Are animals enlightened?

[DecemberFlower]

I know this might be just pointless speculation which doesnt make much difference to us but still for sake of my curiosity do you think animals might be enlightened?I mean most of them dont posses an ego and cant see themselves as separate individuals from rest of the world.Illusion of the ego doesnt need to be seen through and they live in a sense of going with the flow even though its instinctual.They dont worry about the future they dont regret of the past, they live in the now. 

[PsiloPutty]

My cat sure isn't. She can be a moody lil bitch.   

[SoonHei]

@DecemberFlower I'd say from our point of view / perspective, it is nothing more than a speculation if they are or aren't enlightened.

 

But knowing that Absolute Infinite includes all that can be / is possible and that there is no limit to what is possible since there exists nothing which can impose a limit on the absolute, then it also must include the possibility where animals both have an ego and do not have an ego.

 

All possibilities are.

God/Infinite One knows all possible experiences. So it must include the experience of a pig being slaughtered and not feeling any "pain/suffering" and also include the possibility of the pig being slaughtered and feeling every single cut/mince/suffering pain of that experience. 

 

there is no absolute single relative perspective - ALL possibilities are present.

[How to be wise]

@DecemberFlower we can never know that my friend. But are you enlightened? That’s something you can know and work on.

[SoonHei]

4 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

we can never know that my friend.

but isn't it the case that all is possible? all perspectives are true and exist 

 

 

 

[DecemberFlower]

9 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

@DecemberFlower we can never know that my friend. But are you enlightened? That’s something you can know and work on.

Of course I m just realization didnt occur yet

Edited August 30, 2018 by DecemberFlower

[DecemberFlower]

17 minutes ago, PsiloPutty said:

My cat sure isn't. She can be a moody lil bitch.   

Well sure enlightened beings can experience moodiness but they dont resist present moment as it is..being enlightened doesnt mean life without "bad" emotions isnt it 

[MarkusSweden]

22 minutes ago, PsiloPutty said:

My cat sure isn't. She can be a moody lil bitch.   

Haha! 

My grandparents were farmers and had many animals, sheeps, pigs, rabbits, cats and cows. 

It was lovely to be there in the summertime growing up, I remember one cat that was truly enlightened, her name was "Smulan". We had some synchronicity going on between us, the same enlightened soul in both of us it felt like. We spend much time together.  

But there were other cats that sure wasn't enlightened as well. I guess it's very individual. Some are enlightened, but most of them are not, just as most humans aren't enlightened, but thanks god there are a few exceptions, lol  

Edited August 30, 2018 by MarkusSweden

[How to be wise]

@SoonHei let’s face it. In your life time, you will probably never find out about your pets feelings and whether or not it is enlightened. Just let it go. Turn the focus over to yourself and ask yourself those questions. If you want your cat to become enlightened, turn the focus to yourself: ‘I want to get enlightened’. Now that’s possible. The former one, not so much.

@DecemberFlower well, what are you waiting for then. Clearly you don’t have the time to be worrying about animals. When it comes to your own self-realisation, you need to be selfish with it. Worry about yourself first.

[SoonHei]

15 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

let’s face it. In your life time, you will probably never find out about your pets feelings and whether or not it is enlightened. Just let it go. Turn the focus over to yourself and ask yourself those questions. If you want your cat to become enlightened, turn the focus to yourself: ‘I want to get enlightened’. Now that’s possible. The former one, not so much.

@How to be wise yes. agreed. not wondering about it at all. i just have this understanding that all is possible. that ends the question of "what-if"

 

 

[Enlightenment]

From my point of view they are, but as enlightenment exist on a continuum so are animals "level" of enlightenment different and it probably depends on episodic memory for the most part, for instance, goldfish may be extremely enlightened because there is no episodic memory there, but an animal like Crow may only be partially enlightened

[dlof]

Eckhart Tolle talks about being above or below thought. When you're above, you are closer to the enlightened mind. He says when you're drunk, for instance, you're below thought. But that doesn't mean you're enlightened when you're drunk. Similarly, I think animals are naturally below thought.

[Haumea2018]

To go off what dlof said, Ken Wilber makes the pre-egoic, egoic, post-egoic distinction.

Animals are pre-egoic.  If the word enlightened means anything, it must mean going from egoic to post-egoic.