Addicted to Meditation?

[Wisebaxter]

Can this happen? And if so is it a bad thing? I started a meditation habit a month ago, 1hr a day and I'm loving it. It's even helped me kick a pot addiction. But now 1hr doesn't feel like enough and I keep wanting to get back into that place. Today I did 1hr 20mins and I feel like I could do more. I'm getting an urge to go and do it again even though I've done my hour today and it feels like an addiction as it's almost a craving. I just want to reside in that blissful state of no-self

[Nahm]

@Wisebaxter

Congrats! 

Great practicing. Consider attention on the other side of that coin. The particular thinking which resumes, “taking you out of” that bliss. See how it is that it is slipping through the cracks and resuming. Bliss is available anywhere, while doing anything. Focused stomach breathing, all day ? helps a lot. Try some other meditations if interested.

https://sites.google.com/site/psychospiritualtools/Home/meditation-practices

[PsiloPutty]

Man that's great! I can relate, I have been at it since December, and it has helped me so much. Have you done any strong determination sits? Leo has a video on it, as does Shinzen Young. If you want to test yourself, give that a try.

And I would say that as long as you are fulfilling your normal obligations in life, you can't meditate too much. It's advisable to not have meditation be your only spiritual practice, but there are worse things to do than to meditate for a couple hours a day. 

[Wisebaxter]

@Nahm Thank you  

To handle the 'thinking' side of the coin I've generally just been allowing it to happen and not identifying with it, which the meditation and the idea of 'letting go' has allowed me to do. I wouldn't say there's bliss involved there yet as with the meditation, but there's definitely more calmness. You raise a really goof point about paying attention to my experience of being when I'm 'off the pillow' as it were. Focused stomach breathing...interesting. I'll give that a go. Thanks for the link too, what a great list! So far I've been sticking with 'do nothing' meditation as I love the way it just allows you to flow with the moment and not resist it through any kind of doing. I know the focused meditation has some uses and I will get into that at some point, but at the moment it seems to involve effort, which I'm trying to move away from. Looking at that list...sky gazing meditation...hmm, sounds awesome. How many have you tried from the list?

@PsiloPutty Ah, its so nice to hear enthusiasm from others about my new habit. It's been such a major, life changing thing for me and you guys obviously know where I'm coming from. I wonder how long a strong determination sit would be. At least 3 hours do you think? I'll have to watch Leo's video again. I reckon I could handle two hours at the moment. Have you done any? I do remember Shinzen Young saying these sits are the fastest way to enlightenment. But what if you need the loo? lol. Do I wear a diaper? 

Yeah I'm doing a bit of contemplation and self enquiry too, although isn't the answer just 'there is no I?' I've had that given to me as a spoiler by various sources. I literally can't find myself and I've realised the self is an illusion so I'm wondering what is it about repeatedly acknowledging this that leads to enlightenment. Maybe I'll ask on another post.  

 

[Nahm]

@Wisebaxter Awesome. I tried quite a few, oddly, before seeing the list. Similar experiences with yoga. It is nice to have so many in one place. Google...? Go figure right?

[Wisebaxter]

@Outer Beast! Thanks man  This is what I was hoping to hear. I'll jump in head first then

Edited September 11, 2018 by Wisebaxter

[cetus]

1 hour ago, Wisebaxter said:

Looking at that list...sky gazing meditation...hmm, sounds awesome.

@Wisebaxter   Put it on your "must do" list. It's a communion.

[ajasatya]

@Wisebaxter what's an "addiction"?

my definition of addiction is attachment to a habit that weakens or destroys you.

so there are vices and virtues. they're just toxic and healthy habits, respectively.

there are tons of researches made about meditation. search for benefits and harms of meditation and then decide if its a virtue or a vice.

Edited September 11, 2018 by ajasatya

[dorg]

Meditation is what I am, being someone is the addiction.

[Faceless]

Even meditation can become a mechanical process of the self seeking security in thought. A movement of psychological becoming by “the illusory I”. 

Any time there is this attempt to evade the fact of psychological insecurity, implies that the entity as “the i” is stil deeply identified with thought and therefore is nourishing the false division between the meditator and the process of meditation. 

Can there be an attention of this movement to evade the fact of insecurity and chase the idea of security? 

