Was I enlightened for some seconds?

[Evelyn]

My story goes like this: since about  aprox. two months I read about continual breath awareness as explained here: https://www.actualized.org/forum/topic/12385-how-i-became-enlightened-fast-and-how-you-can-do-it-to/ . I tried it and it is quite efficient in grounding me.  Some days ago, perhaps a week, I read the phrase: “without thoughts you do not exist”. I pondered it and went to bed, aware of my breath. Now at some point, between sleep and wakefulness, when my mind went to sleep I “awoke”. For some seconds I realized I did not exist. I just was, pure consciousness, no thoughts at all and I knew I reached this so called “enlightenment”, although I felt as if it was always there.  I was so happy and relieved that “I” did not exist, that I never actually existed, there was no way I could grab myself.  Also, I understood what “enlightenment” was in a way I cannot describe in words. It was bliss and freedom.  It felt incredible simple and easy to reach, like, how could I not see it until then. I knew all this without thinking, I just knew.  Also, there was no conscious focus, like I am usually focused in my head; in the darkness of the room I was this consciousness with no form or focus. And then…. Of course I felt my mind waking up… I felt myself slipping away from the experience and getting back to “normal”. Looking back, I could no longer comprehend the experience with my mind.

I am a bit confused as to what happened, was I dreaming or did I reach some enlightenment, and if I reached it, why didn’t I keep it? Also, when I am in this state, of wake and sleep I sometimes get really intense states of awareness, not as intense as that one, but blissful and no thoughts, with no effort at all. I feel like I get them unconsciously. I cannot get them in a normal meditation.

During day I usually have a hard time staying aware all the time. I have become more aware of all my thought trains and mental loops. After a while of self-observation I realized I am completely and utterly insane . But even with this I still fall into train thoughts, loop thoughts, emotional patters, etc… It’s as if I am addicted to them and I don’t know how to stop doing it. I feel like I am running in circles. All day I am in and out of awareness, constantly identifying with thoughts, and as time passes I get more frustrated and angry about it. I feel like I can’t relax because I have to constantly grab unto awareness. I know I have to relax, but if I loosen the “grip” I get swapped again in the thought trains. I am putting so much effort into this, while in those states of wake and sleep it is totally effortless and natural. I have no idea how to get there consciously…

Also, I feel like I am not getting any real progress on awareness, like it’s not building up. I can be incredibly aware for 2 days, and then for 3 days straight I am in a mental fog and train thought I cannot escape, and then again 1 day of awareness and so on…. Please share if you had something similar or some tips that might help me. Thank you. Greatly appreciated…

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Evelyn said:

why didn’t I keep it?

Count how many times you wrote "me", "my", "I" in your post.

That's why.

You keep thinking you into existence. Stop thinking about yourself and you will cease to exist.

"You" can't get enlightened. Enlightenment is the end of you-ing.

This problem requires extreme mindfulness. Watch for I-thoughts like a hawk and deconstruct them or let them go.

It needs to become clear that the self is a conceptual fabrication, not a physical object. And this needs to be seen deeper than at the level of thinking about it.

[njuufa]

 

You were happy because you knew there is nothing to grasp. And first thing after that experience you wonder : why I could not keep it ? Classic, you want to be happy but you have a little secret that says "i do not want to be happy" is running the show in your head but the whole show does not run this way, maybe.

Dont forget that where you are now is what you wished before. You practiced meditation to become aware of your issues to get rid off these. There is no turning back now. You must clean the mess up that you created throughout your life, because that is what really is holding you back from growing, not the degree of your awareness itself per say. 

To judge awareness now would mean that you do not trust it. But how can you judge it if you have not even used it yet ? And not discovered the full range of its power. Be patient. Trust it. And stop underestimating yourself. 

Take one unconscious thing from its head that peaks out and start slowly pulling it out. Then you have chance to discover its whole structure. At the same time this involuntary judgement arises which proves how fake and limited it is which you are aware of and now know how to perform in a sense.

