a sense yes i am talking about a system like the eight fold path because self-inquiry doesn't ensure that you develop in this way. it ensures that you find the true nature of the self which is the buddah nature in my opinion. yes other hindu systems exsist, but how comes self-inquiry (the method itself, while doing it) isn't able to encorporate such values and beliefs. to me its pure direct cut to the truth. but enlightenment doesn't garuntee development or maturation of the self and the method of self inquiry does not either. where as the method of reaching your buddahood has it incorporated into the structure as a whole. i guess what i'm really asking if enligthenment is enlightenment without any distinction is the end of self inquiry the same as reaching buddahnature? or does it exclude the development in certain areas. As I said above, usually it is a requirement that someone who successfully takes on self-inquiry have a quiet enough mind to pursue it. That usually means they would have pursued development before self-inquiry. In the Hindu texts self-inquiry is recommended for a mature seeker who has already developed in many ways. Usually, but not always. There are always exceptions. Self-inquiry doesn't aim at personal development; it aims at transcending the personal. Yes, enlightenment is enlightenment without distinction. Yes, enlightenment from self-inquiry is the same as buddha nature. All the other development of personality is just to create a quieter mind. But remember -- enlightenment is the clear felt realization that no such thing as "enlightenment" exists. If that has not been seen, then ignorance remains. Website/book/one-on-one spiritual guidance: Sifting to the Truth: A New Map to the Self Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 @winterknight yup okay totally agree with you. i didn't know the part about the advance development bit, and i totally am an exception. i did self-inquiry for 6 years and 4 of those years i didn't know i was doing it. so i can see how that happened thank you Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 Are you keeping awareness even when you sleep , to a point where you do not lose it when you go to sleep and trough sleep? @winterknight Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 @winterknight I feel like I understand most of the concepts (but that might be a delusion in itself). What obstacles might I face in my journey as a result of this or is this a better place to start? Or does it really depend? Is it my continual identification with the "I" as the thing which understood those concepts? Because as my body was typing the above question, it didn't even realize that it was calling itself the "I". Also, can you help clarify what people mean when they say primary experience is crucial? What is primary experience referring to? How do I know when I am experiencing? Thanks winterknight Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 8 hours ago, purerogue said: Are you keeping awareness even when you sleep , to a point where you do not lose it when you go to sleep and trough sleep? @winterknight I generally don't talk about "my" experience because it's misleading. If you have questions about your path, though, let me know. 7 hours ago, FreeMe said: @winterknight I feel like I understand most of the concepts (but that might be a delusion in itself). What obstacles might I face in my journey as a result of this or is this a better place to start? Or does it really depend? Is it my continual identification with the "I" as the thing which understood those concepts? Because as my body was typing the above question, it didn't even realize that it was calling itself the "I". Also, can you help clarify what people mean when they say primary experience is crucial? What is primary experience referring to? How do I know when I am experiencing? Thanks winterknight I don't know what you mean by primary experience -- I've never used that term. As far as concepts, they are necessary to begin with. You need to understand enough concepts that you feel comfortable with the path. So read, think, and ask questions. These are my takes on self-inquiry. And these are my takes on the path as a whole. Website/book/one-on-one spiritual guidance: Sifting to the Truth: A New Map to the Self Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 I see, I will find out sooner, or later anyway, just wanted to ask directly if my conclusion is right on where it is going. So yes , it was question for my own path. @winterknight Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, purerogue said: I see, I will find out sooner, or later anyway, just wanted to ask directly if my conclusion is right on where it is going. So yes , it was question for my own path. @winterknight It doesn't much help your path to have images of what enlightenment is like. Such expectations are usually obstacles. Edited February 9, 2019 by winterknight Website/book/one-on-one spiritual guidance: Sifting to the Truth: A New Map to the Self Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 (edited) how do i become an enlightened master? do i have to give up living in illusion and embody it, i'm kinda confused about where to go next. i'm not searching for the knower, but trying to get an understanding of what are the truths that enlightened masters live by in a sense, because there are many falsehoods, but the knower is still the knower. so how does this make sense? Edited February 9, 2019 by Aakash Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 9 minutes ago, winterknight said: It doesn't much help your path to have images of what enlightenment is like. Such expectations are usually obstacles. I guess you are right, just wanted to clarify if I am not going wrong direction and do not get caught up in some traps. