The Horror of Consciousness: The Denial of Reality Through Spiritual Belief

[Consilience]

@Violinpracticerdude

The experiences are what they are. But if you want to find the roof of spirituality start questioning the hell out of WHO or WHAT is witnessing those experiencing? Divert all of your rationality and focus on what is witnessing every bit of your direct experience. Not beliefs about who you think is witnessing it (ie a self) but actually directly experiencing the witness to not just spiritual experiences, but every day experiences as well. 

[Violinpracticerdude]

1 minute ago, Consilience said:

@Violinpracticerdude

The experiences are what they are. But if you want to find the roof of spirituality start questioning the hell out of WHO or WHAT is witnessing those experiencing? Divert all of your rationality and focus on what is witnessing every bit of your direct experience. Not beliefs about who you think is witnessing it (ie a self) but actually directly experiencing the witness to not just spiritual experiences, but every day experiences as well. 

It's pretty obvious I'm the one experiencing those experiences, a five-year-old can tell you that.

[Consilience]

@Violinpracticerdude

have you considered the possibility that there is no “you” experiencing? If no, id contemplate this heavily.

You should also read “The Book of Not Knowing” by Peter Ralston dude. I feel like it’s a perfect book to introduce spiritual concepts for the rational mind and takes a very pragmatic approach towards what REAL spirituality is getting at. At the very least it’ll give you a lot to think about. 

[Jack River]

1 minute ago, Consilience said:

feel like it’s a perfect book to introduce spiritual concepts for the rational mind and takes a very pragmatic approach towards what REAL spirituality

Introduce concepts? 

[Jack River]

The Horror of Consciousness: The Denial of Reality Through Spiritual Belief?

 

Reality is not a horror dog child. That is a belief in reinsurance to what is by clinging to thought.  

Edited October 5, 2018 by Jack River

[Jack River]

Reading books, grasping for the ground of being?? Ah man, what happened to us? 

[Shadowraix]

2 hours ago, Emanyalpsid said:

@Violinpracticerdude

Hey dude, you're basically shouting to people in a church that God does not exist. Here they all believe they are god, or infinite consciousness or absolute infinity, because of their non-duality experience and their believe in enlightenment. They all abandoned reality to stay in their mind bubble, thinking it is all consciousness. Spare your time and energy, they are beyond salvation. I also tried to reach them with no results. Read these topics and see how they, by ignoring reality, are attached to their believe in infinite consciousness because they do not understand the nature of it. They believe in a truth (infinite consciousness), which they defend by coming up with arguments, instead of focussing on reality. So, they are all happy in their minds as long as they don't have to deal with reality, by ignoring it or dismissing it as ignorant. I trew everything out of reality at them, but they keep holding on.

https://www.actualized.org/forum/topic/25468-the-definite-guide-to-non-duality-enlightenment-and-the-nature-of-reality/

https://www.actualized.org/forum/topic/25857-the-egg-experiment/

https://www.actualized.org/forum/topic/25637-leo-guras-sick-logic-on-happiness-youtube/

There is a test however to verify if consciousness is infinite or that it is created by the brain; by slamming someone on the head with a baseball bat to see which prevails; consciousness or the brain. However, while they are so convinced, no one volunteers to take this test... I wonder why

The difference is, they will stay on this forum and you will leave. This is their Church.

You claim people abandoned reality yet you are comparing that to your own perception of reality.

The thing about infinity is that all perspectives represent some facet of truth.

[Consilience]

19 minutes ago, Jack River said:

Introduce concepts? 

Mmm... more like deconstruct concepts. But language is entirely conceptual so it’s using concepts to deconstruct concepts lol

[Jack River]

25 minutes ago, Consilience said:

Mmm... more like deconstruct concepts. But language is entirely conceptual so it’s using concepts to deconstruct concepts lol

Why not just understand self/thought, or Learn about the concepts we already are caught in? Does one concept cancel out another? Or is understanding the concept maker/making work to end thise patterns of belief? 

[Girzo]

Those threads are ridiculous.

You guys clearly have no idea what you talk about and constantly conflate duality with non-duality.

Truth is not a conept, it's not a belief. There's a direct way of accessing reality that's not in your experience yet.

Arrogance won't help you in discovering anything. Stick to some practice, wheter it's self-inquiry, meditation or Yoga and humble yourself.