Much much love  

 

 

 

[Evelyn]

@Outer I haven't really tried self-inquiry. Since some time my goal has been to become englightened, to know the truth, but yea, I guess it slipped my mind to even ask who wants to get enlightened .  I just took this meditation method and run with it. I see the value of it, when I ask these questions my mind sort of stops on its tracks and hits a wall...  Funny feeling . Thanks for the tip. Also, that map is amazing .

@Leo Gura  Reading your reply made me realize how ego-centered I actually am. Everythig in my life revolves around "me" and everything is about "me". I am doing this observation, I am aware, I am frustrated, I try, I get angry, I search for answers,  I want to know etc...  I think I have fallen into what is called ego obsever trap and did not even realize it. I read about it but of course I said nay nay nay , IIIIIIIIIII am deeply aware :))

I also noticed a subtle program or pattern of victimhood I did not see before. All this struggle and frustration creates a feeling of helplessness and I feel pity for myself and I search and ask for answers to make me feel better. All this creates and perpetuates the sense of I. I quite enjoy being the victim and sabotaging myself, which gives much fuel to the ego...

@njuufa Yes, my mind chimed in and already wanted to grab the thing I cannot really grab.

Indeed there is still much work to do. I don't have to give up, though I do think about giving up a lot of time,  which is part of the behaviour mentioned earlier. I whine and complain and pity myself and then I try again and then I sabotage myself again and pity myself again. It's so subtle and I have been so identified with this behaviour that only now I see it. This is not the first time I see some behaviour I was totally identified with. I have to deconstruct what this "me, I and myself" is and in the end realize that there is no "I".

Thanks a lot for the answers, made me realize a few things, I feel like this is what I needed to continue.

Edited October 2, 2018 by Evelyn

[Jack River]

People jump into self inquiry without understanding what is used to self inquire which is thought. If I don’t understand my own limit in inquiring the inquiry becomes corrupt. This messed me up and became a big waste of them for me dudes. Like an 8year waste 

Edited October 2, 2018 by Jack River

[Flammable]

1 hour ago, Jack River said:

People jump into self inquiry without understanding what is used to self inquire which is thought. If I don’t understand my own limit in inquiring the inquiry becomes corrupt. This messed me up and became a big waste of them for me dudes. Like an 8year waste 

This is what confuses me a lot about self-enquiry - how do you do it without involving thoughts into it? 

[Jack River]

3 minutes ago, Flammable said:

This is what confuses me a lot about self-enquiry - how do you do it without involving thoughts into it? 

Fosho dude. So we will self inquire without knowing the limit of that activity. Then we will feed the self more and more. Motive which is thought also corrupts the inquiry. 

[Jack River]

A good friend showed me this. At first I was upset that he showed me because I had put so much time into it. But then once I saw what I had been doing i couldn’t go back to it. 

[Evelyn]

@Jack River When I ask who am I or who is thinking my mind stops and I become aware, very aware and present. I think that is the purpose?  

Btw, after I realized I was in the ego observer trap and that being aware was such an effort because "I" was being aware, I calmed and relaxed quite a bit. My awareness is different somehow now, it feels more flowing and natural. 

And as with all things and coincidences today the Dhjedi master key from ArcturusRa arrived. It is a key mentioned by @AleksM,  the forum member who wrote about continual breath awareness. As I put it on I felt subtle vibrations in my crown and heart chakra and as I meditated a bit I felt the root chakra heating... And I feel incredibly calm and centered, it's as if I took a tranquilizer . It is amazing, I feel so incredibly good, like it slowed down my hectic mind and I am able to be more aware. Did not expect to work so fast and so well... 

 

Edited October 2, 2018 by Evelyn

[Jack River]

@Evelyn fosho it soothes “the me”. That’s my point. To soothe the me strengthens the me. It becomes a habit/routine. Then it becomes a dependence, and hents fear. Dependence or fear makes conflict. Conflict never leads to freedom. To me this is easy to see now. 

