Why do some people try to belittle Leo and his work?

[7thLetter]

I see this time and time again, where people in the comments or in the forums where people try to act like they know everything and belittle Leo’s work.

From what I think, it seems to be a deep issue of a lack of self-honesty, and possibly an issue of them seeking validation on their level of knowledge or consciousness. A lack of self-honesty because they don’t want to accept that they are the ignorant ones so its so much easier to belittle other people and their ideas, theories, etc. I often see this in people struggling with narcissism, (which is something I had to deal with in the past) where they would try to make themselves superior to others. “I’m the best, I’m smarter than you, you are incompetent, you are lazy, you don’t know anything.”

This is one of the main reasons I get so disinterested in people in general. I often feel that people try to belittle me and what I do as well. It just seems like they get so insecure around me that I might as well just not be around them then.

I don’t want to go on too long with this post but what are your thoughts?

[ajasatya]

@7thLetter you know things i don't and vice versa. we're here to help each other. you might have been holding a distorted belief about the goal of this forum.

[7thLetter]

@ajasatya I’m talking about the deep psychological issue of people belittling other people, and asking why. So I don’t understand how your post is relevant. Please elaborate.

Of course we’re all here to help each other.

[Forestluv]

@7thLetter Immaturity and insecurity

[Hellspeed]

They should burn in hell! 

[Joseph Maynor]

Who, what when, where, why, how?

Why the thin skin?

[CreamCat]

Hey, this is Leo for actualized.org. Critics feel productive when they criticise others. They want to feel productive while being lazy. Criticism makes you feel productive even when you are lazy. Criticism is a way to distract oneself from working.

Leo already had answers for you. You just needed to look harder.

Edited October 15, 2018 by CreamCat

[Joseph Maynor]

4 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

@7thLetter Immaturity and insecurity

Really?  Across the board?  

[Forestluv]

1 hour ago, Joseph Maynor said:

Really?  Across the board?  

I speak from a humanist view. 

[Thesingularity]

Leo encourages people to do their own inquiry and that means investigation that requires to question everything. How can you belittle someone who call himself talking head and ask the listener to do not depend on his teaching and go and discover themselves?

[Joseph Maynor]

1 hour ago, Serotoninluv said:

I speak from a humanist view. 

Why would you pidgeonhole yourself like that?  That's a very Stage Green thing to say.  Things have to be looked at on a case by case basis.  Stages Yellow and above are all about nuanced thinking.  There's a spectrum between abusive unfair criticism on the one hand and constructive highly valuable criticism on the other.  Not all criticism is equal.  People who are against criticism across the board, and I'm not saying you are, are cutting themselves off from valuable information.  I want someone to tell me what they don't like about something I write, so long as it's genuine and constructive.  Otherwise I just keep making the same mistakes moving forward because if I noticed it myself I would've cleaned it up myself.  So, we want feedback from others.  You give feedback to others on here.  The Forum is all about trading feedback.  Turquoise is all about feedback across the entire Network of Perspectives.  If someone doesn't want feedback, they're not at Turquoise.  Blue very characteristically resists feedback from others.  Blue does not want to be challenged by other people about their beliefs or their ideologies.  

Edited October 15, 2018 by Joseph Maynor

[CreamCat]

@Joseph Maynor Leo already had an answer for that, too. In his video about criticism, he said constructive criticism is feedback and you want to receive feedback but ignore criticism.

Edited October 15, 2018 by CreamCat

[Joseph Maynor]

13 minutes ago, CreamCat said:

@Joseph Maynor Leo already had an answer for that, too. In his video about criticism, he said constructive criticism is feedback and you want to receive feedback but ignore criticism.

Then you gotta be willing to take that and not whine about it.  I'm not saying Leo is whining, but this post (topic) is slightly whining.  You gotta drop the why is everybody picking one me knee-jerk reaction to be able to take criticism constructively.  First you gotta be open to receiving criticism from others.  Most people can't even get that far.  Taking criticism is a virtue that has to be practiced and cultivated.  The higher up you go in Spiral Dynamics the more amendable you'll be in accepting feedback from others.  It's the people in the Tier-One Stages that think they've got it all figured out and avoid feedback like the plague.  Tier-One Stages do not like criticism at all.  The Egoic self doesn't like criticism.  

