Offending Weak Insecure Sheep

[abrakamowse]

18 minutes ago, Philip said:

And sorry for ranting against you. You're not the only one, nor the worse. And I usually like your input, but please try to read the atmosphere and get attuned to it. Your comments will probably be more relevant and helpful.

Don't be sorry, it's Ok. I don't share your opinion, but it is Ok.

[Will]

18 minutes ago, Philip said:

Posting enlightenment level notions in a conversation that is clearly operating at a lower level

Pointless?? How so??

I kinda get it ... But yeah I know what you mean.. I prolly dont have a deep experiencial understanding of it yet.. nice to know that its coming though..

 

[Zane]

If you told me about self-actualization, I wouldn't blast the idea as crazy. I feel like I would react with a deep curiosity and initial excitement particularly when someone discusses life purpose with me. I would excitedly tell other people about personal development but they would brand me as "a dreamer" "crazy" or "impractical." 

[Will]

@abrakamowse

I am curious.. what compelled you to chime in??

@Philip

[Will]

1 minute ago, Zane said:

If you told me about self-actualization, I wouldn't blast the idea as crazy. I feel like I would react with a deep curiosity and initial excitement particularly when someone discusses life purpose with me.

Yeah but you have obviously hit a point in your life where enough is enough and you want better and this seems like a vehicle to do that.. I guess many others are still stuck in a daze of comfort..

 

3 minutes ago, Zane said:

I would excitedly tell other people about personal development

Why??

Surely thats just you thinking you've found something others should have...

I dont know but I reckon its really crucial to let people live in denial if they want to..

So many religions are out there pro porting that they know the answer.. look how much grief it has led too..

You just cant beat the old saying you can lead a horse to water but you cant make it drink.. sooo true..

WHat do you reckon.. ?? do you think this is universal truth?? I dont.. I just think its mine...

If that makes any sense..

 

[abrakamowse]

13 minutes ago, Will said:

@abrakamowse

I am curious.. what compelled you to chime in??

@Philip

I just got an impulse to do it without thinking too much about it, when that happens I know it's a good thing, so I just do it.

[Will]

@abrakamowse Doh.. Would be nice to see where it comes from

 

[abrakamowse]

1 minute ago, Will said:

@abrakamowse Doh.. Would be nice to see where it comes from

 

Well, when I feel that impulse I normally think is the "higher self"... but I don't know for sure. Maybe is my ego hehehehe... you never know until you are enlightened... I think. And I am not yet there...

[abrakamowse]

 Anyway, in my opinion it was good. It would have been bad if it didn't get any reaction. We know more about ourselves now, so... I learned too from that. Maybe I am too much obsessed with enlightenment.

[abrakamowse]

25 minutes ago, Will said:

@abrakamowse Doh.. Would be nice to see where it comes from

 

I remember now, I also said it because I have some similar disagreement with my wife. And I thought that was the problem, we invest too much in ourselves. So I didn't pay attention to what she said, because it was her ego (not really her) talking, and I wanted to say something, but it was going to be my ego too. So I keep quiet.

It would have been a clash of egos. And I don't want that in my life anymore.
 

Edited April 4, 2016 by abrakamowse

[Will]

7 minutes ago, abrakamowse said:

And I don't want that in my life anymore

interesting.. I was under the impression we allow these things to be there . Are we suppose to deny these egoic things (ignore or deny) or just let them not affect us??

Its kinda confusing cos you use the term "dont want that in my life..." hints at denial or something.. we need another word for it. like transparent or something??

[abrakamowse]

4 minutes ago, Will said:

interesting.. I was under the impression we allow these things to be there . Are we suppose to deny these egoic things (ignore or deny) or just let them not affect us??

Its kinda confusing cos you use the term "dont want that in my life..." hints at denial or something.. we need another word for it. like transparent or something??

Maybe I didn't use the  correct words, it was my ego talking lol...
 

I did that before, I just hide them... and that's worst. It will come back worst.

 

I had to learn to let them be, just recognize what they are and that they can't affect me. I could reach that point with meditation, that was the only way I trained my brain to let them go. Mindful meditation and just meditation observing my thoughts. They become powerless.

 

Not like I was doing before, in the past when I tried to hide them, or repress or deny them it was worst, they came back stronger.

Meditation is the solution, at least it worked for me.

 

 

Edited April 4, 2016 by abrakamowse

[Isle of View]

@Will 

3 hours ago, Will said:

3 hours ago, Isle of View said:

Clarity without empathy

I do empathise, of course i want the best for them. but i also realise its there own path.. Is that what you mean??

 

You wrote initially:

On 3.4.2016 at 5:33 AM, Will said:

Now that I have been self developing keenly for some time now. I am finding myself less  empathetic for victims.. 

 

That's what my post, or a large part of it, was based on.

 

3 hours ago, Will said:

 

3 hours ago, Isle of View said:

But the fact that you're asking here for perspectives shows me that you really are not that comfortable with what has just emerged between you and the other family member.

