MGTOW is the natural endgame of becoming actualized??

[Emerald]

1 hour ago, kingroboto said:

I feel this idea of a "healthy" and well adjusted men or women is increasingly like chasing a unicorn. Generations of weak parenting compounded by internet and social media has pretty much made sure of that. At some point you have to realize that Santa Claus doesn't exist and stop playing a rigged game. I think people like Jordan Peterson and Leo are starting to undo the damage but im in no delusion that it's going to fix anything overnight, if ever. (It took me 4 yrs to discover Leo's channel, for example) 

So all that is left to do is to just focus on myself and be the best person that I can be. That's what I got out of the MGTOW philosophy. There will always be the low conscious people that use such ideology as crutch but it's not the case for myself

Do you consider yourself to be a healthy and well-adjusted person? Did you ever consider that perhaps your mindsets are a symptom of the very problem of low consciousness that you perceive? 

[kingroboto]

@Emerald umm? No, not by a long shot. I never stated otherwise. I'm working to better myself though. Do you think you are well adjusted?

[Shadowraix]

On 8/31/2018 at 5:39 PM, Emerald said:

"It's not about fear or running away, rather it is about simply being content with yourself and accepting the reality that yes, all women are fundamentally deceitful and self serving, and that the usual checks and balances that were in place to keep them in line have been destroyed by introduction of feminism, birth control, tinder, and social media. Its about surrendering to reality regarding men's place in western society today."

Until this point, you seemed to be being pretty reasonable. And I was thinking, "Well, if he doesn't harbor resistance toward women, then perhaps severing himself from the social matrix for a while might be of help. It may help him unwire his distorted worldview about how women and men are and should be."

But the above quote shows me that your severance from the social matrix will only lead to you becoming more entrenched in your own ideas about the way reality works, and further severing yourself from your own feminine side. A person who is in resistance to an entire gender will be unable to self-actualize. There is an aspect of you that is female. And that part of yourself hates you because you hate it. And as long as you think this way, you will always suffer from a feminine terror that appears to be coming from the outside... but is actually coming from the inside. 

I thought roughly the same as Emerald.

 

OP, ultimately it seems like what you are after is not internalizing the expectations placed on you by others. And this might be why MGTOW resonated with you. 

Any over arching qualities attributed to the labels 'men' and 'women' come from an extremely limited pool of either or out of billions.

Plenty of sets of ideas have good ones, but do be wary to not take ALL of it on the basis of a few good ideas.

[Emerald]

17 minutes ago, kingroboto said:

@Emerald umm? No, not by a long shot. I never stated otherwise. I'm working to better myself though. Do you think you are well adjusted?

It's just that you seem to be very defensive every time I talk to you, like you think I'm insulting you or something. And then you go on little mini-rants about deceitful women, landwhales, and the unconscious masses. So, I was asking because it seems to me that you believe yourself to be more conscious than most other people. That's the vibe that your posts give off.

As far as me being well-adjusted, it depends on which area of life we're talking about. Financially I struggle quite a bit still. And because I spend most of my time with my children and husband, I don't have a very rich social life. But otherwise, I've done a lot of introspection and inner work, and I am very brutally self-honest and willing to look at things within myself that are good, bad, and ugly. So, in this regard, I am quite well-adjusted and centered in reality.

It's the reason why I recognize the great harm that judging others causes, and the boomerang effect that it has. So, that's why I don't go around hating on men, hating on women, or judging fat people, or blaming the unconscious masses. I realize the vulnerability inherent in the human experience, and I  can access genuine feelings of empathy toward them. It's easy to walk in other's shoes. 

That said, I do get incredibly frustrated when people hold ignorant beliefs, but think themselves to be more conscious than others. On the more self-focused end of things, I'm tired of women being the projection screen for that kind of unconsciousness. It's very frustrating to be on the receiving end of so much unearned hatred and judgment.

On the more altruistic end of things, I know that people who do this are suffering immensely under the weight of their own judgments and projections. And because it's a widespread phenomena it is such a handicap to human consciousness evolution. And I feel a sense of urgency to help people who are in this trap, because it will eventually blow up into something ugly. But I'm frustrated at the same time... so if I am blunt with you, that is why.

Now, something beautiful will probably grow from that ugly mess. But I want to avoid it if possible by making people more aware of their unconsciousness before it reaches a fever pitch. 

But rigidity is an aspect of the very repression that I mentioned earlier on in the thread. So, it's somewhat difficult to get through to people who are sold on the anti-feminine world-views being espoused on the internet as of late. And there are millions of people out there who are into those ideas, many of who are also suffering from Anima Possession. So, it's all quite overwhelming to try to make a difference in that. 

