I am enlightened. Sincere seekers: ask me anything

[winterknight]

28 minutes ago, zambize said:

Probably not because most bullies just use words and not fists and you cant just go around beating the shit out of every bully who makes fun of you.  Glad I could finally answer one of your questions for you, now its mutual

Heh. Not really my point, but clever.

[CreamCat]

2 hours ago, winterknight said:

Will becoming a Navy SEAL help you defend yourself against the neighborhood bully?

I don't know. You are supposed to be a spiritual navy SEAL. What was your experience?

I guess a millionaire with a few hundred million dollars in one's bank account could deal with a neighborhood bully by hiring a competent lawyer or by isolating oneself in a corporate environment where nobody can bully that millionaire.

But, I'm not a millionaire with a fat wallet.

Edited December 7, 2018 by CreamCat

[winterknight]

33 minutes ago, CreamCat said:

I don't know. You are supposed to be a spiritual navy SEAL. What was your experience?

I guess a millionaire with a few hundred million dollars in one's bank account could deal with a neighborhood bully by hiring a competent lawyer or by isolating oneself in a corporate environment where nobody can bully that millionaire.

But, I'm not a millionaire with a fat wallet.

Ok, clearly analogies are not getting across here. 

Enlightenment will give you freedom from the emotional suffering evoked by bullies, but is about far more than that, and requires a great deal of emotional mastery to get there in the first place, just like even to become a Navy SEAL one must be quite physically fit already.

Edited December 7, 2018 by winterknight

[CreamCat]

4 minutes ago, winterknight said:

Enlightenment will give you freedom from emotional suffering,

Do you draw distinction between emotional pain and emotional suffering? TJ Reeves said unnecessary pain is suffering and every pain he experienced was necessary and sufficient to make him what he is today.

Do you still feel emotional pain in the moment but prevent that pain from rolling over you for the rest of your day or your week? How do you emotionally deal with nasty criticisms in the moment?

Edited December 7, 2018 by CreamCat

[winterknight]

1 minute ago, CreamCat said:

Do you draw distinction between emotional pain and emotional suffering? TJ Reeves said unnecessary pain is suffering and every pain he experienced was necessary and sufficient to make him what he is today.

Do you still feel emotional pain in the moment but prevent that pain from rolling over you for the rest of your day or your week?

No, I am not drawing a distinction between pain and suffering.

There are many different ways of answering this question, because the real truth is beyond words and you will just have to see it yourself to really understand.

One answer is to say that there no distinctions at all: no pain and no pleasure, and thus no emotional pain or suffering. This is the truest answer. 

Another is to say that there may be emotional pain, but it is not identified with -- i.e. it is not recognized as "yours." This is second truest.

[CreamCat]

That's funny.

No pain. No gain.

No pleasure. No pain.

No pain. No pleasure.

Edited December 7, 2018 by CreamCat

[okulele]

Are you familiar with Ken Wilber's concepts of Waking Up, Cleaning Up, Growing Up? Do you think spiritual awakening will still leave the shadow intact?

[winterknight]

5 hours ago, okulele said:

Are you familiar with Ken Wilber's concepts of Waking Up, Cleaning Up, Growing Up? Do you think spiritual awakening will still leave the shadow intact?

Permanent spiritual awakening -- as opposed to a glimpse -- usually requires that substantial shadow work has been done already.

And then it will begin a process where much of what is left is eventually brought to light and integrated.

Not familiar with the Wilber model, sorry.

[SoonHei]

@winterknight

hi

could you advise me about how to overcome a few drawbacks that i find myself facing...

 

i have a thought about going to the gym or trying to meditate longer for example

and then, i go... maybe for a week or so... and then back to square one. stop going.

it can be my laziness or lack of interest that i now seem to attribute to worrying about how i look (accepting how i am and not in a bad shape... but not trying to improve it)

 

but how do i reconcile the "traps" which are often talked about

i observe these recurring thoughts about many aspects of my life and they are all ego based viewed but I KNOW that they are true

i will think to myself that well this is all unfolding as it should and is out of my control anyways. so if i am sitting here now thinking about why i am not working out or meditating.. well. that's just what IS... when i finally will realize that i have been holding myself back blaming the natural unfolding of this life leading to me being lazy or not working out... i will then start working out.. whenever that happens...

