Concentration vs. Awareness in Mindfulness Meditation

[FredFred]

Two questions popped in my mind while meditating.

When I watch the breath, I've noticed that my mind shift between 2 'states'. I'm either concentrated on the feeling of breath, or simply aware of the breath. Let me clarify what I'm talking about, we need to speak the same language :

Concentration : A general sense of 'being' the breath. Focusing really heavily on feeling it's coldness, it's bumps and waves, it's velocity, it's mass... When in this state, I feel like my consciousness is completely inside the breath, about at the far end of the throat. It's like I'm analyzing the breath back and forth every single time I breath in or breathe out.

Awareness : Simply being conscious of the breath. Like watching the breath from far, far away. A dot that 'is' when inhaling, and that 'isn't' when exhaling. Being close enough to know when the breath is, but being far enough to have forgotten what breathing means.

I've already figured that the shifting between these states is problematic. I need to focus all my energy on one state or the other, not alternate between the two. Now that you know what I'm talking about, here are my two questions : 

1. Am I even on the right track? Am I experiencing the right things? Is it normal to have this result?

2. If normal, which one of the 2 states should I put my energy on?

I figured I would ask wiser people,

Thank you

Edited October 15, 2018 by FredFred

[Jack River]

When i direct energy in a certain direction that is the limited energy of desire/thought which=concentration. That leads to an experience because the experiencer is being activated with its motive and content. Awareness doesn't move in a certain direction. Has no motive, and doesn't act by the influence of thought. Awareness doesn't choose dude. 

Edited October 14, 2018 by Jack River

[YaNanNallari]

The sure way and the reason the technique works is the concentration part

[i am I AM]

Try not to concentrate too hard. "Awareness" is what you're looking for so take a break if you need to.

[FredFred]

35 minutes ago, YaNanNallari said:

The sure way and the reason the technique works is the concentration part

 

14 minutes ago, i am I AM said:

Try not to concentrate too hard. "Awareness" is what you're looking for so take a break if you need to.

 

Edited October 14, 2018 by FredFred

[Jack River]

awareness is difficult because self/thought is limited to motive. Any kind of motive or intent kills the freedom of awareness dude. That's why is needed to understand fear/desire/psychological time. 

Edited October 14, 2018 by Jack River

[FredFred]

@Jack River Thank you for your awareness explanation, helps me understand it better

But still, for mindfulness meditation, is concentration or awareness the better option?

[Jack River]

@FredFred give me a explanation of how mindfulness meditation works and I’ll tell you if it’s concentration based or attention/awareness based. The definition that caught your interest I mean. 

Edited October 14, 2018 by Jack River

[FredFred]

@Jack River Bringing total, undivided attention to the breath. Noticing thoughts arrive, but letting them go in order to return on the breath. Doing that over and over again.

[Jack River]

1 minute ago, FredFred said:

@Jack River Bringing total, undivided attention to the breath. Noticing thoughts arrive, but letting them go in order to return on the breath. Doing that over and over again.

Right. Well if we are bringing attention to breath is that concentrated focused attention? Which is divided. 

Edited October 15, 2018 by Jack River

[Jack River]

anything that is directed in a certain direction means it is a divided attention. This is Thoughts/selfs nature. So if that is the way mindfulness is suppose to be done it’s a concentration game. 

Edited October 15, 2018 by Jack River

[Jack River]

Anything involving a motive is divided. 

[FredFred]

@Jack River So I understand that I should start with concentration on the breath at first. Pure awareness looks very hard to achieve and I won't be there for quite a while.

I'm interested however on how the transition between concentration and pure awareness will go. Will concentration simply dissolve, leaving place to awareness?

[Jack River]

5 minutes ago, FredFred said:

I'm interested however on how the transition between concentration and pure awareness will go. Will concentration simply dissolve, leaving place to awareness?

I don’t think so. Are you aware of all the subtle ways concentration is in action? 

It’s wise to understand the nature of concentration and its relationship to thought/self/psychological time. Then when you see the totality of all that you don’t move within that field of concentration any longer. Awareness sees all that and doesn’t move in that pattern anymore. That’s the intelligence of truth observing. 

Edited October 15, 2018 by Jack River

[Bluff]

8 minutes ago, FredFred said:

@Jack River

I'm interested however on how the transition between concentration and pure awareness will go. Will concentration simply dissolve, leaving place to awareness?

 

there is no transition. awareness is always there. concentration in the end is destraction and you'll laugh when you'll see

 

edit: dont get me wrong.. concentration is importend

Edited October 15, 2018 by Bluff
correction

[Jack River]

I wasted 8-9 years getting caught in my own contradiction/concentration. Then 2 months ago a friend introduced me to simply understanding fear/psychological time and how it arises in all its subtlety's throughout the day. Then once I saw that fear was always influencing action that made me interested in the nature of thought. That’s a wise place to start dude. 

[Jack River]

3 minutes ago, Bluff said:

 

there is no transition. awareness is always there. concentration in the end is destraction and you'll laugh when you'll see

 

edit: dont get me wrong.. concentration is importend

Awareness isn’t always there. Thought does identify with awareness as an idea though. One of thoughts tricks. I did that. True Awareness doesn’t get caught in these tricks. 

[i am I AM]

.@Jack River In Rupert Spira meditation "bringing expectation to an end" he talks about the emotional impulses in mind, a.k.a, pre-rational thoughts that help to separate you and not be pure awareness.....so, the state you refer to is not permanent without being enlightened. One can't adhere to these conditions consistently in another case.

Just now, FredFred said:

So I understand that I should start with concentration on the breath at first. Pure awareness looks very hard to achieve and I won't be there for quite a while. If you need to do that^, that works.

 

 

[Jack River]

Concentration is good for getting shit done outwardly. But inwardly it causes the issues. 

 

[SageModeAustin]

@Jack River

7 minutes ago, Jack River said:

I wasted 8-9 years getting caught in my own contradiction/concentration. Then 2 months ago a friend introduced me to simply understanding fear/psychological time and how it arises in all its subtlety's throughout the day. Then once I saw that fear was always influencing action that made me interested in the nature of thought. That’s a wise place to start dude. 

Can you explain this fear/psychological time more?