The egg experiment

[here-now]

@Emanyalpsid

I am now holding an egg.

Here's my direct experience:

All I know of the egg is 1) the experience of seeing (which is an experience of the mind, not matter), 2) the experience of touching (also an experience of mind, not matter), 3) the experience of hearing... if I thump it (more mind, not matter), 4) the experience of taste... if I lick it (...mind), and 5) the experience of smell (...mind).

What are seeing, touching, hearing, tasting, and smelling made of?... All that's there is the knowing of sensory experience... There is only knowledge (or consciousness).

No one has ever or will ever experience anything outside of consciousness. Consciousness can't experience anything other than consciousness... because consciousness is all there is. 

Here's a Rupert Spira video on exploring "matter":

 

Edited September 25, 2018 by here-now

[SageModeAustin]

@Emanyalpsid I don't get this. 

What do you mean does the egg exist on itself?

Is the egg there to be perceived? 

 

Edited September 25, 2018 by SageModeAustin

[Emanyalpsid]

22 minutes ago, here-now said:

@Emanyalpsid

I am now holding an egg.

Here's my direct experience:

All I know of the egg is 1) the experience of seeing (which is an experience of the mind, not matter), 2) the experience of touching (also an experience of mind, not matter), 3) the experience of hearing... if I thump it (more mind, not matter), 4) the experience of taste... if I lick it (...mind), and 5) the experience of smell (...mind).

What are seeing, touching, hearing, tasting, and smelling made of?... All that's there is the knowing of sensory experience... There is only knowledge (or consciousness).

No one has ever or will ever experience anything outside of consciousness. Consciousness can't experience anything other than consciousness... because consciousness is all there is. 

Here's a Rupert Spira video on exploring "matter":

Now we are getting somewhere! Do you feel the egg in your mind or do you feel the egg in your hand? Do you taste the egg on your tongue or in your mind? Do you smell the egg in your nose or in your mind? Where is the feeling? 

Is the egg only made out of matter? I am not referring to a soul here. What happens if you relax your fingers when you're holding the egg?

Is knowledge the same as consciousness/ experience? Or is knowledge derived from consciousness/ experience?

 

6 hours ago, Scholar said:

 

 

Edited September 25, 2018 by Emanyalpsid

[here-now]

@Emanyalpsid I feel the "egg" with my "hand" (through my sense of touch)... but "egg" and the feeling "hand" are appearances in consciousness, made out of consciousness.

If I relax my fingers, the egg falls on the carpet. Relaxed fingers, the egg, the falling of the egg, the carpet... everything appears in consciousness.

Knowledge = Consiousness

Infinite consciousness looks through the finite mind and a seeming world made of matter/separate objects appears.

[Emanyalpsid]

16 minutes ago, here-now said:

@Emanyalpsid I feel the "egg" with my "hand" (through my sense of touch)... but "egg" and the feeling "hand" are appearances in consciousness, made out of consciousness.

Okay, but the feeling is in the senses right? Which are appearances in consciousness, made out of consciousness. Are the sensing organs also made out of matter? Again as appearances in consciousness, made out of consciousness.

Quote

If I relax my fingers, the egg falls on the carpet. Relaxed fingers, the egg, the falling of the egg, the carpet... everything appears in consciousness.

How does it happen that the egg falls? What makes the egg fall?

Quote

Knowledge = Consiousness

Infinite consciousness looks through the finite mind and a seeming world made of matter/separate objects appears.

Yeah so we are aware of experiences.

Edited September 25, 2018 by Emanyalpsid

[Nahm]

This could have been called The Eggsperiment.

It’s too late for that now though. 

?

Edit: @Consept Doh! My bad. 

[here-now]

@Emanyalpsid

11 minutes ago, Emanyalpsid said:

Okay, but the feeling is in the senses right? Which are appearances in consciousness, made out of consciousness. Are the sensing organs also made out of matter? Again as appearances in consciousness, made out of consciousness.

How does it happen that the egg falls? What makes the egg fall?

Yeah so we are aware of experiences.

 

Yes, feeling arises from the sense of touch... and all I know of touch is the knowing of it.

And all I can know of the sense organs is the knowing of them.

The falling of the egg is a movement of finite mind... which is an appearance in consciousness. 

(lol... This is getting tricky to put into words!)

 

[Emanyalpsid]

19 minutes ago, here-now said:

@Emanyalpsid

Yes, feeling arises from the sense of touch... and all I know of touch is the knowing of it.

And all I can know of the sense organs is the knowing of them.

For us to go forward I would like to ask you to only give answers, as specific as possible, to my questions. Not add anything to it. Else we will continuously drift off. I am thankful for you to go through this experiment as I can assume that is not easy. You will get something out of it in the end though.

The feeling of the egg is in your hand right? As an appearance of consciousness, made out of consciousness.

