I am enlightened. Sincere seekers: ask me anything

[Emanyalpsid]

15 minutes ago, winterknight said:

1. No.

2. No.

How come?

[winterknight]

1 minute ago, Emanyalpsid said:

How come?

Perception and existence are categories of the mind generated through the ego. Recognize the ego's non-existence, and the categories are seen as false. 

[luismatos]

If you just get absorbed in the silence day after day, making the mind quieter and quieter, will it happen?

[Forestluv]

@winterknight Whate are the most effective self inquiry questions?

[Jack River]

13 minutes ago, winterknight said:

But for everyone else, you need thought to kill thought.

I’m not sure this can be done, but I’m willing to go into it dude. 

 

13 minutes ago, winterknight said:

It really depends. For the very mature and ripe aspirant, merely sitting in silence will be enough to realize their nature. But for everyone else, you need thought to kill thought. The idea of self-inquiry, for example, is a thought. Strictly speaking there is no need for any effort to be what you already are. But people need something to grasp onto. This is the best tool.

For most people, simply sitting in silence and "not thinking" isn't enough. They will not be able to use that to discern what is going on. It will seem like nothing is happening. So abstractions are critically important for almost everyone.

But different traditions have different viewpoints on this. Advaita Vedanta, my tradition, has a lot of abstraction. Zen Buddhism, relatively little.

I understand dude. To me I don’t personally see that thought can end thought. 

 

13 minutes ago, winterknight said:

For most people, simply sitting in silence and "not thinking" isn't enough.

Oh, well for sure. That’s the thing, that silence, I question if this silence can be cultivated. 

Edited November 10, 2018 by Jack River

[winterknight]

1 minute ago, luismatos said:

If you just get absorbed in the silence day after day, making the mind quieter and quieter, will it happen?

If you can remain in silence even while you are going about in the world (not just while sitting down on a mat), and you can surrender the need for something to happen, it might just happen.

2 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

@winterknight Whate are the most effective self inquiry questions?

There's only one: tracing the feeling of the I.

[Emanyalpsid]

9 minutes ago, winterknight said:

Perception and existence are categories of the mind generated through the ego. Recognize the ego's non-existence, and the categories are seen as false. 

Ah but I dont mean the conceptual perception and existence, but I mean that what we perceive without conception. So I mean the raw sense-awareness. Does that exist upon itself? And does it exist independent of consciousness? And how come?

Edited November 10, 2018 by Emanyalpsid

[Jack River]

6 minutes ago, winterknight said:

Recognize the ego's non-existence, and the categories are seen as false. 

This seems coherent. But then again this “recognition” is really a non-recognizing. Otherwise thought has come in and moved in one direction or another. But this seems so. 

[Emanyalpsid]

@Jack River with nothingness you mean the emptiness of essence? Cause in buddhist text the concept of nothingness is used in terms of a deep meditative state just before reaching nirvana. Where no-thing is perceived but also not nothingness.

[winterknight]

2 minutes ago, Jack River said:

Oh, well for sure. That’s the thing, that silence I question if this silence can be cultivated. 

It can be. The mind focuses on one thought. The one thought is the relative silence that will lead to the absolute silence.

[Wisebaxter]

@winterknight When people question your sincerity or say dumb stuff to you it appears to me like jealousy or cynicism on their part. I can't help feeling triggered by their lack of open mindedness and how they miss an opportunity to ask you an intelligent question. What reactions do you have when someone doubts you like this? Is there any emotion at all? Like frustration, etc? Or maybe compassion? I'm interested to know what's there for you experientially, in these moments. 

[winterknight]

4 minutes ago, Emanyalpsid said:

Ah but I dont mean the conceptual perception and existence, but I mean that what we perceive without conception. So I mean the raw sense-awareness. Does that exist upon itself? And does it exist independent of consciousness? And how come?

You can't say that you perceive without using the concept "perceive." "Raw sense awareness" --> more concepts. Eliminate all the concepts, and you'll find that there's no way you can pose the question, and indeed that there will be no one to even try.

3 minutes ago, Jack River said:

This seems coherent. But then again this “recognition” is really a non-recognizing. Otherwise thought has come in and moved in one direction or another. But this seems so. 