[stevegan928]

On 8/30/2018 at 6:24 PM, kingroboto said:

It's not about fear or running away, rather it is about simply being content with yourself and accepting the reality that yes, all women are fundamentally deceitful and self serving, and that the usual checks and balances that were in place to keep them in line have been destroyed by introduction of feminism, birth control, tinder, and social media. Its about surrendering to reality regarding men's place in western society today.

MGTOW philosophy is great as long as you replace the word "woman" with something like "illusion" or "maya" otherwise you'll come off as sexist. I mean women aren't actually real after all and it isn't just these evil "women" that act this way. This is actually just the world we live in, it's a bitch, so release yourself from the bonds of maya and go within. 

 

[kingroboto]

@Emerald if you want my opinion you should value your time more and not be posting essay long responses on message boards which ultimately wont change anything. You are trying to reverse the flow of a river by paddling it with your hands. I'm not going to respect the opinion of someone who doesn't value their own time. Go be a mother and a wife. I think that will have more positive effect on the world

Edited September 2, 2018 by kingroboto

[stevegan928]

17 minutes ago, kingroboto said:

if you want my opinion you should value your time more and not be posting essay long responses on message boards which ultimately wont change anything. You are trying to reverse the flow of a river by paddling it with your hands. I'm not going to respect the opinion of someone who doesn't value their own time. Go be a mother and a wife. I think that will have more positive effect on the world

 You did well here, Emerald may deny it, or it may be my projection but she seems properly triggered. Your responses where sufficiently epic, you seemed calm, cool, collected. That last post of yours cut really fucking deep as well, implying she may even be a sub-par mother, evidence being the amount of time she spends crafting a long, detailed response which you didn't even read. This shows indifference to this whole petty little internet argument that your opponent got so riled up over. Again, you stayed calm, cool, collected. I think it's safe to say you won the exchange, not like you even care about winning which just makes you even more legendary. Emerald will question her very identity as a mother and wife every time she writes a post on this forum from now on. You? Well you only have 50 posts as it stands right now, even if someone could  cast such a spell on you it's not like you've invested much into this site anyway. But what could they even attack? You've severed yourself from the bonds of female and societal validation. 

Not much more I can say here really. As you continue on your self-actualization journey I ask that you remember back to this moment, this moment of victory. Remember back to this moment during your next psychedelic trip. Say to yourself "I won. I won. I won. Victory. Victory. Victory." I know you don't care but trust me this is an important milestone in your journey you just don't realize it yet. So I ask of you to repeat the victory affirmation on your next psychedelic trip. The results may astonish you. 

[kingroboto]

@stevegan928 lol didnt even ask for it but thanks for the breakdown. 

Edited September 3, 2018 by kingroboto

[Emerald]

58 minutes ago, stevegan928 said:

 You did well here, Emerald may deny it, or it may be my projection but she seems properly triggered. Your responses where sufficiently epic, you seemed calm, cool, collected. That last post of yours cut really fucking deep as well, implying she may even be a sub-par mother, evidence being the amount of time she spends crafting a long, detailed response which you didn't even read. This shows indifference to this whole petty little internet argument that your opponent got so riled up over. Again, you stayed calm, cool, collected. I think it's safe to say you won the exchange, not like you even care about winning which just makes you even more legendary. Emerald will question her very identity as a mother and wife every time she writes a post on this forum from now on. You? Well you only have 50 posts as it stands right now, even if someone could  cast such a spell on you it's not like you've invested much into this site anyway. But what could they even attack? You've severed yourself from the bonds of female and societal validation. 

Not much more I can say here really. As you continue on your self-actualization journey I ask that you remember back to this moment, this moment of victory. Remember back to this moment during your next psychedelic trip. Say to yourself "I won. I won. I won. Victory. Victory. Victory." I know you don't care but trust me this is an important milestone in your journey you just don't realize it yet. So I ask of you to repeat the victory affirmation on your next psychedelic trip. The results may astonish you. 

Long live King Roboto! 

VICTORY! VICTORY! VICTORY!

[Brittany]

MGTOW and Feminism are symptoms of a much bigger illness that exists within the foundations of romantic love itself.

Men and women are looking to each other for a savior. And this simply won't ever work. 

Ego cannot save ego from ego.

The whole foundation is crumbling because it was always sick from the start.

