Posted January 29, 2019 24 minutes ago, Mikael89 said: would be good for someone who is starting to get into the path to hear "there is no enlightenment"? They might walk right out again. An enlightenment story can generate a seeking energy that can be helpful in early stages. Yet it also creates separation: there is me and there is enlightenment that is separate from me. Eventually this dynamic dissolves away. Yet, it can take a long time - depending on the mind-body Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 29, 2019 19 minutes ago, Mikael89 said: Why are you saying that when countless sages and other enlightened beings say the opposite? Why are you even in this forum if you think there is no enlightenment? Do you think it would be good for someone who is starting to get into the path to hear "there is no enlightenment"? They might walk right out again. i understand what @non_nothing said and it's a proper thing to say, depending on the perspective. it's not something to be taken literally as an absolute truth, of course. there certainly is enlightenment. people go through crazy mystical experiences and, after proper integration, they come out on top, lighter, happier and healthier than before. the difference is radical and it's very easy to notice. unborn Truth Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 29, 2019 40 minutes ago, Mikael89 said: Why are you saying that when countless sages and other enlightened beings say the opposite? Why are you even in this forum if you think there is no enlightenment? Do you think it would be good for someone who is starting to get into the path to hear "there is no enlightenment"? They might walk right out again. Everything about enlightenment is paradoxical, because it includes everything. The logical mind can't and won't ever grasp it, the best it can do is intuitively knowing it's true, because it is already it, it just doesn't realize it. God is love Whoever lives in love lives in God And God in them Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 29, 2019 2 minutes ago, Mikael89 said: Seeking for the Truth/Who You are is a good thing. Even beyond good. it's best when there's no way out! unborn Truth Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 29, 2019 Just now, Mikael89 said: No way out of what? no way out of the search, due to extreme suffering. that's usually when transformation actually takes place because the breaches and farces of the ego become clearer. in practice, the generic picture of such situation is someone crying, feeling weak and thirsty for deep changes. oh, i still remember the feeling. i'm so grateful. unborn Truth Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 29, 2019 12 minutes ago, Mikael89 said: @Serotoninluv @ajasatya @Shin Yea so people should be more careful when they say "there is no enlightenment". Seeking for the Truth/Who You are is a good thing. I’d say it has a double edge. Getting immersed into an enlightenment story can be a distraction and counter-productive. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 29, 2019 In retrospect, 10 years of depression was the best thing that ever happened to me. God is love Whoever lives in love lives in God And God in them Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 29, 2019 What's your view of using psychedelics for enlightenment or psychological work? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 29, 2019 5 hours ago, winterknight said: That's ultimately true, but from the seeker's standpoint it is not. Well, both and neither. I am enlightened, but enlightenment is all there is. It is a credential, but it is no less true for that. An impossible and misleading question to answer, unfortunately. I could say a year, I could say 20 years. But the reality is that "full self-realization" is not something to be achieved in some future time. That very thought is an obstacle. Right, because it is all already there. In a sense you delete your way to it, not gain. But asking questions from the real perspective doesn't work because the mind which is form cannot understand formlessness. Thank you for answering. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 29, 2019 @thesmileyone what is the difference between enlightenment/ realisation of true nature aka you as a being and full self-realisation, there are no distinct boundaries so this doesn't make sense in my book? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 29, 2019 16 minutes ago, Aakash said: @thesmileyone what is the difference between enlightenment/ realisation of true nature aka you as a being and full self-realisation, there are no distinct boundaries so this doesn't make sense in my book? There’s no difference except in thought. To the seeker it may feel like they’ve had glimpses of truth but that they’re not “established” in it. This is of course an illusion caused by thinking. In truth, we are always enlightened. Website/book/one-on-one spiritual guidance: Sifting to the Truth: A New Map to the Self Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 29, 2019 Yes we are enlightened; i have come to this realisation after your words helped me relax and some further self-enquiring. thank you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 30, 2019 4 minutes ago, Mikael89 said: It's like a sexy girl would be inside this ball, and she can never get out of it. Then what does it matter that she's sexy inside the ball??: But the ball is merely the thought that there is a ball. Drop the thought and there is no ball. There's not even that thought... Website/book/one-on-one spiritual guidance: Sifting to the Truth: A New Map to the Self Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 30, 2019 6 hours ago, Mikael89 said: True. But don't forget that almost everyone enlightened was a seeker before enlightenment. Not many get spontaneously enlightened, Eckhart Tolle.. Ramana Maharshi.. The personality seeks, the personality does not become enlightened. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 30, 2019 18 hours ago, Mikael89 said: Why are you saying that when countless sages and other enlightened beings say the opposite? Why are you even in this forum if you think there is no enlightenment? Do you think it would be good for someone who is starting to get into the path to hear "there is no enlightenment"? They might walk right out again. It's just you're wanting to debate, we all know you're not a beginner. Nevertheless it is less 1 in a million or trillion or whatever chance that anyone who have no single idea about enlightenment would encounter my post in actualized fucking dot org's rat post of this on 129th page and acknowledge and then take it granted that no enlightenment is possible. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 30, 2019 6 hours ago, Mikael89 said: Okay. But you know it's not that easy. That too is a thought... Website/book/one-on-one spiritual guidance: Sifting to the Truth: A New Map to the Self Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 30, 2019 7 hours ago, Mikael89 said: that doesn't change the fact that 99% or something of all enlightened was seekers before enlightenment. What is 99% of zero? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 30, 2019 i am enlightened, so my ego doesn't exsist in the sense i'm grounded to my true self- what do i still call the toxic bad traits and QUOTE "bad habits" does it still remain as ego because the true self does not need anything or want anything? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 30, 2019 1 minute ago, Aakash said: i am enlightened, so my ego doesn't exsist in the sense i'm grounded to my true self- what do i still call the toxic bad traits and QUOTE "bad habits" does it still remain as ego because the true self does not need anything or want anything? this is where things start to get too paradoxical. there has never been and there will never be such thing as ego. there is disciplined or undisciplined mind. you're still fantasizing "true self". the ability to let go is something to be trained and "conditioned", so to speak. unborn Truth Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 30, 2019 @ajasatya i see- this is my problem, i realised there is no such thing as an ego, it also does not exsist because a person is being all the time. so what exactly is the disciplined mind working towards in your view? to me, it would be to a quiet mind or is that to remain present? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
