Shamanic Breathing Mega-Thread

[Faceless]

Lol carful guys 

[i am I AM]

@PsiloPutty You mentioned Lora's ego as being what induced fear.If Lora is, right now, willing to let go of the limitation, illusion, regardless of what you call it, then ego is not holding her back. Because it isn't an "ego" choice. Then, she is making the correct choice for her.

[Egosum]

13 hours ago, Sage_Elias said:

My five (5) year old nephew has sickle cell and I was wondering if Shamanic Breathing could heal him.

The disease is as a result of a lack of oxygen circulating in the body. This happens because the red blood cells which carry oxygen easily clog up the arteries since they are shaped like a banana instead of circular in shape.

Leo mentioned that Shamanic breathing skyrockets the levels of oxygen circulation in the body.

any experts here?

What InfinitePotential said is exactly right, but because I've been doing some research on this topic, I just want to elaborate a bit.

Yes, this breathing technique, which is basically a form of voluntary hyperventilation, increases the level of circulating oxygen, but because it also leads to a loss of carbon dioxide, it actually reduces oxygen transport to the tissues. This is because of the Bohr effect, which states that the oxygen binding affinity of hemoglobin (the protein that carries oxygen) is inversely related to the aciditiy of the blood. And because the loss of carbon dioxide leads to increased blood alkalinity (higher pH), less oxygen is released from hemoglobin, resulting in decreased oxygentation of the tissues.

(This is precisely how the technique works: by interfering with normal oxygen uptake in the brain, you induce a sort of "expansion" of ordinary awareness (this is of course counterintuitive from the perspective of materialism/physicalism, which believes the brain generates consciousness). See this paper by Bernardo Kastrup: http://jcn.cognethic.org/jcnv4i3_Kastrup.pdf Or this essay based on the same paper: https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/guest-blog/transcending-the-brain/)

So how do you increase oxygenation?

As InfinitePotential said, you want to breath less. By breathing less you retain more carbon dioxide, leading to increased blood aciditiy (lower pH) and thus increased oxygen delivery to the tissues.

So, to sum it up:

- Increased breathing rate (hyperventilation) = loss of CO2 = higher blood pH = more oxygen bound to hemoglobin = less oxygen to the tissues
- Decreased breathing rate (hypoventilation) = increased retention of CO2 = lower blood pH = less oxygen bound to hemoglobin = more oxygen to the tissues

Edited April 9, 2018 by Egosum
Added a few words

[cetus]

@Phrae Whether physical or mental/emotional concerns you have, pace yourself and take it slow. No rush to be anywhere!

[PsiloPutty]

@i am I AM   Thank you. I can't say that I'm truly grasping the thread that you're offering me, and that's frustrating, but I'm trying. 

[InfinitePotential]

14 minutes ago, Egosum said:

So, to sum it up:

- Increased breathing (hyperventilation) = loss of CO2 = higher blood pH = more oxygen bound to hemoglobin = less oxygen to the tissues
- Decreased breathing (hypoventilation) = increased retention of CO2 = lower blood pH = less oxygen bound to hemoglobin = more oxygen to the tissues

beautiful! I've been a bit reluctant to try these kinds of breathing techniques since they're almost the polar opposite of what I've learned proper breathing to be. But with the effects spelled out like that I feel more comfortable giving it a try some time. 

Nice avatar too, materialism is bologna!!  

Edited April 9, 2018 by InfinitePotential

[ppfeiff]

So why can’t this technique work if we breathe through the nose rather than through the mouth? I haven’t really seen this discussed so far... Curious, but I think I’ll try it. Not a fan of dry throat/lips and breathing-in stagnant, unfiltered indoor air if I can avoid it, versus breathing filtered-through-the-nose-air and fresh air from outside (e.g. doing the exercise outside or simply opening a window). Cheers.

[Kallan]

Holy shit this is some powerful stuff @Leo Gura. I tried this straight after watching your video as i’m Currently going through a dark night of the soul and all that comes with it. Maybe it’s because I have tried a fair few psychedelics including the privilege of getting to try 5MEO DMT but this was super powerful. 

So I put on some soft meditation music and did the breathing for an hour. Afterwards I was able to to surrender into the experience. I find it’s easier to meditate afterwards too. I did make the mistake of trying to stand up afterwards though and it felt like I was trying to walk in heavy armour for a while :).

Just wondering is this something that is safe to do often as in a daily practise? I found it really useful and will continue to do it as long as there’s no long term negative side effects. I really feel I could grow from this.