[XYZ]

Well basically yes, although not necessarily. Aren't real monks, yogis and ascetics natural MGTOW? I have observed much overlap between their ways of life and the MGTOW youtubers who don't pursue women. Last hour I replied to a thread wondering what is the point of seeking sex and relationships: Either you are feeling incomplete and are looking for someone you hope will make you happy and give your life meaning, or you already feel fulfilled, a light unto yourself, and have no need to ever seek such things. No reason to at all, except for procreation. The more self-actualized you become, the less you crave external fulfillment, so if there was an endgame it wouldn't be avoiding anything, but no longer needing it. And this is the healthy attitude towards sexuality, non-attachment, not making an ideology out of doing anything, or avoiding anything.

MGTOW can mean a lot of different things to different people. Ironically most of the MGTOW content online seems to be obsesses with woman rather than understanding and optimizing male nature. I stopped calling myself that or identifying with the philosophy, because it is a liming belief, and tends to be associated with all kinds of bitterness and resentment. There's really no point, I don't need any excuse for not pursuing sex and relationships, and it doesn't matter to what degree my lacking them is voluntary or involuntary. So just like my favorite 'MGTOW' youtuber Stardusk I transcended the label since it no longer serves me, yet is still a useful umbrella term to find and create content related to personal sovereignty and freedom from the male perspective.

One thing I will add is that MGTOW knowledge is extremely valuable in helping men realize how embedded male disposability is within themselves, their society and human nature in general. Men are conditioned to view themselves only in terms of what they can do, not who they are, and they are valued only for their utility, like tools. And I often wonder if this is biologically ingrained in life itself, when there evolved a second gender that does not bear life, is this male gender literally designed to be a self-sacrificing disposable utility made only to provide for and protect the women and children? Will civilizations built upon male disposability crumble when MGTOW becomes as popular as feminism? Or will we enter a golden age where machines, biotech and AI replace all the needs for male disposability, and men and women learn to see each other as equally valuable? 

I'm somewhat unique in that I never became indoctrinated into male disposability, likely because I have a more balanced masculine-feminine energy, was never interested in typical masculine pursuits. I never considered my own health and well being any less important than that of any woman... if a woman asks me to move a table for her, I tell her I'll carry one end if she takes the other. Enjoying the moment and being in the flow of life are satisfying to me, needing to compete and achieve things, to prove myself and be of service does not. Whenever I had thought of women I desired, my feelings were of wanting to enjoy her and to be with her, not to provide value and protection. It was always about experiencing the richness of life, indulging in sensuality, embodying sensations, not finding meanings. Perhaps this is why this "life purpose" question baffles me so much, since being mission-oriented is said to be the epitome of masculinity, and to say "I am a human being, not a human doing" is essentially rejecting masculinity itself.

In conclusion, I've come to see that there is a fundamental disconnect between what I consider to be eudaimonia as a self-actualizing individual, and that which women are attracted to. This realization obliterated any remaining negative thoughts associated with my status as an outsider of the "sexual marketplace."

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And you have a habit of asking how much time people spend here as an Ad Hominem. How much time do you spend here?  I don't come here that often and spend a lot less time online in general, but on these forums I actually take the time to read, think deeply and post well thought out comments to actually learn things. Very disappointed in the quality of replies I often see, so much shitposting, image macro replies and trolling for @(You)s it seems, like trying to up their post count rather than contribute quality content.

[Haumea2018]

Hello...mass movements suck (both MGTOW AND "equality of outcome" feminism.)

If you surrender your uniqueness to fit into a mold, mental or physical, you are sacrificing your freedom.  You become a slave.

Enlightenment is about being who YOU are, not about who some herd expects you to be.

The problem with the MGTOW agenda is that it's a distortion of a truth: it takes certain discernable trends and turns them into an absolutist dogma.  It's like saying if cancer is worryingly increasing everyone's going to get cancer (when it's more like from 5% to 10% or something.)

This goes for a lot of things.  There are always witches to hunt.

Edited September 9, 2018 by Haumea2018

[Consept]

The main point of mgtow should be that you you dont need to sacrifice who you are for a woman, what i mean by that is you should discover who you are and be defined by that, not by a relationship or sex or whatever. The problem men have is that we put women too high up on a pedestal which mostly they dont actually like and because of that it leads to rejection, disillusionment, resentment, hatred even. So this needs to be taught, the other problem is there is no where that this is taught in a healthy way, mgtow and manosphere guys are trying to share this information, the only problem is its a bit all over the place. It would be fine if there wasnt such resentment built into it, but in some cases there is. 

In general i think attaching yourself to a 'movement' just doesnt work, because what it means is after watching a few videos youve resonated with it and youve picked this side so it leads to you having bias and defending it without taking into account other perspectives. Take the info that makes sense but dont be tied to it 

[billiesimon]

On 3/9/2018 at 0:26 AM, kingroboto said:

@Emerald if you want my opinion you should value your time more and not be posting essay long responses on message boards which ultimately wont change anything. You are trying to reverse the flow of a river by paddling it with your hands. I'm not going to respect the opinion of someone who doesn't value their own time. Go be a mother and a wife. I think that will have more positive effect on the world

Bro, calm down.

