Interview for people demonizing Jordan Peterson

[Forestluv]

15 minutes ago, CreamCat said:

@Serotoninluv TJ Reeves advocates embodying every lower stage properly before moving up. In a way, purple is not dead. Blue and Orange are very much alive in myself. Red weakened, but I need to strengthen it again. I'm going to work on Beige, Purple, Red, Blue, Orange, and then Green. I'll start with Beige. Working on Beige means sleeping right, eating right, meditating right, breathing right, and a few other things.

He says ignoring lower stages leads to unhealthy aspects of higher stages.

When you advance higher, you do not reject lower level aspects - they become more sophisticated. Think of a spiral staircase. Green spirals around over Blue. Both Green and Blue value community - yet Green connunity is more sophisticated than Blue community.

Similarly, Yellow spirals over Orange. A hallmark of Orange is rational thinking. A yellow individual doesn’t think “I need to work on my rational thinking, I better drop back down to Orange so I can work on it”. No. A yellow person maintains the ability to think rationally - but now it is more sophisticated. A yellow would integrate rational thought with relativism and systems thinking. 

Also, a meta view of SD is yellow systems thinking. Don’t assume all yellow level thinkers will think the same. Just like two Orange level scientists won’t necessarily think the same.  

[CreamCat]

@Serotoninluv I don't see Orange as a substitute for Red in terms of motivation. Rational thinking is not very motivating.

Edited October 11, 2018 by CreamCat

[Forestluv]

3 minutes ago, CreamCat said:

@Serotoninluv I don't see Orange as a substitute for Red in terms of motivation.

Both Red and Orange are motivated to fulfill personal desires. Irange is just more sophisticated. Red might cut an adversaries fingers off, Orange might slander an adversary. 

[CreamCat]

@Serotoninluv You might want to read my summary of TJ Reeves' take on spiral dynamics on this forum. Did you read it already?

[Setty]

@Serotoninluv  

Well he is skeptical of postmodernism because he is thinks the made up structures by humans are useful and if you tear them down you might make a big mess. Here is showing his traditionalism. He thinks that people made a very complex understanding of the universe throuout the years that somewhat works and if you dismantle it too quickly the chance you will make a better system is close to zero. I think his problem is that he fears too much of what would happen if you just get rid of it all at once. He doesn't understand he would find the absolute in that. But who knows that without the prior  experience with psychedelics?

As for the LGBTQ. He doesn't think it is wrong to be homosexual. He thinks the traditional family works well because the child needs to have a role model of the feminine and masculine at the same time and if you are a homosexual couple you have it harder to teach it to the child. So they have a big responsibility and because it is a new problem no one really knows how to deal with that. 

As for the pronounce controversy he doesn't like to fact that it should be ilegal for him not to choose to call someone by their prefered pronoun. And as the new made up genders go I think he doesn't like them because again it forces other people to change your speech to suit them.

[Forestluv]

@Setty If JP resonates with you - go for it. 

I encourage you to outgrow JP. That may seem inconceivable now, but you can do it. Sam Harris was my primary teacher for a long time. He is so brilliant, I couldn’t imagine reaching his level. Then one day I became aware that I had surpassed Harris. I could see more holistically. It was like I was watching a child learn how to ride a bicycle. It’s an amazing perspective.

I watched a video of a 13 year old kid at Yellow stage. Two levels higher than JP. Society is advancing faster and faster. . . 

[TomDashingPornstar]

@Serotoninluv

13 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

Of course not. As well evolve upward, Blue will become extinct. We will shift upward. Orange will be the lower level and more people will be Yellow. Then, new Yellow and Turquoise categories will arise.

Purple is dead in the U.S.A. - Blue is dying and will eventually die off. 

Purple is dead because we killed the native Americans!  Blue isn't dying, who do you think comes from Mexico!?

Edited October 12, 2018 by TomDashingPornstar

[Shroomdoctor]

@Setty I often hear the "Peterson tells people what they already know but cant express."

