I Can't Comprehend Non-Duality

[Saumaya]

Just now, Joseph Maynor said:

You know you're Enlightened when all gurus literally die.

Gurus and every kind of authority

[Faceless]

2 minutes ago, Saumaya said:

Gurus and every kind of authority

Especially the authority of experience(time). 

[Faceless]

Just now, Joseph Maynor said:

How about the authority of Thought?

Indeed

i don’t see thought as distinct from experience. One and the same movement of registration, recollection, which responds-projects. 

Edited September 9, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

1 hour ago, Joseph Maynor said:

Thought is just a sensation, an aspect of Experience.

Indeed thought is sensation. Mind is part of sensation.  Mind stores sensation (memory), which reacts as experience. So that memory, experience responds as thought which determines experience. Experience implies recognition of the old(experience, knowledge, memory), the old. Self feeding loop. 

Edited September 9, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

Thought identifies itself with that sensation and through identification the 'I' is built up. ? fragmentation !!?

Edited September 9, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

49 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

The end is the burning of Personal Development,

Indeed personal development of psychological evolution is seen through. Oddly many think of it as grim. Not the case one bit. 

Edited September 9, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

5 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

It's also the burning of the Preacher.  The one who gets to feel morally superior.  

?indeed. All for the best. Less fear sustained in consciousness. 

5 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

The one who thinks they're fighting evil 'out there'.

Ah yes, the mind and its movement towards abstraction..Well said. 

Edited September 9, 2018 by Faceless

[DrewNows]

@Joseph MaynorAlmost seen as a deep murky description of enlightenment. What about freedom? 

[Haumea2018]

Enlightenment IS freedom.

Every person has a natural drive in the direction of freedom (The Self earns to fully express itself) but the self-perpetuating I-thought/ego seeks to derail that drive.

[Faceless]

4 minutes ago, DrewNows said:

@Joseph MaynorAlmost seen as a deep murky description of enlightenment. What about freedom? 

 

16 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

It's also the burning of the Preacher.  The one who gets to feel morally superior.

No more psychological dependence on authority of any kind is freedom. 

[Faceless]

4 minutes ago, Haumea2018 said:

Enlightenment IS freedom.

Every person has a natural drive in the direction of freedom (The Self earns to fully express itself) but the self-perpetuating I-thought/ego seeks to derail that drive.

Indeed. “The self” inherently moves positively-negatively or sustains its own movement by evading (what is) to (what should be-abstraction). Psychological time, or (psychological becoming), contributes to the self feeding loop of time as “the i”. 

Edited September 9, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

4 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

The only freedom you have is the freedom to maintain keen Awareness.

Awareness is freedom. 

[Haumea2018]

Quote

“The self” inherently moves positively-negatively or sustains its own movement by evading (what is) to (what should be-abstraction)

My technical term for this is the ego "boom-bust" or "inflationary-deflationary" dynamic.

[DrewNows]

 

1 minute ago, Faceless said:

Awareness is freedom. 

freedom from mental and psychological pain? 

[Haumea2018]

Freedom from the discontent arising from inability to accept.

Edited September 9, 2018 by Haumea2018

[DrewNows]

2 minutes ago, Haumea2018 said:

Freedom from the discontent arising from inability to accept.

thank you. 

[Haumea2018]

No prob.

[DrewNows]

@Joseph MaynorTwo questions for you: 

Does enlightenment in sports make zero sense? I felt maybe "flow" state is somehow related to higher awareness (maybe non-dual state) 

 

Do you see an enlightened world to be any sort of possibility in the future? 

Edited September 9, 2018 by DrewNows

[Saumaya]

42 minutes ago, Feel Good said:

What I'm doing is pointing out that you can be enlightened at blue, and have all the mind stuff of blue without the separate self sense.

I highly doubt it, while I agree that some shadow issues from blue can follow you, but you wont be functioning from that stage.

48 minutes ago, Feel Good said:

One is called waking up (horizontal enligtenment ~ where enlightenment can happen at any stage- and it does because we have instances of transmitted masters at blue orange and green) and the other is called growing up (vertical enlightenment)

 

I am already familiar with this vertical or horizontal thing, i just dont think they are fully mutually exclusive.

49 minutes ago, Feel Good said:

If it's all semantics then why are you talking about distinctions of 1st and 2nd tier?

 

1st and 2nd tier is the standard model. Talking about a 3rd tier is completely unnecessary

51 minutes ago, Feel Good said:

Ken Wilbur isn't a guru

Nobody is a guru. People follow some people and give them authority, this marks the birth of the guru.  

55 minutes ago, Feel Good said:

3rd tier is the transpersonal

There is no 3rd tier, what he may be talking about is this

 

[Toby]

@Saumaya that is from Ken Wilbers early books. A lot has changed in his model. The "horizontal" / "vertical" thing is relatively new in his work.