She's just trying to help you.
I can feel all your sadness in your posts. I was in a similar position two years ago, but not so deep luckily. You feel rejected by the feminine energy and you crave the soft emotions that they give you. You have to accept this. It's not a loser thing. You have to embrace the neediness and then do the necessary work to remove it. The first step is becoming aware of the moments where you project evil onto women.

This woman is an example of a woman you would appreciate, because she is giving you what you want: empathy and a way out of your sadness. 
Notice that you are resisting her and thus creating this false reality where she is just "another female enemy". When in fact she's the opposite. Become aware of the fear of the opposite sex and release it.

[kingroboto]

4 hours ago, billiesimon said:

Bro, calm down.

She's just trying to help you.
I can feel all your sadness in your posts. I was in a similar position two years ago, but not so deep luckily. You feel rejected by the feminine energy and you crave the soft emotions that they give you. You have to accept this. It's not a loser thing. You have to embrace the neediness and then do the necessary work to remove it. The first step is becoming aware of the moments where you project evil onto women.

This woman is an example of a woman you would appreciate, because she is giving you what you want: empathy and a way out of your sadness. 
Notice that you are resisting her and thus creating this false reality where she is just "another female enemy". When in fact she's the opposite. Become aware of the fear of the opposite sex and release it.

Bro, white knight much?

[Emerald]

3 minutes ago, kingroboto said:

Bro, white knight much?

He's right though. I genuinely was trying to help you. I was a bit frustrated, and it probably showed. Understandably. But I see a ton of guys get really trapped in these ideologies to where they can't see out of them. And it really distorts reality and makes it impossible to truly grow. 

[billiesimon]

8 minutes ago, kingroboto said:

Bro, white knight much?

I came here the first time in the forum with some negative beliefs about women, based on negative experiences and some pessimistic political articles.

At least when I was similar to you I came here with humility and willingness to learn. I decided to question my default victim mentality and start to open myself up to the woman's experience.

For the last time: don't hold onto your ego. Listen to @Emerald, who's dedicated to this area of self help.

I really appreciate what she did here on the forum to heal the feminine side of men. Now the power of healing yourself is up to you. Notice also how your ego claims to be "self actualizing" while you are in fact debating the people who already dealt with this problem you have  we're trying to help you.

[kingroboto]

 

 

[thehero]

tbh i would do a serious self reflection to see if you're a white knight yourself

i used to hate on white knights after getting indoctrinated into RSD only to realize later my game style was fucking white knight style

what a mind fuck 

also i know you don't like emerald, and are triggered by her posts and her posts are def a bit aggressive(maybe), but i would def read the posts she made. i'm not saying to just believe her but to take her philosophies and try to understand them in the name of TRUTH!  the integration of the feminine side of you is extremely important and realize that women are JUST like you, just with a somewhat diff psychology. they're insecure, they just want to be happy, they love men, they want and crave authenticity and connection. i've found amazing, such kind, loving and beautiful girls in my time here on earth so far. develop a very deep understanding of their psyche. they aren't evil like how mgtow preaches and the picture is MUCH more deeper than LMS as red pill preaches. 

I went through the SAME path as you bro. The SAME one. I went from mgtow, to red pill.... thank god it wasn't incel. i probably wouldn't have been able to dig myself out if that was the case. 

Edited September 15, 2018 by thehero

[kingroboto]

6 hours ago, thehero said:

i've found amazing, such kind, loving and beautiful girls in my time here on earth so far. 

Wow!!! Not just one, but multiple? You should consider yourself a very lucky man indeed. I'm happy for you. Sadly I haven't been privileged to meet these loving kind and beautiful girls, I'm mostly surrounded by landwhales in yoga tights. Should I move? Where do you live? So what happened with you and these lovely ladies, did you pursue relationship with them? How did you come to find out their loving and kind nature? Please update us

And my heart is warmed that there are indeed women like these out there. MGTOW is not the same as incels. I am more than open to be in a relationship with a beautiful, smart, kind, loving girl who is not emotionally damaged, entitled, or manipulative. If life presents me such person I will present the best version of myself and do my level best to make her happy. It's just that legal marriage contract is out of the picture. Nor is she going to move into my place, or have access to my bank account. I'm just happy pursuing my creative projects and building up my financial resources right now. Maybe all this is some elaborate plan to get the attention of women? Maybe so but even then marriage just seems like a stupid gamble for men in today's world doesn't it? 

Edited September 15, 2018 by kingroboto