Edited October 15, 2018 by Joseph Maynor

[CreamCat]

26 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

First you gotta be open to receiving criticism from others.  Most people can't even get that far.  Taking criticism is a virtue that has to be practiced and cultivated.

Do you mean feedback? I wouldn't take destructive criticisms like insults seriously.

What do you do about insults and otherwise useless criticisms devoid of useful information?

• You suck!
• You are ignorant
• You are an idiot
• Fuck you
• You don't know nothing
• Your work is terrible.
• Your work is disgusting.
• You are a terrible human being.
• You are disgusting!
• You are an abomination.
• You are a maggot !!
• You are wrong!
• You are just a hater, aren't you? Admit it. You are a hater.
• You will fail if you keep doing the thing you cherish. Loser. Anyone who does it will fail. Do what I do, and you will succeed. Sucker!
• You will never get good at it.
• ...

Edited October 15, 2018 by CreamCat

[Shin]

[Forestluv]

1 hour ago, Joseph Maynor said:

There's a spectrum between abusive unfair criticism on the one hand and constructive highly valuable criticism on the other.  Not all criticism is equal.  

That is Orange level thinking ? 

Sometimes Orange tools come in handy ? . Other times green tools, other times Yellow. Sometimes an integration. . . 

[CreamCat]

11 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

Sometimes Orange tools come in handy ?

That's right. Every stage has something to offer. Many people should work on Beige again. They don't sleep well and don't eat well. Because they don't get fundamentals right, they screw up higher stages.

If you screw up at Beige, you can't succeed in higher stages.

Edited October 15, 2018 by CreamCat

[7thLetter]

2 hours ago, Joseph Maynor said:

Then you gotta be willing to take that and not whine about it.  I'm not saying Leo is whining, but this post (topic) is slightly whining.

@Joseph Maynor If you're talking about me and this topic, then ok if that's how you see it, then that's how you see it. There's millions of ways you can view a thing so I can't blame you. Maybe someone views this topic as me crying about it, or maybe someone thinks I'm ignorant or jealous, or insane, or immature posting this topic. Maybe I can view your forum username Joseph Maynor as offensive because maybe it was the name of some racist criminal who committed some terrible crime against blacks back in the early 1900s. Or maybe its your Dad's name, or your name, who knows. Only you know. Just like me, only I know why I created this post. 

I'm much more interested in the psychology of this issue and understanding the core of it rather than "whining" about why this happens. Sure maybe slightly I'm whining where I would get disinterested in people who do so, but I'm just mainly trying to understand the psychology of it.

If you have read my previous posts, (which I'm sure you have) all of it is mainly for me to understand the deep psychology of an issue. For example you posted on my "Why is sales so manipulative?" Several people on that topic (including you) seemed to just read the title of the thread and post an answer, rather than understanding the content of the thread. I'm telling you, go back to that post and people who have posted on that topic think I'm literally asking why sales is manipulative. I still haven't even got the answer I was looking for in that thread. In that thread, I was interested in the deep psychology of manipulative sales, rather than it being me "whining" about sales being manipulative.

Edited October 15, 2018 by 7thLetter

[Michael569]

imagine this: you are a young individual, a teenager who runs around confused, unsure why things arent running well for him. He goes to youtube and asks the "internet". "Why does my life suck"? 

Hitting correct keywords he finds Leo who tells him he was never born and every aspect of his life is full of shit....this boy gets pissed, leaves nasty comment which eventually ends up "liked" by other confused souls and leaves to watch Pew Die Pie. ..end of story. 

except that this does not have to be a teenager, this can be a young enterpreneur, a divorced mother, a burned up executive or an unsuccessful athlete. What do they have in common? A huge self-righteous ego and no past experience with these topics...and perhaps being unlucky enough to open one of Leo's advanced videos where they should have started with something way simpler.  

Edited October 15, 2018 by Michael569

[Artaemis]

@Joseph Maynor Hm. I did not know that about tier 1.

The discomfort you feel from feedback/criticism can instill new values and realizations which would otherwise be a lot more slow in developing. And I'm interested in accelerating my integration. I joined this forum to make myself as uncomfortable as possible so I could integrate. This is hitting the core of my motives and who I am. 

 

 

Edited October 15, 2018 by Artaemis