Edited October 2, 2018 by Jack River

[Jack River]

Routine strengthens the me. Thought depends on the rinse and repeat 

[Evelyn]

@Jack River I think I see what you mean, to do self-inquiry you have to ask from the perspective of "I" who is asking, therefore perpetuating the "I". Something like another subtle trap you cannot notice easily. 

[Jack River]

1 minute ago, Evelyn said:

@Jack River I think I see what you mean, to do self-inquiry you have to ask from the perspective of "I" who is asking, therefore perpetuating the "I". Something like another subtle trap you cannot notice easily. 

It really trapped me personally. Then I was always up and down with my mood. It was like a pleasure/fear type of deal. Was very tiring for me. 

[Shin]

4 minutes ago, Evelyn said:

@Jack River I think I see what you mean, to do self-inquiry you have to ask from the perspective of "I" who is asking, therefore perpetuating the "I". Something like another subtle trap you cannot notice easily. 

You can also ask what you are, where you are or my new favorite am i dreaming.

Pretty scary when you're not sure if you're dreaming or not ?

Edited October 2, 2018 by Shin

[Evelyn]

@Shin

3 minutes ago, Shin said:

You can also ask what you are, where you are or my new favorite am i dreaming.

Pretty scary when you're not sure if you're dreaming or not ?

You can get lucid dreams with those questions! Reminds me of when I had lucid dreams and I was unsure of whether I was dreaming or not, so I did a reality check to make sure I was dreaming, just before jumping off buildings... just in case .

 

[Jack River]

3 minutes ago, Shin said:

You can also ask what you are, where you are or my new favorite am i dreaming.

Can we understand the tool of inquiry? Then maybe we see how that tool is feeding itself. 

[Evelyn]

@Jack River

2 minutes ago, Jack River said:

Can we understand the tool of inquiry? Then maybe we see how that tool is feeding itself. 

Before continual breath awareness I tried for a bit Mahashi style nothing. It was imposible to follow it in this day and age where you have many things to do. It also bothered me that I had to keep repeating what was I doing (like washing washing, bending bending, reaching reaching, etc) when the point is to get to beyond thought. Self-inquiry also uses thought, in a different way, but still uses. I don't know if a method that uses thought can get you to no-thought.

[cetus]

18 minutes ago, Shin said:

You can also ask what you are, where you are or my new favorite am i dreaming.

Pretty scary when you're not sure if you're dreaming or not ?

@Shin You mention dreaming. Just wanted to say thanks for posting Leo's "Life is a Dream" video yesterday. I forgot how good that one is. Just got done watching it again.

[Shin]

21 minutes ago, cetus56 said:

@Shin

 

39 minutes ago, Evelyn said:

@Shin

You can get lucid dreams with those questions! Reminds me of when I had lucid dreams and I was unsure of whether I was dreaming or not, so I did a reality check to make sure I was dreaming, just before jumping off buildings... just in case .

 

Yes that's why I use this question ?

I had some pretty deep lucid dream too, and I'm pretty sure this dream is the same as all the other one, so it's not so different to become lucid in it  hence the question !

The only major difference is that this dreams feels way longer therefore more real, but It's probably just because we're asleep in it ?

 

@cetus56

I may have gone overboard a little bit ?

Edited October 2, 2018 by Shin

[Evelyn]

@Shin  Dream world and "real" world are quite similar. I had some lucid dreams in which I questined the nature of reality. I was doing tests like eating, touching, smelling, etc. and they all seemed so real, even though it was all in my head. Hence the conclusion, even this "reality" might be just in my head. Also when you become aware in a dream, you have to maintain it, just like in reality. When you wake up in the dream, everything is more beautiful, and you look more at details, just like in reality... In my opinion, that feeling you have when you become aware in a dream is similar to the feeling you have when you become aware in real life. Also, I noticed the more aware I become, the more lucid dreams I have, even without trying to have them.

Edited October 2, 2018 by Evelyn