 

so, even though this seems like such an egoic trap.. it is what it is... because from the aboslute point of view, there is no do-er... there is no anything really.. but focusing on the human life POV.. there is no chooser not choosing to go to gym etc.

how do i overcome this egoic reasoning (which is correct from the no free will prespective)

i dont find myself suffering from this... 

as i was writing this. i just had a thought occur also that this is my ego just finding something to complaint/question/worry about

and now the thought about that even this is a natural unfolding out of my control...

it keeps playing tennis with itself going between a complain thought and then getting hit by the relax, no free will / chooser thought ..

[Kloof]

Can you be in a state of "ego loss" and experience fear at the same time?

I've been reading about and trying self-inquiry, and the more I learn about it, the more it reminds me of an experience I had 10 or so years ago in the 10th grade.

Back then, I was slowly giving up my Christian beliefs one at the time, and I had recently come to the conclusion that heaven and hell couldn't exist.  I remember lying on my bed, and becoming very concerned with the questions, "Do I just stop existing one day? What actually am I? What does it mean that I exist in the first place?" I had no knowledge of self-inquiry at the time, but I remember being unable to pinpoint what I was, and I had an overwhelming "nothingness experience." It was like, for a moment, I lost myself. I can't remember if I was terrified during the moments of nothingness or if the terror came afterwards, but if they weren't simultaneous, they were very close together. In the week that followed, just lying in my bed and thinking, "What is the "I" that will die with my body?" triggered these terrifying "no-self" experiences. I had several before I started to block the thoughts that triggered them, and haven't had one of these experiences since.

What was that? It's hard to believe that I could have accidentally had any sort of enlightenment experience as a barely spiritual 10th grader. Experiencing nothingness is different than experiencing enlightenment, right? If you're truly in a state of ego loss, do you have emotions like fear?

[winterknight]

5 hours ago, SoonHei said:

@winterknight

hi

could you advise me about how to overcome a few drawbacks that i find myself facing...

i have a thought about going to the gym or trying to meditate longer for example

and then, i go... maybe for a week or so... and then back to square one. stop going.

it can be my laziness or lack of interest that i now seem to attribute to worrying about how i look (accepting how i am and not in a bad shape... but not trying to improve it)

but how do i reconcile the "traps" which are often talked about

i observe these recurring thoughts about many aspects of my life and they are all ego based viewed but I KNOW that they are true

i will think to myself that well this is all unfolding as it should and is out of my control anyways. so if i am sitting here now thinking about why i am not working out or meditating.. well. that's just what IS... when i finally will realize that i have been holding myself back blaming the natural unfolding of this life leading to me being lazy or not working out... i will then start working out.. whenever that happens...

so, even though this seems like such an egoic trap.. it is what it is... because from the aboslute point of view, there is no do-er... there is no anything really.. but focusing on the human life POV.. there is no chooser not choosing to go to gym etc.

how do i overcome this egoic reasoning (which is correct from the no free will prespective)

i dont find myself suffering from this... 

as i was writing this. i just had a thought occur also that this is my ego just finding something to complaint/question/worry about

and now the thought about that even this is a natural unfolding out of my control...

it keeps playing tennis with itself going between a complain thought and then getting hit by the relax, no free will / chooser thought ..

Well, you have a few options:

-treat it as a motivational problem. Remember, my philosophy is that you have to be honest about what you want. If you are having resistance to going to the gym, it's for a reason. Take it seriously. What is that resistance all about? It is not laziness. Listen to your feelings and express them. And/or go get therapy like I always recommend and figure out what it is that's really holding you back. probably something unconscious from the past. 

-self-inquire into who is having this "playing tennis" back and forth conflict

-surrender and let whatever happen happen -- including the "playing tennis" back and forth...  

