Meditation can get you in trouble #2

[Ingit]

What what??? i saw someone write .. meditation can lead to psychosis... I don’t agree... only of Already the subject had episodes of Psychosis....! 

Edited September 23, 2018 by Ingit

[Psyche_92]

25 minutes ago, Gabriel Antonio said:

“Incorrect meditation can get you into trouble.” 

Explain.

[egoless]

@Mikael89 Yes once you are awaken to the Truth that this is the fallen world you notice how big is the deception and influence of evil here. However, you should not be afraid. Jesus has defeated evil on the cross and you can too if you are a follower of Christ. All the devil’s deceptions become useless against you when you are with Jesus. Find healthy christian community, pray to god daily, repent ask the Holy spirit for guidance. And the God will transform you. Your life will be transformed. You will be surprised how much more powerful the God is compared to this worldly delusions. Ask Jesus to strengthen your belief. Pray with your full heart and attention.

[i am I AM]

@egoless You say Jesus fixes challenges in your life. Why?

[egoless]

5 hours ago, i am I AM said:

@egoless You say Jesus fixes challenges in your life. Why?

Jesus does not “fix” challanges. Through only Jesus I can be purified. He died on the cross to save me, you and all of humanity. He transforms me in an unbelievable way. I was able to quit most of my bad habits since I have been touched by him. Moreover, he completely ended my nonduality and meditation addiction. But back then I was not aware that those could be addictive...

Edited September 23, 2018 by egoless

[i am I AM]

@egoless I'm sorry to hear that (about addiction). So, what part do you play in this process? Besides getting saved, repenting, e.g., the one-time or ritualistic temporal activities? 

I may or may not know what I'm talking about, but I want you to know I 100% support you, even though I'm being silly! Plus, I haven't been in church in...a little while.

[Gabriel Antonio]

On 9/23/2018 at 11:08 AM, Psyche_92 said:

Explain.

Meditation is a simple thing. And because it's so simple, people tend to mess it up.  

I myself used to feel weird shit from my so-called meditation practice. And after I saw the video Dark Side of Meditation, I thought, "Oh... so what I'm going through is normal..." But now, I see that it was not. I was practicing incorrectly. 

[SoonHei]

2 minutes ago, Gabriel Antonio said:

But now, I see that it was not. I was practicing incorrectly. 

explain ? how so?

 

so dark side of meditation will result if it is being done "incorrectly" only?

otherwise it wont happen?

 

i know it's not a 100% that it will. but you seem to indicate that it can be avoided and is not random... 

do share.@Gabriel Antonio

[SgtPepper]

On 9/22/2018 at 4:27 AM, egoless said:

@okulele You must realize that meditation is nothing more than self hypnosis. You are emptying your rational mind allowing your subconscious to be conditioned and programmed by whatever is influencing you in that moment. Usually here people self hypnotize themselves into nonduality ilussion. 

explain?. Meditation is just self-reflection. 

Edited September 24, 2018 by SgtPepper

[Psyche_92]

54 minutes ago, Gabriel Antonio said:

I was practicing incorrectly. 

Explain.

[SgtPepper]

On 9/22/2018 at 11:46 AM, egoless said:

 

@okulele watch this video to get an answer. Then do your own thorough research. 

 

what is this nonsense?

I have a minor in Neuroscience and this guy's grasp of Neuroscience is straight up laughable. He simplifies all experiences to be the work of dopamine and tries to reduce the complexity of meditation and mystical experiences with terms such as alpha and beta waves. Are we not gonna consider that neuroscience is still in primitive times  and that the brain is a lot more complex than dopamine and alpha waves? Plus where is his citations about these studies he is so called talking about? Didn't even mention the title of a paper, the journal, nor the scientist. If you're gonna talk scientifically at least back it up with scientific data.

I also think his grasp of meditation is wack. Meditation isn't about getting into a sleepy trance... That's an indication that your meditation process is WEAK. you should be alert, awake, and aware when you are meditating, otherwise you are pretty much wasting your time, doesn't matter how long you meditate.

The whole point of emptying your mind is to get all of the distraction of ego out of the way, so you can tune in to reality in a purer way. 

[Torkys]

1 hour ago, SgtPepper said:

The whole point of emptying your mind is to get all of the distraction of ego out of the way, so you can tune in to reality in a purer way. 

To respond to you from @egoless's perspective before he does - I have talked alot to him in DMs and I have researched the Christian perspective on "the New Age" alot:

The devil wants you to clear your mind so he can enter easily (if you ever look up true Christian meditation, it is filling your mind with the word of God, not emptying it. Your rational mind is a gift from God and you mustn't throw it away. 

[abrakamowse]

On 9/22/2018 at 11:46 AM, egoless said:

Remember the first lie of Satan? That you too can become “Gods”... Seems like this deception is also inherent in nondual teachings.

I don't agree with that. Jesus also said that "We are Gods". There's an explanation from mainstream Christians (I consider myself a Christian but I don't feel identified with any church or religion, I am only a Christ follower). 

In my interpretation, what we are now is what the devil made us to be, or made us believe that we are.  We are now believing that we are Gods, because we think that we are the ones who think, we don't owe anything to any God, there's no God, we are independent, we can do whatever we want, and if things don't go our way we can change nature and so on... what we are now is the reason why the Devil was thrown away from the Garden of Eden.

When we realized that We are not that "ego-god" created by the devil, and that our true nature is as Jesus said God, that's when we become one with God as Jesus Christ. 

As Jesus said in John 14:20 "On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you."

We are all one thing.