@Violinpracticerdude

@Emanyalpsid

[Consilience]

21 minutes ago, Jack River said:

Why not just understand self/thought, or Learn about the concepts we already are caught in? Does one concept cancel out another? Or is understanding the concept maker/making work to end thise patterns of belief? 

Because sometimes people are so wrapped up in concept land, they’re not in a position to understand self/thought or go metta enough to see the concepts they’re wrapped up in. 

 

Does one concept cancel out another? Of course not. Concepts do not cancel anything nor do they act at all. They point awareness and mind in various directions.

 

Is understanding the concept maker/making work to end these patterns of beliefs? From my experience, YES. The only reason I was ever sent down this path was through CONCEPTUAL understanding of what concepts actually are. 

 

Concepts actually point towards their own nature; once the conceptual understanding of concepts has set in, one may find value in being. Prior to that understanding, one might also believe spirituality, being, truth are all beliefs when in fact, the opposite is what is required.

 

You can use concepts to leverage yourself out of concept land. And then the only thing left is to BE. 

[Jack River]

5 minutes ago, Consilience said:

Because sometimes people are so wrapped up in concept land, they’re not in a position to understand self/thought or go metta enough to see the concepts they’re wrapped up in. 

 

Does one concept cancel out another? Of course not. Concepts do not cancel anything nor do they act at all. They point awareness and mind in various directions.

 

Is understanding the concept maker/making work to end these patterns of beliefs? From my experience, YES. The only reason I was ever sent down this path was through CONCEPTUAL understanding of what concepts actually are. 

 

Concepts actually point towards their own nature; once the conceptual understanding of concepts has set in, one may find value in being. Prior to that understanding, one might also believe spirituality, being, truth are all beliefs when in fact, the opposite is what is required.

 

You can use concepts to leverage yourself out of concept land. And then the only thing left is to BE. 

Maybe. so we are then learning about limitation? 

[Consilience]

@Jack River Yes yes!

[Emanyalpsid]

@Violinpracticerdude

I already knew through Buddhism that the non-self is only half of the insight into reality. So I can see clearly what they are imaginating/ holding onto. 

You guys believe that it (infinite consciousness, absolute infinity, or whatever you call it) exists upon itself. Therefore you are holding on to itself.

@Girzo

Read it thoroughly and try to see what I try to explain. The non-duality of existence is not only non-dual because the ego creates an separation. But it is also non-dual because it (infinite consciousness, absolute infinity) does not exist upon itself. It requires deep investigation to see this.

[Jack River]

1 minute ago, Consilience said:

@Jack River Yes yes!

That’s very groveable dude. I think people feel they need books because of conditioning, when it’s all here in ourselves to be understood. But yeah understanding limitation is important. Thanks for your reply. 

[Consilience]

11 minutes ago, Jack River said:

DThat’s very groveable dude. I think people feel they need books because of conditioning, when it’s all here in ourselves to be understood. But yeah understanding limitation is important. Thanks for your reply. 

Thank you for asking questions. Overall I agree though- it’s all found within and no books are needed  

[Shin]

The real horror is going to retreat and spiritual stuff session and being the only person below 30 when everyone is at least 40.

Or is it ?

So much cougars offered on a silver plate ???

[Shadowraix]

2 hours ago, Emanyalpsid said:

Read it thoroughly and try to see what I try to explain. The non-duality of existence is not only non-dual because the ego creates an separation. But it is also non-dual because it (infinite consciousness, absolute infinity) does not exist upon itself. It requires deep investigation to see this.

Existence/nonexistence is also a illusory duality.

1 minute ago, Shin said:

The real horror is going to retreat and spiritual stuff session and being the only person below 30 when everyone is at least 40.

Or is it ?

So much cougars offered on a silver plate ???

I want to go to vipassana or whatever but my nearest one is a couple of states away. I'm probably go in my early 20s as im just turning 20.

[Shin]

20 minutes ago, Shadowraix said:

Existence/nonexistence is also a illusory duality.

I want to go to vipassana or whatever but my nearest one is a couple of states away. I'm probably go in my early 20s as im just turning 20.

You little dirty bastard ??

[Rilles]

13 hours ago, Shin said:

The real horror is going to retreat and spiritual stuff session and being the only person below 30 when everyone is at least 40.

Or is it ?

So much cougars offered on a silver plate ???

I DIEEEEED???????