?? Not sure what you mean here.. 

In your OP (opening post) you asked for our perspective. This shows me that you are not really satisfied with that wich emerged (came about) between you and the family member you talked to. (i.e. their bewilderment et al.)

 

~Chris

[Philip]

3 hours ago, Will said:

Pointless?? How so??

@Will @abrakamowse The way I interact on this forum is different from Abrakamowse.

First of all, I try to put myself in the other person's shoes. I try to remember a moment in my own life where I had similar struggles. And also I try tu guess from what level of consciousness the person is operating. For example, a very low level would be a victim mindset. A slightly higher level would be a competitive growth mindset. After that, a compassion mindset. After that, a radically open-minded mindset, etc... You get the point ! Those levels are similar to graves model and spiral dynamics.

After that, what I try to do is I try to point out what kind of advice would have helped me the most at the time where I had a similar struggle. Or what insight helped me work on that problem at the time. And usually, the advice I come up with is always just a little bit more advanced than where the person currently is. It's just a bit too high consciousness for the person to have seen it right away, but still high enough for the person's brain to have to stretch itself in order to get to the core of my advice.

It like giving food to a cat. If the piece of food is always close to his nose, then you can make the cat follow you for miles. But if you're a hundred feet away, just forget it. The cat won't move a paw. And that's the mistake I saw Abrakamowse and other folks doing a lot on the forum.

At least, your advice was good. It was truthful, wise and it was the right level of thinking for a bunch of other readers. And at least, you didn't go a level lower hehe. You didn't say something like: "Don't give a fuck if they're offended by what you think. Life is a jungle. They're weak and they deserve the suffering" or "It is God's will if their couple brings them suffering. It's all ok, as long as they don't fuck before marriage!"

Do you guys want me to start a new topic for that ? So that we don't pollute this thread by diverting too much ?

[abrakamowse]

31 minutes ago, Philip said:

Do you guys want me to start a new topic for that ? So that we don't pollute this thread by diverting too much ?

I think is a good idea, I am learning all the time. And I think you have a good point on that. I am sometimes a bit impulsive.

[Will]

@Philip Nah its good here cos It helps to identify what we did.. Cheers!! Appreciate your persepctive..

[Epiphany_Inspired]

Sheep won't eat shit....but you pop that shit into the middle of an orchard grass sandwich and they will scarf it down....or at least be way less offended. My formula:

1. the top bread layer: Gratitude (say something from the heart about them that you think is fucking amazing, and mean it!)

2. the inner shit hidden in orchard grass layer: Blunt Truth ( be brutally honest, but use only kind compassionate words)

3. the outer bread layer: Power to the sheep (pump up your belief in them to see the reality, because they are so awesome).

I know some will say don't "sugar-coat" the truth....but is truth better ignored or absorbed? ...and yes I know it's subjective....

[Will]

@Epiphany_Inspired does still sound like we are trying to convonce others and show them our way..

I am soo cautious of this mentality.. Some part of mewants to be educated not be educating..

I dont really think what we do here is truth.. that sound too dogmatic..

I ma happy to be an agent of change but not at the cost of manipulation..

 

[Epiphany_Inspired]

@Will totally agree with you... that said, when I say "truth" (what is a better word for you?) I am referring to the obvious things in everyone's own life that only we/ they are unable to see. For example with your situation... you know that relationship is toxic, your friends probably do too, their friends, etc... likely everybody that comes in contact with them (unless they are really good at pulling off "the fakeries"...

...sometimes people need assistance to take the blindfold off ... often they don't even realize they are wearing it because there is a painting of an ideal world on the side against their eyes.... they can be so deep into the realm of denial, that they are unable to see serious problems such as; their drinking has turned into dependence that is destructive to their health and livelihood etc... my formula is likely judgemental, intrusive, and may even be manipulative... but if you are using it to truly make a positive difference in another's life.... in my opinion it's worth it.... then again, opinion are one of the lowest forms of consciousness, and I am a neurotic sheep myself in many ways... lol....

[Will]

@Epiphany_Inspired

4 hours ago, Epiphany_Inspired said:

when I say "truth" (what is a better word for you?)

awareness??

 

4 hours ago, Epiphany_Inspired said:

you know that relationship is toxic

Actually I have to make a judgement, I am not very sure, it is a reflection of what i saw in my own life.. with my ex.

 

4 hours ago, Epiphany_Inspired said:

sometimes people need assistance to take the blindfold off

Actually probably all the time.. I dont think telling them something they dont believe is the answer.. I think another approach would be to challenge them in a light and easy way.. " oh my god, you guys look amazing, i have never seen such a happy couple , even better than bradjelina!!"

 

4 hours ago, Epiphany_Inspired said:

then again, opinion are one of the lowest forms of consciousness, and I am a neurotic sheep myself in many ways... lol....

We all are