And can we see that to indulge in this mechanical pattern actually feeds this action-reaction pattern of psychological time, and therefore the illusion of self?

 

Edited September 13, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

@Feel Good first off you have specificity said you want nothing to do with me before.

So why the contact?

Second, actually read what was written above. I never said don’t meditate, but simply sharing how the self seeks security in thought.

If ones sees the significance of this, meditation is effortless, a joy, and beautiful in and of itself.

Also, after seeing the whole of this psychological becoming in time, all other mechanical behavior ceases instantly in ones daily life. 

Edited September 13, 2018 by Faceless

[PsiloPutty]

On ‎9‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 3:47 PM, Wisebaxter said:

 

@PsiloPutty Ah, its so nice to hear enthusiasm from others about my new habit. It's been such a major, life changing thing for me and you guys obviously know where I'm coming from. I wonder how long a strong determination sit would be. At least 3 hours do you think? I'll have to watch Leo's video again. I reckon I could handle two hours at the moment. Have you done any? I do remember Shinzen Young saying these sits are the fastest way to enlightenment. But what if you need the loo? lol. Do I wear a diaper? 

 

 

The length of a strong determination sit is different for everyone. If a person sits without moving for 45 minutes and quits because they're going nutty, then that was their time for that session. Three hours isn't achievable right away, and even 2 hours will be incredibly difficult for your first time. I started at 45 minutes, then slowly over 6 months stretched it out to my current SD sits, which are around 2hrs 15mins. 

Hahaha, yeah it's a good idea to do your SD sits right away in the morning after peeing. 

[Faceless]

It’s important to understand we are not offering another way of meditation here, but to understand (bring attention/awareness too), the entity that meditates. 

This way meditation is not reduced to mechanical/habitual dependence. Therefore a conflict breeder, and therefore the opposite of why one meditates in the first place. 

Edited September 13, 2018 by Faceless

[PsiloPutty]

@Feel Good  Why can't you drop it? I mean that as a genuine question, and not a personal attack. It's extremely distracting from the general spirit and theme of the forum. 

[Faceless]

32 minutes ago, Feel Good said:

Do you want me to cut and paste the comments you made about Leo's advices as merely being "goal setting excersise" and that people here don't need cognitive development in he form of forum discussion / debate nor do they need to build self esteem?

What do you have to say in defences of those statements? They look like projections to me and gross misunderstanding of what personal development, enlightenment and actualize.org. 

What is your main purpose here? To play this krishnamurti character while trying to indoctrinate people into believing the krishnamurti dogma ? 

 

I stand behind everything I write here on the forum. If one reads very carefully with ‘actual attention’ to what I write, one will then understand that improving the practical-functional aspect of ones life is a necessity if they feel that way of course. Leo is great at this indeed.

But what I share has to do with self improvement psychologically. To understand the illusion of psychological growth, psychological progression. I have said many times to cultivate thought in practical/functional affairs is healthy if that is what one wants, but to cultivate thought in the attempt to bring about psychological order, well, I feel responsible in sharing the falseness of that with fellow me’s. 

You can cut and paste away... 

I’m a roast, baste me?

Edited September 13, 2018 by Faceless

[Nahm]

Every one of us is perfect and exactly how we should be. Divine perfection.

 

There is meditation for letting go of thoughts, improving concentration, finding peace in the breath. There are wonderful things we can explore & learn. Mind blowing experiences to be had. Bottomless love we can discover together, and within ourselves. 

But you, the real you, is none of those things, needs no thing, no one. The real you is infinitely perfect. Always has been, always will be. This is the greatest discovery. 

 

[Wisebaxter]

On 11/09/2018 at 11:20 PM, ajasatya said:

@Wisebaxter what's an "addiction"?

my definition of addiction is attachment to a habit that weakens or destroys you.

so there are vices and virtues. they're just toxic and healthy habits, respectively.

there are tons of researches made about meditation. search for benefits and harms of meditation and then decide if its a virtue or a vice.

Yes, this is a great point. My issue is of course making assumptions and not contemplating the words I'm using properly. I think my fear also came from having a craving for something as I've just quit a major drug addiction and any cravings worry me now. I get the fear that something is going to get control of me again, distract me and take over, you know? Obviously this is all fear based stuff I need to work on and perhaps differentiate between higher and low consciousness urges. 

