What causes ‘unhealthy’ memes to develop?

[How to be wise]

So I am reading the book ‘spiral dynamics’, and there they say that some countries like China have developed an ‘unhealthy’ form of strict blue. But what causes societies to develop ‘unhealthy’ memes? Is it because they haven’t resolved some of the lower stages?

[Leo Gura]

@How to be wise Every meme becomes unheathly evenutally as the ego makes an identity out of it.

Identity creates attachment and clinging, which is sort of the definition of dysfunction.

America has plenty of unhealthy strict Blue too. Look at the Catholics, Evangelicals, and Mormons.

Whenever a meme is turned into an ideology, into "the truth", it becomes toxic because all memes are partial and limited. They are never the full Truth.

[TomDashingPornstar]

16 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@How to be wise Every meme becomes unheathly evenutally as the ego makes an identity out of it.

Identity creates attachment and clinging, which is sort of the definition of dysfunction.

America has plenty of unhealthy strict Blue too. Look at the Catholics, Evangelicals, and Mormons.

Whenever a meme is turned into an ideology, into "the truth", it becomes toxic because all memes are partial and limited. They are never the full Truth.

What do you mean.  I mostly see Mormons who are extremely happy, successful, nice, educated, and generally beautiful people compared to everyone else.  

That's what I observe.  It looks like they're doing fine.

[dorg]

58 minutes ago, TomDashingPornstar said:

That's what I observe.  It looks like they're doing fine.

That illustrates where you are on the Spiral.

[RichardY]

Over perpetuation, like cancer.

[TomDashingPornstar]

@dorg oh yeah, where?

[dorg]

50 minutes ago, TomDashingPornstar said:

@dorg oh yeah, where?

Suggest you study up on it.

[TomDashingPornstar]

@dorg Why don't you just say it?

[tsuki]

11 hours ago, How to be wise said:

What causes ‘unhealthy’ memes to develop?

@How to be wise Memes become unhealthy when we outgrow them.
We outgrow them when we identify them as the driving force of our actions.
The moment of identification is the moment that the meme is born (named).

China does its unhealthy things because it has not really understood what is the impact of its actions.
The things 'we' call unhealthy are only that because we point finger at 'them' and judge them from our reference point.
They are not unhealthy to 'them'. 'They' need to construct their own memes about themselves and grow on their own.

Unhealthiness of the past is the result of self-reflection.

Edited August 27, 2018 by tsuki

[dorg]

6 minutes ago, TomDashingPornstar said:

@dorg Why don't you just say it?

I am not going to define you. That would not help you. Discover yourself where you are.

[TomDashingPornstar]

@dorg

3 minutes ago, dorg said:

I am not going to define you. That would not help you. Discover yourself where you are.

LMAO, don't wanna go out on a limb after all eh?

[How to be wise]

@tsuki the book says that, for China to grow properly, they need to abandon their current ‘unhealthy’ blue and adopt a more ‘healthy’ blue. So clearly it is ‘unhealthy’ to them.

[Sashaj]

Don’t forget that people who write books can sometimes be wrong

Edited August 27, 2018 by Sashaj

[tsuki]

1 hour ago, How to be wise said:

the book says that, for China to grow properly, they need to abandon their current ‘unhealthy’ blue and adopt a more ‘healthy’ blue.
So clearly it is ‘unhealthy’ to them.

What do you mean by "'unhealthy' to them"?
The authors of the book explain the spiral dynamics model in terms of various examples.
They have chosen China as an example of unhealthy blue. China is an unhealthy manifestation of blue to the authors of SD.

Are authors of SD Chinese so that through self-reflection they come to realize the unhealthiness of China? Probably not.
If they are actually judging China as 'unhealthy' and 'in the need of change', then they are simply wasting their (and your) time.

The only sensible (to me) reason to call China 'unhealthy blue' in a book about SD is to define blue in terms of what China does.
Calling China 'unhealthy blue' is not a statement about China at all. It is a statement about SD.

What I was saying in my previous post may have not been clear, so let me re-phrase it:
'Unhealthy' stages are 'unhealthy' only from the vantage point of the later stages.
In order to grow (change), you need to explore the whole possibility space of a given stage.
Only through self-reflection on your excesses in relation to previous stages you are able to transcend the stage you are currently in.

No amount of books can change China.