Sadhguru says we have free will...

[Nahm]

@How to be wise

Great question! What did I say there? Did you understand it, first?

[Rilles]

Where exactly do you have free will? Check throughout your body. 

 

Inner organs? Not ruled by you

Thoughts? Not ruled by you

Growth and decay of body? Not ruled by you

Breathing, heart rate, BP? Not ruled by you

Volition? A tricky one... ruled by emotion and thought... which in turned are not ruled by you...

 

Where exactly do we have free will? Unsure...

A worthwhile contemplation. 

[lmfao]

@xbcc

Everything is me.

I do not exist at all. 

--------------------------------

I completely have free will.

I have no free will whatsoever. 

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The statement within each of these pairs of statements is pointing towards the same experience/truth as the second statement in that pair. 

Edited September 22, 2018 by lmfao

[Joseph Maynor]

17 hours ago, How to be wise said:

@xbcc when sadhguru says you have free will, he is meeting the audience that he’s speaking to from where they are. The audience, who are probably not enlightened, clearly believe that they have free will. So sadhguru is talking to them in their terms, and not in his own experience. It’s called ‘relative truth’. It’s the truth of the un enlightened person. 

This is one of the things that I don’t like about Enlightenment teachers, and I think it confuses people — this whole idea that Enlightenment can be explained in Egoic terms.  This is why making money off Enlightenment causes a lot of problems.

[Faceless]

FREEDOM for sale, it’s so absurd..

We are all together in this ..It’s a too, and from, relationship that must take place.

We both meet one another mutually on the same level...as two or more people looking to understand/observe what is actually taking place. 

All of this psychological freedom-spirituality for sale is an abomination. An indication that one doesn’t actually understand that they are all alone. 

 

Edited September 22, 2018 by Faceless

[How to be wise]

@Joseph Maynor unfortunately there are too many un enlightened people around. We need to speak their language. But the point is, most enlightened people who speak in ‘egoic language’ will not believe in the words they’re speaking, so they will be detached from it on the inside, but will still speak it so as to communicate with other people.

[Faceless]

@How to be wise Joseph is referring to responsibility. 

We can rationalize all we want, but the fact remains, catering to the illusion even with “good intent” still caters to that illusion. 

This is understandable no?

Edited September 22, 2018 by Faceless

[How to be wise]

@Faceless we meet people where they are. Not because it’s not an illusion, but because of love. You love the people, so you speak to them in their terms. But inside, there’s nothing that anyone can do to make you believe in it.

[Faceless]

Nothing wrong with gathering around and discussing the conditioned consciousness as it is, but to hold a piece of cheese ? out in front of a confused face with an unconscious mind, while making a dollar doing so, only contributes to the problem of that conditioned consciousness. 

I mean it is obvious that this dependence on authority actually nourishes fear, confusion, conflict, within this conditioned consciousness. 

Edited September 22, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

4 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

@Faceless we meet people where they are. Not because it’s not an illusion, but because of love. You love the people, so you speak to them in their terms. But inside, there’s nothing that anyone can do to make you believe in it.

Ok

This compulsion to believe or not to believe...that’s what should be discussed. 

Edited September 22, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

I’m not referring to sadhhuru specifically. I’m speaking generally

[Joseph Maynor]

26 minutes ago, Faceless said:

@How to be wise Joseph is referring to responsibility. 

We can rationalize all we want, but the fact remains, catering to the illusion even with “good intent” still caters to that illusion. 

This is understandable no?

Correct.  

[Joseph Maynor]

35 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

@Joseph Maynor unfortunately there are too many un enlightened people around. We need to speak their language. But the point is, most enlightened people who speak in ‘egoic language’ will not believe in the words they’re speaking, so they will be detached from it on the inside, but will still speak it so as to communicate with other people.

I appreciate this comment too.  It's important that we have Enlightenment teachers that understand the full responsibility of being an Enlightenment teacher -- where it comes from a very pure, honest place.  This is because, at the end of the day, you should be helping others the same way you yourself needed help on the Path.  If you want to play the teaching game, that is. 

Edited September 22, 2018 by Joseph Maynor

[who chit]

The question of free will comes from the conditioned mind that does not know that what is essentially you is already free. The words "free will" come from a fundamental desire of a wanting to be free, or "the will to be free". The conditioned, desires "the will to be free", from the conditioning that has been imposed. The conditioned, are unaware of their already free and unconditioned nature,which can never be conditioned. If they come in touch with or realize their innate,unconditioned and already free "self",the question of "do I have free will", will be dropped.
The bondage of the conditioned mind,is what keeps them longing for freedom.

What is free, is boundlessly free.

Edited September 22, 2018 by who chit

[Faceless]

8 minutes ago, who chit said:

The bondage of the conditioned mind,is what keeps them longing for freedom.

Indeed..

The action taken in accordance to the notion that there is actually a division between the experiencer and that which it experiences.  

Seeking psychological security(seeking to make permanent that which is fundamentally impermanent), brings about psychological insecurity, and nourishes the illusion of i, and therefore perpetuates further enslavement. 

Thought sees the necessity of order, yet every action it takes nourishes disorder. 

 

Edited September 22, 2018 by Faceless

[How to be wise]

1 hour ago, Faceless said:

Nothing wrong with gathering around and discussing the conditioned consciousness as it is, but to hold a piece of cheese ? out in front of a confused face with an unconscious mind, while making a dollar doing so, only contributes to the problem of that conditioned consciousness. 

I mean it is obvious that this dependence on authority actually nourishes fear, confusion, conflict, within this conditioned consciousness. 

They’ve been rather successful so far. If you can convince a person to engage in a spiritual practice then your chances of success will be even higher. How did you get to enlightenment? Wasn’t there a spiritual teacher who had to speak your egoic language to get you motivated to become enlightened?

1 hour ago, Faceless said:

Ok

This compulsion to believe or not to believe...that’s what should be discussed. 

An enlightened person has experienced the truth. Ofcourse you can’t make him believe in the egoic stuff again.

[Faceless]

39 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

An enlightened person has experienced the truth. Ofcourse you can’t make him believe in the egoic stuff again.

Is TRUTH FIXED? 

Is truth some”thing” to be experienced? 

Edited September 22, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

45 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

Wasn’t there a spiritual teacher who had to speak your egoic language to get you motivated to become enlightened?

No...I saw the futility in evading the fact of fear, as it became quite apparent that doing so nourishes that fear. This illusion that I will become secure in time was seen through. Then it was not feed any longer. 

I communed with suffering without escape. That simple. If I would have been the type to seek guidance from an authority I would perhaps still be caught in my own illusion. 

Needing motivation, guidance, to me contribute to that very suffering. 

Edited September 22, 2018 by Faceless

[Bobby]

@xbcc “will” is a concept. No concept isn’t Truth. 

[Finland3286]

On 9/21/2018 at 4:11 PM, How to be wise said:

@xbcc when sadhguru says you have free will, he is meeting the audience that he’s speaking to from where they are. The audience, who are probably not enlightened, clearly believe that they have free will. So sadhguru is talking to them in their terms, and not in his own experience. It’s called ‘relative truth’. It’s the truth of the un enlightened person. 

That would make sense because Leo did make a video telling us to take 100% responsibility for our lives before.