What is the most common reaction of the ego to a first glimpse?

[zunnyman]

Is it scary, terrifying, scary and beautiful, just beautiful, or depends how you want to see it. Do you have a choice how you would react, or should I just “explore” and find out for myself. 

Does it happen in like an instant death, or like a slow death? Once there is ego-death, will the ego continue fighting and there would be a lot of suffering?

I don’t expect all these questions to be answered, I just want to get a sense of how this journey unfolds. Can I predict at all, or is it completely u known. 

Sometimes when I am meditating and boundaries are dissolving and weird shit is happening, I accept, allow, love, or welcome whatever comes up. But other times my ego screams. I don’t get it. 

This might partly be my fear talking, but also I would like to know what I am getting myself into with this work and if it would be too much for me to handle, than ill get other areas of my life sorted out until I am ready for meditation again

 

[Leo Gura]

All such ideas and expectations will only get in the way.

No one knows how you will react. Depends on you.

You should not be pursuing a particular reaction, but Truth. Whatever Truth entails is whatever happens.

That's the thing, you cannot get a preview of what you're getting into. It is unimaginable. You just have to want the Truth, whatever the cost. If you don't care about Truth you are unlikely to succeed because Truth is what we are talking about, not positive states or anything else.

Enlightenment is a pursuit for those you want metaphysical answers.

So ask yourself, what do you want?

[cetus]

9 hours ago, zunnyman said:

Is it scary, terrifying, scary and beautiful, just beautiful, or depends how you want to see it.

@zunnyman Here is a picture of what's known as the Bootes Void.  It is literally a tear in the fabric of space/time- a true emptieness/void.

It is both terrifying and beauliful    But how would one know the truth of it unless they entered into it?

[Nahm]

@cetus56 Just me, or, kinda looks like a heart?

[cetus]

8 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@cetus56 Just me, or, kinda looks like a heart?

@Nahm I saw it too-was thinking of you.

[Nahm]

@cetus56 ??  It is me! Lol 

[zunnyman]

@Leo Gura I re-call a point in childhood where truth mattered a lot to me. Now its a lot about having a good life, positive emotions, etc. Now I’ll try to cultivate the desire for truth again, maybe by just starting to look around me with wonder and curiosity about what is going on, and go from there. I have tried cultivating the desire for truth, but after experiencing dark night stuff my mind had second thoughts about this whole journey. But if wanting to know the Truth is the key component here, then I will make that a priority. 

[zunnyman]

@cetus56 That really is terrifying and beautiful. Great metaphor

[robdl]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You just have to want the Truth, whatever the cost. If you don't care about Truth you are unlikely to succeed because Truth is what we are talking about, not positive states or anything else.

Enlightenment is a pursuit for those you want metaphysical answers.

So ask yourself, what do you want?

 

To me, it's interesting/revealing that the mind is perpetually and mechanically wanting something, whether it be wanting something worldly (money, validation, identity, success) or wanting something metaphysical (Truth, Answers, Enlightenment); something "lower" or something "higher."   

Are we certain that it's not the exact same thought mechanism (of wanting-seeking) at play for either case?

Is it possible for the ego/mind to deceive-delude itself by wanting something associated with being "ego-less"?  Is ego that sneaky-tricky or can we trust ego?

Should we investigate-observe the very nature of wanting-seeking in and of itself?

By wanting things and pursuing them, are we conditioned with assumptions-conclusions-beliefs at the outset of the pursuit, thereby starting the pursuit in a faulty, corrupted direction?

Edited September 5, 2018 by robdl

[Faceless]

30 minutes ago, robdl said:

To me, it's interesting/revealing that the mind is perpetually and mechanically wanting something, whether it be wanting something worldly (money, validation, identity, success) or wanting something metaphysical (Truth, Answers, Enlightenment); something "lower" or something "higher."   

Root may very well be seeking security in the abstraction in which thought invents. A movement from what-is, to what should be.

Perhaps uncertainty seeking security in certainty. Being a movement of measure; THOUGHT, there is made the distinction between “lower” or “higher”, and then thought-self places itself somewhere within that field of reference. Being a movement of measure and due to ones preconceptions accumulated over time one then out of its bias-prejudice judges itself as lacking. A movement of comparison; I am “this”, but the program of “i” nudges me to pursue “that”. A perpetual movement from A to B.....A movement of psychological time. Ultimately a movement of division-fragmentation. 