I find it sad that people label him as some anti feminine tyrant, which is far from the case.

@Serotoninluv I was under the impression we had to integrated blue, orange, yellow etc. values, not dismiss EVERYHTING that stage has to offer.

@Emerald I think your view of Peterson is highly missconstructed based on a few snippets of what he might have said and what he got "hyped" for. That is why I suggested watching this video to get a good grasp of his viewpoints and attitude.

The main focus of his points is individual betterment to advance society and avoid catastrophe, which I think we all can agree on. Also the points that Setty mentioned. I don't care so much about his political stuff, which is only a tiny subset of his agenda. But to get to that too:

Maybe I am wrong, but parts of the "green" identity politic movement is, in my own view, not at all green but demonizing against some groups like the stereotypical "cis white male". Like there is real hatred there, that's not green. Thats the same as Nazis hating foreigners. 

I think we need to move ABOVE stereotypicalisations and not flip them. See the individual, not the black women, the white men or the mexican transgender. And I think identity politics, which is the only "forward" movement JP is criticizing, is a step backwards.

 

Edited October 12, 2018 by Shroomdoctor

[Joyboy]

14 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

Of course not. As well evolve upward, Blue will become extinct. We will shift upward. Orange will be the lower level and more people will be Yellow. Then, new Yellow and Turquoise categories will arise.

Purple is dead in the U.S.A. - Blue is dying and will eventually die off. 

Are you talking about global consciousness shift? It takes centuries.

[Preetom]

15 hours ago, Outer said:

Why are you dreaming while you're awake?

Is that under my control whether the dream should continue or not?

After all, I never seem to control dreams at night time. What arrogance makes me think I can control it while being awake?

[billiesimon]

19 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

Of course not. As well evolve upward, Blue will become extinct. We will shift upward. Orange will be the lower level and more people will be Yellow. Then, new Yellow and Turquoise categories will arise.

Purple is dead in the U.S.A. - Blue is dying and will eventually die off. 

Well, techically purple stage was already dead in european culture since the roman republic (in italy) and then completely disappeared in western europe with the advent of christianity which leveled up all the barbaric folks to red (feudal castles) and blue.

U.S.A. was born in an era where europe was full solid blue, and so were the founding fathers.

European culture was very fast to dismiss beige/purple/red in general.

[d0ornokey]

On 10/12/2018 at 3:31 AM, Shroomdoctor said:

Maybe I am wrong, but parts of the "green" identity politic movement is, in my own view, not at all green but demonizing against some groups like the stereotypical "cis white male". Like there is real hatred there, that's not green. Thats the same as Nazis hating foreigners. 

 

im assuming you're getting that perspective from youtube 

i used to think the same

i thought 3rd wave feminism was stupid and bigoted

i watched all those videos debunking feminism 

i learned a year ago that i had a biased view from youtube and that those people are just extreme green and are just a very small fraction of the population

that they don't represent green as a whole 

the average feminist is just a normal kind girl you'll meet. they aren't radical as i had thought 

green and feminism is much better represented in the Green examples thread on this forum 

[Shroomdoctor]

@d0ornokey well I have encountered quite a lot of thee lefties in real life since starting University.

But yes they are a loud minority just as the radical right.

[art]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvYrrexNKyI @Leo Gura 

[Quicksilver]

Colors... Colors everywhere. 

 

[abundance]

On 10/11/2018 at 2:33 PM, TomDashingPornstar said:

@Serotoninluv

Green like to immigrate Blue and Red people. You can't have a completely green nation.

And if it weren't for Orange people/policies, a lot of these Blue and Red people wouldn't be immigrating in mass in the first place. 

I do agree, however that people with 'Green' values tend to be a bit naive when it comes to stage Purple, Red and Blue. There is nothing wrong with being empathetic but not to the point where it jeapardizes societal stability. There needs be an honest and open look at how we're all contributing to the problem and how we can fix it. I think that would take 'Yellow' type thinking ?