The mechanism of creating distinctions

[voidness]

It came to my awareness that basal consciousness creates distinctions, whereas higher consciousness dissolves distinctions.

Is it creation of distinctions a mechanism within consciousness or the consciousness itself?

When I look out the window at a tree, it does not feel like a mind event to give it a distinction from the grass; it seems as automatic as the rendering of my visual field.

So is it consciousness itself which is creating the distinctions?

If this is the case, then we have quite a paradox, because if consciousness is the foundation for everything as Leo contends, and consciousness is made out of itself, then there is no room for distinctions to begin with...?

[Leo Gura]

Distinction is a very tricky issue because distinction is the very nature of being.

If you fully understood what a distinction was, you would understand the ultimate nature of reality, and you would be deeply enlightened.

Distinction is NOT a concept!

Distinction is the "substance" of reality. And what then is the nature of a distinction? Nothing!

Yes, paradox here is not a mistake. What you're starting to intuit is that reality has no substance. It's a set of distinct appearances which are actually just a hallucination.

Reality is not made out of matter or atoms or energy. Reality is made out of distinctions!

Creation is distinction. Without distinction you have pure formless Infinity. And with distinction, you also have pure Infinity! The formed side of Infinity.

Form is formlessness. Formlessness is form.

Duality is none other than nonduality.

Infinity contains an infinite number of distinctions.

It's highly worthwhile to contemplate: What is a distinction?

-------

Mind vs not-mind = a distinction

Automatic vs not automatic = a distinction

Consciousness vs unconsciousness = a distinction

Real vs unreal = a distinction

Subjective vs objective = a distinction

Truth vs falsehood = a distinction

Creation vs destruction = a distinction

The universe vs me = a distinction

------

Consciousness is the substanceless substance within which all of these distinctions occur. Like an LCD screen on which images are rendered.

Everything you've ever seen or thought or experienced is a distinction. Including existence itself.

[voidness]

@Leo Gura
Your wisdom never ceases to amaze me Leo.

I initially was ready to bring forth a counterargument along the lines of...
But if distinctions are the nature of reality, then how is it that states of consciousness such as that described by the Sufi phrase "the passing away of the passing away" possible?

But this mode of thinking is a trap... because this state alone is a distinct from some other state for which there are distinctions present.

33 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Consciousness is the substanceless substance within which all of these distinctions occur. Like an LCD screen on which images are rendered.

I had this same insight of substanceless substance this week -- although I put it as:
No thing exists... and yet nothing exists within somethingness

...Yet another distinction!

Confronting these truths head on is quite a task -- I appreciate your guidance Leo!

[Leo Gura]

@voidness What trips most people up is that they underestimate the radical relativity of reality.

The bottom line is, reality cannot have a substance because there is nothing within reality which can be used to as a ground, and no one to arbitrate between any truth claim.

Being cannot know itself precisely because it is itself. Or rather, being can come to know that being is fundamentally groundless and therefore mystical.

There cannot be a ground other than emptiness because any other ground would itself be in need of another ground, and so on, ad infinitum.

Besides which, the ground vs not-ground is also a distinction.

Here we have reached the end of language. Anything said about the Ultimate Ground (The Groundless Ground) must be self-negating because the ultimate nature of reality is nondual, but all language works by creating dualities (distinctions). So anything we could say or think about the Absolute will be dualistic, which is the opposite of what it is. But... also not the opposite! (See how I have to negate my own words when talking about it?) Because to say anything about it is to give it a specific, distinct quality. But the Absolute is unbounded, infinite. But... also it is bounded and finite! (Again, I have to negate any quality I attribute to it).

This is why Zen is so Zen. The Truth breaks logic and language alike because the Truth is infinite while logic and language are finite.

Quote

"Only the hand that erases can write the true thing." -- Meister Eckhart

Arriving at the the Absolute requires a leap in consciousness.