4 hours ago, Kloof said:

Can you be in a state of "ego loss" and experience fear at the same time?

I've been reading about and trying self-inquiry, and the more I learn about it, the more it reminds me of an experience I had 10 or so years ago in the 10th grade.

Back then, I was slowly giving up my Christian beliefs one at the time, and I had recently come to the conclusion that heaven and hell couldn't exist.  I remember lying on my bed, and becoming very concerned with the questions, "Do I just stop existing one day? What actually am I? What does it mean that I exist in the first place?" I had no knowledge of self-inquiry at the time, but I remember being unable to pinpoint what I was, and I had an overwhelming "nothingness experience." It was like, for a moment, I lost myself. I can't remember if I was terrified during the moments of nothingness or if the terror came afterwards, but if they weren't simultaneous, they were very close together. In the week that followed, just lying in my bed and thinking, "What is the "I" that will die with my body?" triggered these terrifying "no-self" experiences. I had several before I started to block the thoughts that triggered them, and haven't had one of these experiences since.

What was that? It's hard to believe that I could have accidentally had any sort of enlightenment experience as a barely spiritual 10th grader. Experiencing nothingness is different than experiencing enlightenment, right? If you're truly in a state of ego loss, do you have emotions like fear?

You were getting glimpses/flashes of the Truth, that, because you weren't prepared for them, felt very scary. That's not enlightenment. Enlightenment is when you're not glimpsing anymore; you're permanently realized and established in the Truth.

[FoxFoxFox]

@winterknight What course of action do you recommend for someone who has very thoroughly dis-identified with ego?

The teachings tell us to identify the source of "I am-ness". What can you tell us about this sense? Is it correct to say that it is not coming from anywhere in particular? 

Also is this different from the feeling of the body being alive? That is a sensation coming from somewhere in the heart. Are the two different or the same?

Another way of saying this, is that there is no particular sensation or feeling that corresponds to being. The best explanation i can give is that this is some sort of "knowledge" that exists before the mind or anything else for that matter. It is some sort of knowing. 

An example self-inquiry goes like this: I become a witness of all thoughts/emotions/sensations/objects > I become a witness of the witness. At this point, there is no end to the search for the ultimate witness. The only worthwhile realization here is that I-am is awareness itself, and it is not coming from anywhere particular. Is this a correct understanding? 

 

Edited December 8, 2018 by FoxFoxFox

[Amanaki]

WinterKnight. Can you explain your view of what enlightenment is? 

[winterknight]

4 hours ago, FoxFoxFox said:

@winterknight What course of action do you recommend for someone who has very thoroughly dis-identified with ego?

If someone has very thoroughly dis-identified with ego, this question does not arise. The ego is the sense of 'doership.' No doership -- no question about what course of action to take for a someone. So if this question disturbs, the question arises: who asks this question?

Quote

The teachings tell us to identify the source of "I am-ness". What can you tell us about this sense? Is it correct to say that it is not coming from anywhere in particular? 

It is beyond space and time and form, beyond even existence and non-existence. Yes, it is not coming from anywhere in particular.

Quote

Also is this different from the feeling of the body being alive? That is a sensation coming from somewhere in the heart. Are the two different or the same?

Different.

Quote

Another way of saying this, is that there is no particular sensation or feeling that corresponds to being. The best explanation i can give is that this is some sort of "knowledge" that exists before the mind or anything else for that matter. It is some sort of knowing. 

Yes, there is no particular sensation or feeling that corresponds, correct.

Quote

An example self-inquiry goes like this: I become a witness of all thoughts/emotions/sensations/objects > I become a witness of the witness. At this point, there is no end to the search for the ultimate witness. The only worthwhile realization here is that I-am is awareness itself, and it is not coming from anywhere particular. Is this a correct understanding? 

No -- there is an end to the search. Something witnesses the very act of witnessing, something beyond the "I that witnesses."

3 hours ago, Amanaki said:

WinterKnight. Can you explain your view of what enlightenment is? 

It is the recognition of our true nature as being, awareness, and bliss. Though for seekers it has to be viewed as something to be achieved, it is actually  but a word for something that is already the case.