Sure, the non-recognizing recognition, etc. 

[Jack River]

3 minutes ago, Emanyalpsid said:

@Jack River with nothingness you mean the emptiness of essence? Cause in buddhist text the concept of nothingness is used in terms of a deep meditative state just before reaching nirvana. Where no-thing is perceived but also not nothingness.

As in a total stoppage of subject/object/time, this and that and such, but as an actual experiencing/phenomenon. As in actually no labeling/thought movement at all psychologically which means thought only operates when needed. But when I am not doing anything it is pure silence. Mind with nothing in it. 

Edited November 10, 2018 by Jack River

[winterknight]

2 minutes ago, Wisebaxter said:

@winterknight When people question your sincerity or say dumb stuff to you it appears to me like jealousy or cynicism on their part. I can't help feeling triggered by their lack of open mindedness and how they miss an opportunity to ask you an intelligent question. What reactions do you have when someone doubts you like this? Is there any emotion at all? Like frustration, etc? Or maybe compassion? I'm interested to know what's there for you experientially, in these moments. 

Heh. I don't believe in identifying myself with the experiencer of emotion, or even to believe that emotion really exists. But if we say that it does, for argument's sake, then I'm mostly unaffected, though sometimes I roll my eyes internally, feel a little irritation, and yes, sometimes a little compassion too...

[Emanyalpsid]

21 minutes ago, winterknight said:

You can't say that you perceive without using the concept "perceive." "Raw sense awareness" --> more concepts. Eliminate all the concepts, and you'll find that there's no way you can pose the question, and indeed that there will be no one to even try.

Yeah but we are writing here, so I must use words. So, I dont refer to the concept of perceiving, but to the awareness as such. To use an example; I dont refer to the concept of a flower, but to what constitutes a flower. So not in words, but in direct experience. Does that exist upon itself?

Edit; of course when we eliminate concepts there is no question. But to understand ourselves we need to know the nature of thought, not reject or ignore it. Without thought one can not live.

Edited November 10, 2018 by Emanyalpsid

[Jack River]

@winterknight fosho man. The way that I seemed to die continually is by non-choosing/no positive&negative moment of reaction (thought/emotion cycle). As in not moving in either direction of thought by resistance/identification. Or by not moving within the field of time/thought. Seems quite different than what you are saying though. Interesting though dude. Maybe we can talk more in a while. Party on dude?

Edited November 10, 2018 by Jack River

[EvilAngel]

Having had an enlightenment experience today, I feel like I can say: 'Enlightenment is simple, yet not easy'. Would you agree with this statement winterknight?

 

[Forestluv]

20 minutes ago, winterknight said:

Eliminate all the concepts, and you'll find that there's no way you can pose the question, and indeed that there will be no one to even try.

The term “eliminate” would trigger my ego’s sense of conflict seeking. Imagery related to “letting go” is more effective for relaxing my mind. In particular I like the imagery of “going to what is before the concepts” and “dropping below the concepts” and “allowing all concepts to dissolve”

[winterknight]

13 minutes ago, Emanyalpsid said:

Yeah but we are writing here, so I must use words. So, I dont refer to the concept of perceiving, but to the awareness as such. To use an example; I dont refer to the concept of a flower, but to what constitutes a flower. So not in words, but in direct experience. Does that exist upon itself?

Yes, but when you use words you are trapped by them. The experience I'm talking about is the realization of the inadequacy of words to speak about the truth. 

If you insist on asking great philosophical questions while in the world of words, don't expect answers. They are not to be had.

2 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

The term “eliminate” would trigger my ego’s sense of conflict seeking. Imagery related to “letting go” is more effective for relaxing my mind. In particular I like the imagery of “going to what is before the concepts” and “dropping below the concepts”.

Sure, that's probably gentler and subtler terminology.

[winterknight]

6 minutes ago, EvilAngel said:

Having had an enlightenment experience today, I feel like I can say: 'Enlightenment is simple, yet not easy'. Would you agree with this statement winterknight?

 

It certainly seems like that to the one who feels like they have to put forth effort. But in fact enlightenment is the realization that that person doesn't exist... so I would say enlightenment is both simple and easy. So simple and easy that in fact it is already accomplished.