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Aakash said: how do i become an enlightened master? do i have to give up living in illusion and embody it, i'm kinda confused about where to go next. i'm not searching for the knower, but trying to get an understanding of what are the truths that enlightened masters live by in a sense, because there are many falsehoods, but the knower is still the knower. so how does this make sense? Who is it that wants to become an enlightened master? You must hunt down the I every waking moment. Stay in constant self-inquiry. This "where to go next" and "how do I become" are products of the ego. 13 minutes ago, purerogue said: I guess you are right, just wanted to clarify if I am not going wrong direction and do not get caught up in some traps. Issues like whether you "keep awareness" during sleep and all that are totally irrelevant for a seeker. Thinking about such things is itself a trap. It's enough to know that you ARE during sleep, dream, deep sleep, waking... and to look deeply into what this "I" is. Edited February 9, 2019 by winterknight Website/book/one-on-one spiritual guidance: Sifting to the Truth: A New Map to the Self Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 I know from a true self point of view we are all one consciousness but what about from a small self perspective do other ego's exist under the illusion of being ego's or are they a figment of my egoic consciousness like solipsism. From a absolute perspective who am I that is asking you this now? As i am sure I am an individual self from my small self persepctive. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, andyjohnsonman said: I know from a true self point of view we are all one consciousness but what about from a small self perspective do other ego's exist under the illusion of being ego's or are they a figment of my egoic consciousness like solipsism. From a absolute perspective who am I that is asking you this now? As i am sure I am an individual self from my small self persepctive. In the end there is no different "small self" perspective vs. "true self" perspective. These ideas are just put out there as a bridge for the seeker, as a kind of helpful crutch for a while. The absolute truth is beyond both such perspectives. So, in a nutshell: there is no answer I can give in words to this. You will have to inquire deeply into who you are and then you will find the answer. Edited February 9, 2019 by winterknight Website/book/one-on-one spiritual guidance: Sifting to the Truth: A New Map to the Self Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 1 minute ago, winterknight said: In the end there is no different "small self" perspective vs. "true self" perspective. These ideas are just put out there as a bridge for the seeker, as a kind of helpful crutch for a while. The absolute truth is beyond both such perspectives. So, in a nutshell: there is no answer I can give in words to this. You will have to inquire deeply into who you are and then you will find the answer. Ok thanks. What about from an absolute truth perspective. Who am I who is typing these words that you are reading now? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, andyjohnsonman said: Ok thanks. What about from an absolute truth perspective. Who am I who is typing these words that you are reading now? Well, what I'm saying is that the perspectives are all wrong. Anything put in words is wrong. See, I could say: "From the absolute truth perspective there cannot be said to be any I, any typing, or any world." But these are just words. You will have to feel it yourself to understand. Edited February 9, 2019 by winterknight Website/book/one-on-one spiritual guidance: Sifting to the Truth: A New Map to the Self Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 1 minute ago, winterknight said: Well, what I'm saying is that the perspectives are all wrong. Anything put in words is wrong. See, I could say: "From the absolute truth perspective there cannot be said to be any I, any typing, or any world." But these are just words. You will have to feel it yourself to understand. Yes used the wrong word when i typed perspective as the absolute truth isn't a perspective, but to me it is as i haven't experienced it. However I am open to it. I just want to know your experience of the absolute truth who is typing this message to you now? I understand i can't comprehend this through language as you will say you are typing it. As I am you and we are all one but i just want your experience of the absolute to confirm this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 Why does the universe exist and what is its purpose? - Enter your fear and you are free - Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 1 minute ago, andyjohnsonman said: Yes used the wrong word when i typed perspective as the absolute truth isn't a perspective, but to me it is as i haven't experienced it. However I am open to it. I just want to know your experience of the absolute truth who is typing this message to you now? I understand i can't comprehend this through language as you will say you are typing it. As I am you and we are all one but i just want your experience of the absolute to confirm this. Yes, what I said above is that you cannot understand in words the answer to the question you are asking. I already gave it but you didn't seem to understand. So better just to discover it yourself. Website/book/one-on-one spiritual guidance: Sifting to the Truth: A New Map to the Self Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 3 minutes ago, QandC said: Why does the universe exist and what is its purpose? Find out who is asking the question and you will have satisfaction on this point. From the perspective of mind a mystery always remains, but the deep satisfaction you want can be found by going beyond the mind, which you can do if you follow the path of inquiry. Website/book/one-on-one spiritual guidance: Sifting to the Truth: A New Map to the Self Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 9, 2019 (edited) 37 minutes ago, winterknight said: Who is it that wants to become an enlightened master? You must hunt down the I every waking moment. Stay in constant self-inquiry. i see thank you, that was helpful similarly what does it mean to live a life of truth? when everything of the mind is a self-deception or ego. does it mean to remain in silence ? Edited February 9, 2019 by Aakash Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
