Devil's Advocate: You Should Care About What People Think

[emind]

So I remember a few months ago, Leo put out a video about actually learning things vs merely theorizing about them (I cant recall the video's title). Anyways, in it, I remember him saying something along the lines of "Yeah yeah, everyone says that they dont care about what others think, but they dont really live like it, because they dont really understand why they shouldnt care, they havent contemplated it properly and given it its due dilligence." 

 

Well, first of all, guilty as charged. As a people pleaser myself, I can tell I fall prey to this kind of behavior (and hypocrisy really) all the time. Despite the fact that I say  shouldnt care, I dont act as if I dont care. And after giving it some thought, I think I know why.

 

This is the statement Im going to make: Unless one is going to go massively hardcore on spirituality and retire entirely from the physical world, one has every reason to care about what others think. 

If you want to live a balanced life, and by that I mean having relationships, making money, having a career youre passionate about, and other things of the like that are typically considered outside the scope of true spirituality (as in meditation, self inquiry, Yoga, etc), then you will have to care about what others think.

So, my ability to have a satisfactory dating life hinges strongly on what members of the opposite sex think of me. My ability to build a successful business, relies heavily on what my clients and business partners will think, my ability to cultivate friendships will require me to be aware of what my friends think of me, and so on...

So, I dont understand, I really dont, when people say "you shouldnt care what people think", I honestly just dont get it. I mean, I know it is the source of much suffering and neurosis, and that it might even have a net negative effect... but how can we live without doing it?

Edited September 11, 2018 by emind

[ajasatya]

5 minutes ago, emind said:

So, my ability to have a satisfactory dating life hinges strongly on what members of the opposite sex think of me. My ability to build a successful business, relies heavily on what my clients and business partners will think, my ability to cultivate friendships will require me to be aware of what my friends think of me, and so on...

sorry to say, but that's a very poor way to live imo.

it is possible to live in appreciation and to be appreciated without any kind of struggle to make up for external approval. this is true freedom... it's liberating! the hard part is that you may have to go through a purification process in which you'll teach yourself to let Love flow through you. you may become a highly magnetic person and even looking through your eyes will be a thrilling experience. that's just a glimpse of how far spiritual purification can take you.

if you depend on external validation for everything you do in life, when will you be authentic? when will you get to know yourself and not a fake entity made up for others' tastes?

[emind]

@ajasatya I completely agree that it is a poor way to live. But, I just dont quite understand how exactly it is possible to live otherwise?

[Gabriel Antonio]

@ajasatya ?

 

19 minutes ago, emind said:

So, I dont understand, I really dont, when people say "you shouldnt care what people think", I honestly just dont get it. I mean, I know it is the source of much suffering and neurosis, and that it might even have a net negative effect... but how can we live without doing it?

Have you seen Leo’s video on this topic? It’s one of my personal favorites. He gives the answer to your question in that video.

 

Btw - this topic is in the wrong section. You should have posted in “Self-Actualization” @Key Elements

 

Edited September 11, 2018 by Gabriel Antonio

[ajasatya]

2 minutes ago, emind said:

I just dont quite understand how exactly it is possible to live otherwise?

ok, i'll talk about my own experience and give you an example.

god, i love statistics, probabilities, calculus, linear algebra, computer science and all of that. i found out about data science and i started to study it really really hard. then i got to know machine learning, deep learning, artificial intelligence. i was (and still am) amazed so i started a blog and created an account on kaggle. i've created tons of public material just because i enjoy it so much.

then i sent my cv to a company that works with data science. they loved it and were like "get this guy quickly!". i work with what i love and the quality of my work is so high that they respect me a lot. i never did anything to please them. everything i do is because i truly enjoy it.

[Key Elements]

@emind You still have to care about what others think even if you live in a monestary because you still live with others and under monastic rules. You can't just meditate whenever you feel like it. They have a strict schedule.

Even if you live with nature all by yourself, you're under nature's survival rules. 

[here-now]

43 minutes ago, emind said:

So, I dont understand, I really dont, when people say "you shouldnt care what people think", I honestly just dont get it.

I think when people say "you shouldn't care what people think" they really mean to say "you shouldn't mind what people think."

I mean, it's good to "care" what people think... if "caring" = respecting and valuing the other person's perspective and being willing to look at things from their POV... even if it's completely different from and/or clashes with yours. 

But, it's not healthy to "mind" what other people think ... if "minding" =  worrying and obsessing that the other person's perspective will clash with yours and so you try to alter your perspective just so it can mesh with theirs in order to please them... or you withhold your perspective altogether, and just go along with theirs in order to avoid any potential awkwardness or confrontation.... 

[Forestluv]

@emind You have created a story about how life is and it has become your reality.

There are many other perspectives.

Your story is oriented toward the individual. I imagine you have a strong sense of self that is separate from what you perceive as others. Another perspective is you share a higher consciousness with others. Ideas about what "they" think and what "you" think start to dissolve. 