Quite important to go into indeed. 

Edited September 5, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

31 minutes ago, robdl said:

Is it possible for the ego/mind to deceive-delude itself by wanting something associated with being "ego-less"?

I would say it is quite possible. This can also be seen as a movement of action-reaction. 

[robdl]

6 minutes ago, Faceless said:

I would say it is quite possible. This can also be seen as a movement of action-reaction. 

In the time-goal-effort (pursuit) of ego-lessness, ego sneakily and happily self-sustains, self-nourishes.

[Faceless]

54 minutes ago, robdl said:

Should we investigate-observe the very nature of wanting-seeking in and of itself?

 I would say definitely. 

If one goes into it deep enough they will find that this movement of reaction-action being a conditioned pattern, will definitely alter the course of the pursuit. It may indeed contribute to corruption/self deception.

 

good points @robdl. 

Truth is not the result of action-reaction in pursuit. 

There is great significance in this. 

 

Nevertheless, @Leo Gura and @cetus56 are right, one has to be willing to step into the unknown willingly. This can also happen without the intent of seeking truth, and simply by ceasing to resist what-is, because one sees holistically it’s implications-consequences. This is also known as intelligent action. Action born of, and as truth. 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 5, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

3 minutes ago, robdl said:

In the time-goal-effort (pursuit) of ego-lessness, ego sneakily and happily self-sustains, self-nourishes.

Oh yes.. 

It both wants to end itself, and sustain its own movement simultaneously. Tricky little devil isn’t it. 

[robdl]

2 minutes ago, Faceless said:

 

Nevertheless, @Leo Gura and @cetus56 are right, one has to be willing to step into the unknown willingly. This can also happen without he intent of seeking truth, and by simply by ceasing to resist what-is, because one see holistically it’s implications-consequences. This is also known as intelligent action. action born of truth. 

Right.   As the "intent of seeking truth" could just be a by-product/expression (action-reaction, as you say) of our experience, conditioning, knowledge (thought-self).

 

[Faceless]

2 minutes ago, robdl said:

Right.   As the "intent of seeking truth" could just be a by-product/expression (action-reaction, as you say) of our experience, conditioning, knowledge (thought-self).

 

Yes..

i think it’s wise to be aware of all this. 

By the way I made an edit on that part. Lol 

[robdl]

6 minutes ago, Faceless said:

Oh yes.. 

It both wants to end itself, and sustain its own movement simultaneously. Tricky little devil isn’t it. 

The ego's pursuit of its end may just be the pursuit of a concept-abstraction-idea of an "end"  projected out of the ego;  a concept-abstraction-idea that sneakily only sustains the ego/self-image.

[Faceless]

Just now, robdl said:

The ego's pursuit of its end may just be the pursuit of a concept-abstraction-idea of an "end"  projected out of the ego;  a concept-abstraction-idea that sneakily only sustains the ego/self-image.

Indeed...

well said!! 

[robdl]

4 minutes ago, Faceless said:

Indeed...

well said!! 

The ego/thinking projects images out of its own movement, doesn't realize it has done so, then chases those images from the perspective of a separate fragment ("I").  But the Chaser and Chased are one unitary movement.  It becomes obvious how Chasing (Seeking) perpetuates this division-fragmentation.

[Faceless]

8 minutes ago, robdl said:

The ego/thinking projects images out of its own movement, doesn't realize it has done so, then chases those images from the perspective of a separate fragment ("I").  But the Chaser and Chased are one unitary movement.  It becomes obvious how Chasing (Seeking) perpetuates this division-fragmentation.

As to be aware of such contradicting action (positive-negative movement of the self), one then doesn’t feed that divisive pattern of fragmentation, and in freedom without that limited conditioned action, intelligent action manifest on its own... By letting truth act in, and of itself.

The holistic insight of all this as one unitary movement is itself intelligent action, which is infinite action; whole-NOT FRAGMENTED/DIVISIVE. 

Edited September 5, 2018 by Faceless