 

[SgtPepper]

41 minutes ago, Torkys said:

To respond to you from @egoless's perspective before he does - I have talked alot to him in DMs and I have researched the Christian perspective on "the New Age" alot:

The devil wants you to clear your mind so he can enter easily (if you ever look up true Christian meditation, it is filling your mind with the word of God, not emptying it. Your rational mind is a gift from God and you mustn't throw it away. 

Thank you for the reply that is informative!

Not directed at you, but I can add that I have seen this line of reasoning used by other Christians when it comes to use of psychedelics. they would claim that psychedelics leaves one open to attacks by the devil or evil spirits.

I appreciate you answering and this is not necessarily directed at you.

This line of reasoning only leaves me with more questions such as:

1. How does one explain individuals such as Sadhguru who have spent their whole lives "emptying their minds" (I prefer the phrase 'staying present') and yet they do not appear to perform explicitly evil acts. We would have to define what are evil acts as well... 

2. Isn't this what happened to Jesus in the desert? Isn't facing the devil and then denying his temptation going to bring you closer to God. 

3. There is still the mystery of what Jesus did before he took on the role of messiah. Christians claim he was carpenter with no evidence.

4. How is devil's doing not God's doing considering that God is the creator of everything, knows everything, and IS everything?

Edited September 24, 2018 by SgtPepper

[Torkys]

I will be still answering from a Christian perspective. @egoless has opened my mind to a degree where I will be sure to repent when I will be brave and open-minded enough but I am still pretty much a "new ager" and a non-dualist now.

33 minutes ago, SgtPepper said:

1. How does one explain individuals such as Sadhguru who have spent their whole lives "emptying their minds" (I prefer the phrase 'staying present') and yet they do not appear to perform explicitly evil acts. We would have to define what are evil acts as well... 

These masters are spreading an ideology which was clearly created by Satan to control people (people with no selves are easily manipulated, moral nihilism pushes you to sin, equating yourself with God is the first lie told to humanity) thus they are evil.

34 minutes ago, SgtPepper said:

2. Isn't this what happened to Jesus in the desert? Isn't facing the devil and then denying his temptation going to bring you closer to God. 

Notice that you used the term "denying his temptation". The true Christian resists sin and does not indulge in it.

"Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you." - James 4:7

37 minutes ago, SgtPepper said:

3. There is still the mystery of what Jesus did before he took on the role of messiah. Christians claim he was carpenter with no evidence.

I will leave that up to @egoless to answer. I am curious what does he think of the theory that Jesus was a Buddhist monk.

38 minutes ago, SgtPepper said:

4. How is devil's doing not God's doing considering that God is the creator of everything, knows everything, and IS everything?

There are multiple theories of what happened in the Garden.

God gave angels free will because he knew that service and love not coming from free will is not genuine. Of course, with free will came the possibility of pushing God away - and that's what the devil did.
 

[Strikr]

On 22/09/2018 at 10:27 AM, egoless said:

@okulele You must realize that meditation is nothing more than self hypnosis. You are emptying your rational mind allowing your subconscious to be conditioned and programmed by whatever is influencing you in that moment. Usually here people self hypnotize themselves into nonduality ilussion. 

someone have a good book about meditation and creating mantra for creativity ?

I m currently off from tabacco since 24 hours, and didn't take anything stimulant since 2 days

Really need to empty my mind, and "wash" all my "hate" against "ignorant". My ego stab me very hard ( probably because quitting tobaco/weed ) ( I've reduced since 2 weeks, but that's still harsh )

 

if someone have a book, or advice, can I meditate with psytrance on a couch ? or do I need to be sit and in silence ?

this is psytrance : https://soundcloud.com/max-tavener/blue-moon-full

probably been created for this "purpose"

 

[abrakamowse]

12 minutes ago, Torkys said:

These masters are spreading an ideology which was clearly created by Satan to control people (people with no selves are easily manipulated, moral nihilism pushes you to sin, equating yourself with God is the first lie told to humanity) thus they are evil.

It's not people with no selves. It's people with no "False Selves". They have a Self and that Self is only one, that's God.

Evil create the false selves and is the one that makes us think we are "like God". The Devil said that we were going to be "like God".

Jesus said, "we are Gods". Quoting the Psalm.

Edited September 24, 2018 by abrakamowse

[Torkys]

I personally do agree with your interpretation though. 

[Gabriel Antonio]

7 hours ago, SoonHei said:

explain ? how so?

@Psyche_92

I was practicing the do nothing technique. But I wasn't aware as thoughts were passing by. So my meditation was actually just daydreaming. And I was hoping that something magical would occur just by doing that.

Today, my practice is very short. I focus on the course of my natural breath for 1-2 minutes, without getting into any special position.

In fact, that was another problem of my meditation. I was heavily tensed in my body, and sitting upright without support for my back became uncomfortable. So at some point, it became an ego-thing of trying to put up with the physical discomfort. 

[SgtPepper]

I am with @abrakamowse on this. That is pretty much how I interpret Devil's wrongdoing. 

I should also mention @Torkys that last year I also seriously considered the idea of becoming a Christian or Muslim and following scriptures. I own a copy of the international version of the Bible and an English translation of the Quran. Admittedly, I did not read all of it, but I read pieces and I still plan on reading them in the future. I was also listening to lectures as well from well known religious individuals such as: 

Nouman Ali Khan

 

And Joel Osteen (who honestly I still really like, despite the controversy):

 

But I ended up not following through due to the intolerance of my method of spirituality which involves psychedelics. I also found religious people to be close-minded to whatever was not already claimed by their scripture. Did not feel right, but I implore you to explore and respect you for being open-minded.

During the process I also found Stevens videos and found his testimony interesting.