[MM1988]

How safe is this? im afraid to try it. It is basically depriving the brain of oxygen and could in theory cause heart attacks or seizures, right?

[Viking]

I did it a few months ago and a month after that, a total of 2 times, in a group. I think it's called an osho meditation.

the way the group does it is we dance for a couple minutes, the instructions are to move however we want when the music is playing. Then we warm up by laying on our back and "ride a bicycle" with the legs in the air really fast, with breaks, for about 5 minutes. then we breathe on our back for 45 minutes, we are told to do whatever our body wants to, whether it be shout, cry, move arms and legs, etc. then a few minutes relaxation.

first time I breathed I shouted a lot and had extreme energy all over my body. I cried at the end because I released social anxiety I had. after that communicating with people became a lot easier. felt energy throughout my body for a couple days after the breathing. I also felt like my consciousness increased, i became more aware of my thoughts and emotions.

second time I also mainly shouted from the solar plexus and my body shook a lot, first time in my life that i felt or became conscious of energy, specifically in the back of my head. after the breathing stopped and the relaxation period came to be, the magic happened. I still felt that energy in the head and then it I used my consciousness to spread throughout the whole body, I felt extreme bliss I didnt feel since I was a kid, it faded after a few minutes. in the next week I had annoying energy in my body, didnt know what to do with it, I went to the woods and shouted, didnt help. It subsided after I did a meditation called chakra dancing, it's where you also do holotropic breathing but while standing up, and you focus on your chakras in orderly fashion from bottom to top. basically move energy up your spine 3 times over for about 40 minutes overall.

That stuff basically introduced me to the possibilities of energy work, which are bliss, high consciousness and a lot more.

recently I had an LSD trip where more of my chakras opened and I feel extreme, but really extreme sexual energy and love. I feel like the breathing contributed. gonna post a trip report soon.

[Viking]

1 minute ago, MM1988 said:

How safe is this? im afraid to try it. It is basically depriving the brain of oxygen and could in theory cause heart attacks or seizures, right?

I also had (and still kinda have) that thought. There's not much research about it sadly, so you cant say for sure, but if you do it properly most probably nothing will happen, a lot of people have done it and I dont know of a situation where someone got hurt. energy work I feel is generally scary, see all the kundalini stories and such.

psychedelics also can fuck you up, but people still do them.

I feel like there's no safety guarantee for anything, but when you think about it people in the materialist paradigm also always take risks like getting kids, building businesses, choosing careers, that's a part of life. dont forget you're going to die anyway one day.

[blazed]

Firstly, thanks @Leo Gura for bringing this technique into my awareness, I’ve done Wim Hoff breathing techniques in the past which made me high but I didn’t know much about these long duration shamanic breathing techniques.

My trip report:

Tried it now for 45 minutes.

I entered a state of flow, so time flew by fast.

Tip 1: keep focusing on the breathing technique, if you don’t you will probably slow down your breathing and your trip will start to calm down or stabilize.

Effects I felt:

• Lost sense of some limbs (similar to dead arm)
• Tingling
• Fingers curling up without my consent
• Time slowed down, felt like bullet time in the matrix
• Shutdown of logical mind and thinking
• Pressure and tingling in head

Entered blissfulness / no mind / non-existent state

As always even in my meditations I entered nothingness, I can’t describe it because at that point there is no ego, or no questions, just being, this is what I am fundamentally before body and perceptions take place.

I feel like the people who see things or get “insights” is actually just using bits of the mind and ego to come up with stuff because they are seeking insight. I never get anything because I’m not even sure what I’m seeking besides nothingness.

After 45 minutes I stopped and timed myself.

I spent about 35 minutes before I neutralized, 15 minute in deep meditation (no mindedness) and 20 minutes’ nap lol.

Tip 2: After you’re done maybe sit upright so you don’t fall asleep whilst tripping.

Negative Side effects:

• Nausea (Leo didn’t mention this; but I recommend leaving a big gap after a meal)
• Dizziness and head pressure.
• Headaches
• Shivering (might be the room tempature, my hands and feet were cold)
• Drowsiness
• Lost of ability to control the body naturally

Lingering side effects up to an hour after finishing:

• Headache
• Nausea

Tip 3: Tribal drumming music can be cool n all that but I recommend something else, listening to drumming for 45+ minutes contributed to my headache even though it wasn’t loud.

