Is not eating Meat crucial for Enlightenment?

[Shin]

2 hours ago, Outer said:

It's no until you prove otherwise.

No you're not rocks, trees, grass, because they aren't conscious.

if you really believe that you'll be stuck lol

[Shin]

6 minutes ago, Outer said:

That's fine. You're not a rock. Or a tree. Or grass. Or a mountain.

Doesn't matter.

The simple fact that you hold a belief so tightly that you refuse to entertain its opposite is closed mindedness.

You can't truly inquire anything as long as you're closed minded.

[non_nothing]

People are a complex operating machine. What happened for them can't be guarantee that'll do the same to you. Just because someone stop eating meat and solved his depression doesn't mean it is a cure for a depression. Human psyche is dumb. You can't really tell when and why will the depression or other stuff you might put will resolve. I say It is a COINCIDENCE. BIG coincidence. There would be millions of reasons that his depression is resolved at the moment he tried this new diet. TBH, I'm a vegetarian tho LOL. (Not kidding, this post is serious). What I'm trying to say is don't just setup wrong expectations on some diet or another for a goal. Setup valid expectations when you're starting doing something. You've lost this game already if you're starting to do it for some spiritual enlightenment. 

[Shin]

10 minutes ago, Outer said:

You don't give arguments, just saying it is close mindedness. You're not a rock.

 

 

Just stop being a fucking brat and open your self righteous/narcicisstic and arrogant mind.

You're not helping anyone by staying like this, not even yourself.

 

10 minutes ago, Outer said:

 

 

[Shin]

1 minute ago, Outer said:

I don't think I am a rock. You seem to believe I will be stuck with that belief yet you've not said why.

I said why ...

[Shadowraix]

4 hours ago, Outer said:

No you're not rocks, trees, grass, because they aren't conscious.

The separation between you and rocks, trees, grass etc is a self created boundary that doesn't exist. 

These things are a part of the whole that I am. I am you. I am Leo. I am the sky. I am God. Its all one.

Just because your awareness is only currently this body does not imply thats all you are.

Do the work and you'll become aware of this.

4 hours ago, Outer said:

It's no until you prove otherwise.

Thats an assumption on your part.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

We've found many creatures long thought to be extinct. Their existence is regardless of your belief. This is why the default position always goes to maybe.

[eleveneleven]

On 10/28/2018 at 8:14 AM, Outer said:

Because if you alter the brain, you alter the subjective reality. It's up to you to prove that plants are conscious.

Animals experience pain and emotions, as we know not only from first hand experience but from studying their physiology.

 

You completely ignore my point.

You cannot know what it's like to be something or someone--the subjective experience--from studying that thing's physiology. You cannot prove that animals are conscious. You cannot even prove that another human being besides yourself is conscious.

You know why? Because you cannot prove a subjective experience. No amount of investigation, concepts, or abstractions will tell you what it is like to be something. That is a subjective experience. To assume that animals are conscious and that plants are not is completely arbitrary. There is no physical thing that you can study that will tell you one is conscious and the other is not, without your making the huge assumption that things are only conscious if they are physically similar to you.

Since you don't know what it's like to be anything except yourself, how the hell do you know that you need a brain and nervous system to be conscious? It doesn't make any sense. You have nothing to compare it to, since you've never been anything that didn't have a brain, and you can't experience something else's consciousness from the outside in.

So if anything, it is just as much up to you to prove that animals are conscious as it is for me to prove that plants are--which neither of us can.

Quit being arrogant. You do not know what it is like to be a non-human animal and in fact you don't know what it's like to be anyone except yourself. There is no scientific mechanism you could use that would allow you to experience being anything other than yourself, either.

Probably the only reason you are so close-minded about what can and cannot be conscious is because it opens an inconvenient can of philosophical worms for you. Life is not so simple, though. Quit bullshitting yourself.

Edited October 30, 2018 by eleveneleven

[Flammable]

Coming back to the forum and seeing @Outer  and @Shin  arguing once again. Much love for all haha 

Edited October 30, 2018 by Flammable

[Shin]

9 minutes ago, Flammable said:

Coming back to the forum and seeing @Outer  and @Shin  arguing once again. Much love for all haha 

Did you notice my effort when I stopped at the 10th reply ?

You did right ? 

[Charlotte]

@Shin you know from direct experience that some people do not like to be given a mirror to look at themselves... ESPECIALLY from other.

Your literally wasting your finger typing energy. 

[Shin]

Just now, Charlotte said:

@Shin you know from direct experience that some people do not like to be given a mirror to look at themselves... ESPECIALLY from other.

Your literally wasting your finger typing energy. 

That's why I stopped 

[now is forever]

2 hours ago, Outer said:

2 hours ago, Shadowraix said:

Thats an assumption on your part.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

We've found many creatures long thought to be extinct. Their existence is regardless of your belief. This is why the default position always goes to maybe.

The evidence of absence is the lack of a brain and a nervous system.

there is no evidence of absence, a tree doesn’t have a nervous system, it is the nervous system.

and if you are not conscious of what makes your brain work - then you can’t be conscious of the sentience of how you communicate with yourself all the time.

Edited October 30, 2018 by now is forever
that doesn‘t mean i‘m a fruitarian now. i‘m a lettuce killer (in german that would be head salad) ???

[Tony 845]

Wonder if Adyashanti, Echart, Robert Paulston, shinzen young eat meat? I've heard mooji does?‍♂️ Ya know for all these people on here who claim to be enlightened I sure see a lot of ego ??

[Shadowraix]

12 hours ago, Outer said:

Those are inside of you, but they aren't you.

You are creating a separation of me and whats inside of me.

That separation does not exist.

All is me.

[Shadowraix]

1 hour ago, Outer said:

That you're so attached to wanting to be this...well it speaks much of you. You even assumed that my awareness is in this body.

I'm not attached to wanting to be something. I realized I am everything. Dissolution of separation into total unity.

I said your awareness is limited to a bodily experience. Not that it is in your body. I suppose I should add if you haven't practiced to expand it.

 

Edited October 31, 2018 by Shadowraix

[Your place at Heart]

We are seperated and not one due to the light and light is nothing more than a photon which is vibration of energy that is originally dark but due to its very mega vibrations it became an energized packett of energy illuminating and its the photon. In darkness, all of us merge together into oneness. 

[d0ornokey]

On 10/30/2018 at 0:07 AM, Outer said:

It's no until you prove otherwise.

It's I dont know, not no. No implies you know that it is no 

[now is forever]

2 hours ago, d0ornokey said:

It's I dont know, not no. No implies you know that it is no 

?

 

[EvilAngel]

On 28/10/2018 at 8:41 AM, Shiva said:

@Joseph Maynor @Outer @Shin

 

Brilliant. Thanks for this.