 

On 11/09/2018 at 11:55 PM, dorg said:

Meditation is what I am, being someone is the addiction.

Sweet man, love that. That blew my mind and kicked my fear straight in the nuts 

 

On 13/09/2018 at 3:24 PM, Faceless said:

Even meditation can become a mechanical process of the self seeking security in thought. A movement of psychological becoming by “the illusory I”. 

Any time there is this attempt to evade the fact of psychological insecurity, implies that the entity as “the i” is stil deeply identified with thought and therefore is nourishing the false division between the meditator and the process of meditation. 

Can there be an attention of this movement to evade the fact of insecurity and chase the idea of security? 

And can we see that to indulge in this mechanical pattern actually feeds this action-reaction pattern of psychological time, and therefore the illusion of self?

 

This is some deep shit. I think I'm getting what you're saying - namely that the very act of separating the I from the process of meditation (non self) is an illusory boundary. You're saying that the urge to meditate could be an escape from the I, which is itself an illusion? I'm now thinking that all there is is awareness and consciousness and this is the case whether meditation is happening or not...otherwise, as you say, this separation could actually embolden the separate self even more. I'm going to contemplate these passage you posted, thanks 

 

On 13/09/2018 at 3:42 PM, Feel Good said:

This won't be the case if the meditator is having no self experiences. Would it?

If you're trying to persuade people to now give up their meditation habits like you are trying to persuade them to give up personal development and discussion on forum, you're wasting your time. Leo's influence here is a lot stronger than yours. Better find something better to do with your time 

Hmm, this isn't quite what I got from what faceless posted, but then again I'm rocking my own relative domain  To me it seemed like he was providing a warning against separating the illusory self from the process of meditation by potentially having it as an escape from that

 

On 13/09/2018 at 4:24 PM, Feel Good said:

Do you want me to cut and paste the comments you made about Leo's advices as merely being "goal setting excersise" and that people here don't need cognitive development in he form of forum discussion / debate nor do they need to build self esteem?

What do you have to say in defences of those statements? They look like projections to me and gross misunderstanding of what personal development, enlightenment and actualize.org. 

What is your main purpose here? To play this krishnamurti character while trying to indoctrinate people into believing the krishnamurti dogma ? 

 

Ahh I sense some pain occurring in you here dude. Could it be that you've developed a set of assumptions about faceless and they're charging your perception of what he's saying? Remember that there is no Faceless really and that he's you after all, so I think it would be cool if you could accept him as he is and love him unconditionally as you love yourself. If you don't agree with him that's something else, but I sense you may have created an ideology out of disagreeing with him and now you're judging him based on that. This is one of the worst things we can do to someone, pigeonhole them into an identity and not allow them to just be. But of course, I'm making assumptions here too so I would hate to be a hypocrite and judge you as I don't know all the facts (if indeed that's possible). Maybe some of my words will mean something positive to you, I hope so. Maybe not. It might be worth watching Leo's episode on Moralising as the more conscious you are the less you'll take offence. I still get offended myself so I'm not saying I'm perfect. We all have triggers. Have a look into why Faceless triggers you and work on that as I would imagine there's some fear there somewhere or an aspect of your survival that's being threatened. I think examining it would really benefit you.  Much love to you brother 

Edited September 14, 2018 by Wisebaxter

[Wisebaxter]

22 hours ago, Nahm said:

Every one of us is perfect and exactly how we should be. Divine perfection.

 

There is meditation for letting go of thoughts, improving concentration, finding peace in the breath. There are wonderful things we can explore & learn. Mind blowing experiences to be had. Bottomless love we can discover together, and within ourselves. 

But you, the real you, is none of those things, needs no thing, no one. The real you is infinitely perfect. Always has been, always will be. This is the greatest discovery. 

 

Beautiful words, love it. Your ego has obviously been sidelined quite effectively as I can sense the universe speaking through you 

 

Edited September 14, 2018 by Wisebaxter

[Nahm]

@Wisebaxter Thanks, it’s all you man. ❤️

[Wisebaxter]

On 11/09/2018 at 11:12 PM, cetus56 said:

@Wisebaxter   Put it on your "must do" list. It's a communion.

Oh I certainly will, thanks. I'll let you know how it goes