Have you ever seen something so beautiful that you were awe-struck? You lost the sense of yourself and became the experience of appreciating beauty. Have you ever had a moment of such deep love that you lost sense of yourself and there was only the experience of love? 

That's the type of "woo-woo" stuff that is available to you. IME, mystical experiences blow away any form of intellectual, scientific or material gain. It aint even close.

[Capital]

Ironically people give you more respect and appreciation when they see you dominate your life without thinking about them and with a swag of carefreeness  haha + it's less neurotic to live that way  , so If you really think about what people think of you , you should care about them seeing you less neurotic ! lol ! 

[Mezanti]

@emind I feel the exact same way you do, and the replies to this post don't do much to dismiss the way i think about this subject.

Edited September 16, 2018 by Mezanti

[Nahm]

@emind

The sensation feels bad, but you are continuing anyways. Be sensitive, listen to the sensation, reveal the falsity. 

Have you ever experienced what anyone else is thinking?

Have you directly experienced that anyone else is thinking?

You’ve been carrying the weight of your over thinking, and the weight of your over thinking about what other people are thinking. 

All of that, is thinking. 

Over thinking = seriousness.

Did you grow up with anger around?

Unknowingly developed hyperawareness of every subtle nuance, as to make living with an angry person more predictable? In the sense, your existence became largely catering to the whim of their mood? Now, perhaps, that “skill” is running rampant, feeding itself with far too many nuances, resulting in a sense you’re living life in “fast forward”, and it’s hard to get back to “play”?
 

[Mezanti]

@Serotoninluv so your saying the way to stop caring about what people think of me i have to remove me out of the equation?

Listen man, I wanna be some sort of a CEO, someone who has the balls and carelessness about what others think of him to go out there and fuck the world, i dont wanna become a fucking monk or guru.

I just want to know How to not give a shit about what others think, im sure theres a way to do just that without having to achieve nonduality.

 

[Hansu]

Natural born none-fuck-givers are really effective at pushing people away from themselves

Im speaking of experience. My self-improvement journey literally began from this realization

"Im a fucking asshole! I need to give a fuck!"

Today, im re-learning how to give less fucks, but starting to give a fuck was absolutely essential for my growth in the early days somewhat 7-8 years ago.

[Mezanti]

@Hansu fuck fuck fuck

[Consept]

@emind Heres the problem with caring what other people think, it means youll be a slave to whatever the dominant mindset is in your society and this more than likely, will contradict what your true self wants. 

For example you might grow up in a society where meditation is seen as wrong or a waste of time, to the point where youre ridiculed if you do it. If you care about what people think youll miss out on something that can change your life for the better. It would also mean humans  would stagnant as everyone would be afraid of pushing boundaries. So on a micro and macro level there has to be people not caring about what others think.

In terms of how to do it, thats something you need to work out yourself. Is it a fear of being kicked out of the 'tribe' ? If thats the case like any fear you need to challenge that. But you cant just accept, 'oh im a people pleaser so thats how it is', Thats like someone afraid to drive saying 'oh im just not someone who drives', well obviously until you face that fear you wont be that person. 

[LaraGreenbridge]

@emind,

you probably can't live in the world without caring what other people think, unless you want to live as a hermit in a cave somewhere! ( not that there is anything wrong with living as a hermit in a cave...)

Look, there are people and there are people.

Some people will be extremely important to you in your life, and you are going to care very much what they think of you. If you didn't care about them and their opinions, you would be a sociopath!  You would end up alone, in the end, but if you were a sociopath, then I guess you wouldn't mind being alone...so no real problem there!

But the vast majority of people will not be all that important to you... and furthermore, you will have no idea what they think of you, unless they tell you. Which usually doesn't happen. People don't like to speak up, because they generally think it's rude to do so. 

I guess you could go around asking people what they think of you- but you could never be sure they would tell the truth, so it's probably a waste of time.

If you want to have stable, loving relationships with genuine, caring and intelligent people in your life, then yes, you should be aware of their thoughts and feelings and take those into consideration.

Sometimes you will have to go against the grain.... But your intuition will tell you when.

[Hansu]

@LaraGreenbridge

Exactly this. I think "stop caring about what other people think" is a bastard version of attaining high social awareness and then pushing aside the bullshit that people feed you, while taking in and nurturing their genuine feelings and wants. The bastard version wouldn't make much justice to the latter idea
 

Going through life without attaining or caring about social awareness would be stupid unless you were that said hermit.

 

[LaraGreenbridge]

@Hansu ,

yes, exactly. "Stop caring about what people think" is not a helpful statement in itself. Human beings are social creatures and we have built a very complex society by being able to co-operate with each other.

If everyone was totally individualistic, society would not operate. Caring is sharing.  

[Brittany]

Immerse yourself into the dream of other people. Have intimacy with them. Cry with them. Laugh with them. Get mad with them.

But remember to set your alarm clock.