My question to @Leo Gura and experienced breathers:

Is this technique dangerous? Can you actually kill yourself using this technique as a normal healthy individual? Or would you faint/fall unconscious before anything dangerous can happen?

My ego kept reminding me how I want to be alive after this and not disappear forever.

[Shroomdoctor]

5 minutes ago, blazed said:

My ego kept reminding me how I want to be alive after this and not disappear forever.

+1

Also...I can hardly do it for 5 minutes, then this kind of breathing just becomes...really hard to do? Is this normal?

[blazed]

1 minute ago, Shroomdoctor said:

+1

Also...I can hardly do it for 5 minutes, then this kind of breathing just becomes...really hard to do? Is this normal?

I think the start is the hardest, once you get rhythm going and leave it on autopilot (but still focused, not to fall asleep) it becomes easy, I was suprised how fast 45 minutes went.

Also it might depend on how good you're at sitting and doing nothing, I've been meditating for over 2 years doing 20-60 minutes for most of my days, so i can enter flow or no mindedness quite easily, when i first started meditating it was literally 20 minutes of mental ranting, it was after a year of purging all those it got better.

[blazed]

8 minutes ago, see_on_see said:

This technique seems cool, but frankly seeing people calling it "trip" and having psychedelics-like effect is kinda cringy, especially for the people who have never tried psychedelics. Not sure why Leo used these terms while describing it. I mean granted you can get to some deep states, but psychedelics and actual trips are on a totally different dimension, it's actually disrespectful towards psychedelics.

That's quite a petty problem you have there, that you had to post about it.

To be fair talking about the effects is pretty similar to when people talk about the effects that drugs had on them.

Consider "tripping" to be the short cut to "whilst using the shamanic breathing technique" for this thread.

[LetTheNewDayBegin]

Have you guys heard about Hypocapnia? From wikipedia:

a state of reduced carbon dioxide in the blood. Hypocapnia usually results from deep or rapid breathing

(...)

this can cause transient dizziness, visual disturbances, and anxiety. A low partial pressure of carbon dioxide in the blood also causes alkalosis (because CO2 is acidic in solution), leading to lowered plasma calcium ions and increased nerve and muscle excitability. This explains the other common symptoms of hyperventilation —pins and needles, muscle cramps and tetany in the extremities, especially hands and feet.

[PsiloPutty]

@blazed   Great post. It reminded me that I was very nauseated during the first 10 minutes. Retched a few times and would have vomited if I'd retched a couple more times, but I got myself calmed and went on. Having a puke bucket closeby would not be overkill for this exercise. I know I will next time.

[PsiloPutty]

52 minutes ago, see_on_see said:

This technique seems cool, but frankly seeing people calling it "trip" and having psychedelics-like effect is kinda cringy, especially for the people who have never tried psychedelics. Not sure why Leo used these terms while describing it. I mean granted you can get to some deep states, but psychedelics and actual trips are on a totally different dimension, it's actually disrespectful towards psychedelics.

I think he and I and many others have used that term because it's very apt, at least when I compare it to how my mushroom trips go. It's not exactly the same, but if someone wanted to know what psychedelics were like, without actually taking anything, this exercise would have given me a VERY reasonable glimpse of what the mushroom realm is like. Your mileage may vary.   

[Samra]

I just did my first try. I think I passed out (lost consciousness) around 20 minutes mark, in a pleasant way. All my senses, including my hearing started fading. I panicked tiny bit at first, but very soon relaxed into it. After couple of minutes, my senses started coming back. I felt a lot of vibration all over my body, especially my right elbow, which has RSI. Maybe It was healing my elbow! Now I have a bit of a ringing in my ears. But I feel alright.

[Sukhpaal]

Mind blown. I did it for 15 minutes, I started losing sensation in my arms and legs and felt a tingling sensation in my forehead. I had an outburst of crying and I just cried but mindfully for around 10 minutes. I felt so much trauma that I've caused to myself and others rise up to the surface. I saw the importance of love better. I realized love is the way. Love is very important, not the neurotic kind but of course unconditional love to everyone. I also saw a better insight of all the manipulations and dirty deeds I do on the daily basis. I saw how I manipulated my ex girlfriend for my needs and how I basically emotionally tormented her. But, that's not to say I need to punish myself, the only way to get better is to do the inner work. I feel more of the need to just die as an ego because when you live a lie, you pay the price. I recommend holotrophic breathing. 10/10.