Edited December 8, 2018 by winterknight

[Amanaki]

39 minutes ago, winterknight said:

If someone has very thoroughly dis-identified with ego, this question does not arise. The ego is the sense of 'doership.' No doership -- no question about what course of action to take for a someone. So if this question disturbs, the question arises: who asks this question?

It is beyond space and time and form, beyond even existence and non-existence. Yes, it is not coming from anywhere in particular.

Different.

Yes, there is no particular sensation or feeling that corresponds, correct.

No -- there is an end to the search. Something witnesses the very act of witnessing, something beyond the "I that witnesses."

It is the recognition of our true nature as being, awareness, and bliss. Though for seekers it has to be viewed as something to be achieved, it is actually  but a word for something that is already the case.

What is the sign of a Buddha in your understanding?

 

[winterknight]

7 minutes ago, Amanaki said:

What is the sign of a Buddha in your understanding?

There is no reliable external sign, since there are really no Buddhas, only the single shining Buddha Which Is.

But for a seeker looking for a guru, see if there's someone who makes you feel peaceful, who seems to have patience, and who can understand and respond intelligibly to your questions. 

[Amanaki]

maybe you dont know that each buddha (meaning enlighten being) has aswastika on their body when they are on earth to teach. a Tatagatha like Buddha Sakyamuni has 1 swastika but those Buddhas who has transended to even higher has more swastikas on their body. But only those who have the third eye opened can see this when looking at the person who are enlighten.

You may have seen a buddha statue with the swastika on their chest? this is the true mark of a Buddha a enlighten being.

[Anton Rogachevski]

What's the point of asking questions if one can answer either: "You don't exist and the world doesn't exist." or "Keep inquiring into the self and the question will disappear." Anyone can do that, and it's boring.

What's the use of asking questions in the first place? Never really understood that.

[FoxFoxFox]

@winterknight

Quote

No -- there is an end to the search. Something witnesses the very act of witnessing, something beyond the "I that witnesses."

You have been gracefully answering my questions. Do you have any idea where the distortion is in my understanding judging by the questions? When I witness, i come to the point where my mind is silent. I exist, without even having a thought about existing - i can only say this in retrospect. The actions which were previously associated with "I" carry on of their own accord. I might be convinced to call it pure being. There is no association with the body or the mind. Or the thought form, I.

Yet, other times the ethereal mechanisms that cause identification with the fake "I" return. I believe true enlightenment is when this no longer happens, correct?

In other words, I seem to have prolonged experiences of "no-mind" as pure, unmarred and unlabeled existence, yet they are temporary.

What is the best course of action for one such as this?

Edited December 8, 2018 by FoxFoxFox

[winterknight]

40 minutes ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

What's the point of asking questions if one can answer either: "You don't exist and the world doesn't exist." or "Keep inquiring into the self and the question will disappear." Anyone can do that, and it's boring.

What's the use of asking questions in the first place? Never really understood that.

Luckily, that's not all that's been said. Do you have a question about the path?

8 minutes ago, FoxFoxFox said:

@winterknight

You have been gracefully answering my questions. Do you have any idea where the distortion is in my understanding judging by the questions? When I witness, i come to the point where my mind is silent. I exist, without even having a thought about existing - i can only say this in retrospect. The actions which were previously associated with "I" carry on of their own accord. I might be convinced to call it pure being. There is no association with the body or the mind. Or the thought form, I.

Yet, other times the ethereal mechanisms that cause identification with the fake "I" return. I believe true enlightenment is when this no longer happens, correct?

In other words, I seem to have prolonged experiences of "no-mind" as pure, unmarred and unlabeled existence, yet they are temporary.

What is the best course of action for one such as this?

Hold to the no-mind... whatever takes you to the experience where the mind is silent "without even having a thought about existing" -- get back there, and stay there. And if you travel out of it, get back there again. And again and again. Don't worry about how long it will take. Eventually it will stick.

Yes, and that is enlightenment.

Edited December 8, 2018 by winterknight