The skin through which you are able to feel is also made out of matter, just as the egg is made of matter, right? Again, also as an appearance of consciousness, made out of consciousness.

Quote

The falling of the egg is a movement of finite mind... which is an appearance in consciousness. 

The egg falls to the carpet right? How does it happen that it falls to that, what attracts the egg? Again, also an appearance of consciousness, made out of consciousness.

Quote

(lol... This is getting tricky to put into words!)

 

 

Edited September 26, 2018 by Emanyalpsid

[here-now]

Yes... all of those "things" appear in consciousness and are made out of consciousness.

The apparent egg appears to fall to an apparent carpet by an apparent force labelled as gravity.

[Emanyalpsid]

6 minutes ago, here-now said:

Yes... all of those "things" appear in consciousness and are made out of consciousness.

The apparent egg appears to fall to an apparent carpet by an apparent force labelled as gravity.

Ah there we have it! Gravity! 

Would the egg, which you hold in your hand, be there to see, feel, taste, hear, smell if there was no gravity?

Would your sense organs and your body be there, if there was no gravity?

*All appearances in consciousness, made out of consciousness of course.

Edited September 26, 2018 by Emanyalpsid

[here-now]

This is getting interesting 

I don't know what would and wouldn't appear to be if apparent gravity ceased to appear. I can use my imagination but that would just be conjecture.

All I know (can know) is that consciousness is. 

[Emanyalpsid]

Well as there apparently is gravity, this means that the egg and your sense organs and your body not only consist out of matter but also out of gravity.

*Of course in consciousness.

Now back to the question which is it was all about; does the egg exist upon itself? And why?

[here-now]

Yes... all appearances in consciousness.

What do you mean by "exist upon itself"? (Sorry if you've already explained this... can you explain again or copy and paste a previous explanation?)

 

[Emanyalpsid]

Okay let me try to rephrase that;

Does the appearance of the egg, in your hand, in your consciousness depend on other appearances or does it exist on itself?

Let me give a hint; does it need the appearances of matter and gravity?

[here-now]

Oh ok, thanks for rephrasing. 

The egg appears as a separate thing that appears to come from another apparently separate thing (a chicken).... that seemingly needs "gravity" to appear.

*every "thing" appearing in consciousness, of course

Edited September 26, 2018 by here-now

[Emanyalpsid]

38 minutes ago, here-now said:

Oh ok, thanks for rephrasing. 

The egg appears as a separate thing that appears to come from another apparently separate thing (a chicken).... that seemingly needs "gravity" to appear.

 

Indeed it is of dependent origin.

Congratulations you have completed the experiment! Thank you! I will now provide you with the full implications of this dependent origin.

If the egg would only consist out of matter, or consciousness, or absolute infinity, it would exist upon itself. Because then it is not dependent upon something else to be perceived. If it (consciousness) exists upon itself (appearances), you can perceive or give meaning to it (consciousness) through itself (appearances).

But the egg (it) is dependent on appearances of matter and gravity to be perceived. With experiencing the appearance of matter you are also experiencing the appearance of gravity. So it's existence is of dependent origin.

As your consciousness of the egg is also dependent upon appearances of matter and gravity, as you need hands and eyes, etc. to perceive the egg, and you need a certain distance from the egg to see it, there is nothing actually being perceived. For what is being perceived, is being perceived through it. It came mutually dependent into existence.

Therefore it (consciousness) doesn't need to experience itself (appearances, universe, reality), as it (consciousness) knows that itself (appearances) came into existence through it (consciousness).

Your ego (self and itself) is completely dissolved.

Nirvana

Edited September 26, 2018 by Emanyalpsid

[here-now]

But is consciousness really dependent on the appearances arising in it ("matter" and "gravity")? 

Hands and eyes, etc are appearances in consciousness too.

To perceive an apparent egg, there needs to be an apparent body/mind perceiving it, yes. But both perceiver and perceived are appearances in consciousness... depend on consciousness for their apparent "existence"... which is ultimately illusory. 

[SgtPepper]

16 hours ago, Emanyalpsid said:

@Barry J I can't be the egg, read the experiment again. But I see I'm talking to a believer here.

You are the egg, because the egg is in your consciousness experience.

you feeling the egg is the same as feeling your hand. It's all sensations, content within one consciousness.

 

[here-now]

@Emanyalpsid Maybe I'm mis-reading you though when you say, "Your consciousness of the egg is dependent... etc"? Maybe you mean "Your perception of the egg is dependent... etc"?

(Sorry for any confusion/misunderstanding)

I agree with this:  "Therefore it (consciousness) doesn't need to experience itself (appearances, universe, reality), as it (consciousness) knows that itself (appearances) came into existence through it (consciousness)."

[abrakamowse]