 

[who chit]

Consciousness turned outward/away from itself ,through the activity of the 5 senses such as seeing,hearing etc.,and I-mind/thought,there is distinction. With consciousness turned upon itself,relative distinction collapses.  There's only life seeing life.
Distinctions of "grass  life" to "tree life" are not different from
"ant life" to "bird life". It's all life/consciousness ,all one.

[SoonHei]

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

There cannot be a ground other than emptiness because any other ground would itself be in need of another ground, and so on, ad infinitum.

Besides which, the ground vs not-ground is also a distinction.

Here we have reached the end of language. Anything said about the Ultimate Ground (The Groundless Ground) must be self-negating because the ultimate nature of reality is nondual, but all language works by creating dualities (distinctions). So anything we could say or think about the Absolute will be dualistic, which is the opposite of what it is. But... also not the opposite! (See how I have to negate my own words when talking about it?) Because to say anything about it is to give it a specific, distinct quality. But the Absolute is unbounded, infinite. But... also it is bounded and finite! (Again, I have to negate any quality I attribute to it).

beautiful.

[K VIL]

what is the video where leo discusses this before the difference video ?

[K VIL]

what is the video where leo discusses this before the difference video ?

[robdl]

The ego/mind, after all, which is the (false) division-distinction between a “thinker” and “its thoughts.” 

The division-distinction that perpetuates-nourishes ego/mind as thoughts breed “thinker” and “thinker” breeds thoughts.

Co-perpetuation, co-feeding, but ultimately a single, unitary thought-self movement.  Self-feeding thought loop.

Thought-self reinforces division-distinction; feeds on it. Unconditioned awareness dissolves them.

Division-distinction = ego survival

Edited September 1, 2018 by robdl

[robdl]

To see that thinker, thoughts, psychological time as past/projected future, fear, and desire are all one and the same unitary movement. All previous distinctions made between these things now dissolved. Astonishing - to see this holistically. True non-duality. Not a concept of it.

Edited September 1, 2018 by robdl

[robdl]

Thought labels, categorises, separates, conceptualizes, divides, distinguishes, creates opposites. It’s the duality of thought/thinking. It’s the fuel for thought’s self-perpetuation, which is its only goal; to seek security/permanence in its own movement, through this dualistic-divisive action.

Edited September 1, 2018 by robdl

[Jack River]

On 9/1/2018 at 3:23 PM, robdl said:

To see that thinker, thoughts, psychological time as past/projected future, fear, and desire are all one and the same unitary movement. All previous distinctions made between these things now dissolved. Astonishing - to see this holistically. True non-duality. Not a concept of it.

Excellent man

[robdl]

2 minutes ago, Jack River said:

Excellent man

Psychological freedom from division-conflict 

[Strikr]

the radical relativity of reality.

 

this is what you get with a psychedelic experience, you can't explain better

 

the radical relativity of reality, omg the world is so huge I m a fucking Ant.

integrated in your sense for REAL, like you feel that your chair is real, now you feel the relativity as real as the chair your sitting in.

shatter your way of reacting to the world

 

it trigger change in your all way of watching reality

but maybe psychedelic without a bit of a guideline can be tricky for some, ( psychedelic is very curative for the compulsive thinker )

Edited September 3, 2018 by Strikr

[SOUL]

Awareness transcends distinction, not necessarily dissolves it, since if it doesn't really exist as many on this forum suggest it doesn't, then there isn't anything to dissolve.

[robdl]

57 minutes ago, SOUL said:

Awareness transcends distinction, not necessarily dissolves it, since if it doesn't really exist as many on this forum suggest it doesn't, then there isn't anything to dissolve.

The apparency of the division is dissolved.  The falsity of the separation  is dissolved/seen through.

Dissolved. Seen-through. Realize-ended.

The question is whether this has been insighted directly, wholly,  or recited by thought-knowledge.

 

[robdl]

Thought-self divides fear from desire as distinct opposites. Total observation into the movement of thought reveals that fear/desire are a single, unitary movement; one and the same action of thought-seeking.