The Dark Side of Leo Gura

[Privet]

17 minutes ago, MrDmitriiV said:

1. There are findings in neuroscience that the brains of Heroin addicts are different.

So should we do heroin because they are "different"?

The question is: what is the subjective effect of that objective difference?

All heroin addicts report they're fucked.

What do yoga practitioners report?

You try to proof you're right instead of getting to the truth.

No one makes you practice anything. No one makes you blindly believe in the power of Kriya.

What is the point of your blind assumptions and guestimations about Kriya? Go diligently try Kriya and then tell that it works or not, otherwise you're just bullshitting and this thread is nonsence.

[MrDmitriiV]

@Privet Why should I try Kriya Yoga instead of hundreds of other practices and different yogas?

Just because Leo said? You blindly follow his opinion.

i tried Kriya Yoga with a very open mind at first. In fact I was excited about it and didn't question it. 

But after doing it over a week, I realized that what you are doing with it is using imagination for those chakras. 

The path to awakening isn't picking a guru like Leo and blindly accepting his opinion and then defending it (are you people stage blue???), it isn't picking a random practice and investing your precious time just because someone said so.

Reread my post, it seems like you closed your eyes on its message.

[GreenDragon]

@MrDmitriiV All these explanations and definitions don't mean much really. They are not strict scientific-like proofs and are not much more valid than what you can see in this scene:

You can't get around believing here.

Experience is what counts, there is no better proof than experience. If people succeeded with it (and they did), then it works. And judging by what people say about Kriya, it's quite potent.

And if you want a logical explanation, here it is: after each Kriya routine you are supposed to just sit and concentrate / do nothing. The practices quiet the mind really well (much better than meditation for me, you don't need a year to feel it) and make the following meditation much more productive.

Another possibility for awakening is mastering the breathless state. If you hold you breath, you thought process also stops. The breathless state enables you not to breathe effortlessly for like 2 minutes (if I'm not mistaken), thus highly increasing the probability of awakening.

[MrDmitriiV]

@GreenDragon What explanations? There are no valid explanations regarding Kriya Yoga apart from your post, the other ones are just blindly defending Leo's opinion. Except the user @FakeEnlightenment

Experience? I did it other a week, after that I realized that the exercises make you use your imagination. 

It may work despite ironically using a mind-filter (imagination). 

Theres no general consensus with this practice. The marketing mass of this practice just ask people to use their imagination, they don't explain why and how it works. They just tell that "somehow" it works.

It doesn't mean Kriya won't work, it just means that there's something fundamentally wrong in the way it is being presented.

Your explanations make sense though! Thanks! (And why others don't explain it like you did?)

 

 

 

[Prabhaker]

31 minutes ago, MrDmitriiV said:

Just because Leo said?

Patanjali is the greatest name as far as the world of Yoga is concerned. He recommends Kriya-Yoga in chapter 2 of Patanjali's yoga sutras.

tapah svadhyay-eshvarapranidhanani kriya-yogah ||1||

तपः स्वाध्यायेश्वरप्रणिधानानि क्रियायोगः ॥१॥

Verse 1. KRIYA-YOGA IS A PRACTICAL, PRELIMINARY YOGA, AND IT IS
COMPOSED OF AUSTERITY, SELF-STUDY AND SURRENDER TO GOD.

Verse 2. THE PRACTICE OF KRIYA-YOGA REDUCES MISERY, AND LEADS
TOWARDS SAMADHI.

[Privet]

33 minutes ago, MrDmitriiV said:

Why should I try Kriya Yoga instead of hundreds of other practices and different yogas?

You shouldn't. Practice whatever you like.

34 minutes ago, MrDmitriiV said:

You blindly follow his opinion.

Whooops! Mud contest gone bad! I didn't say Kriya works or not, or that I prefer it.

35 minutes ago, MrDmitriiV said:

what you are doing with it is using imagination for those chakras

So what?

---------------------------------------------

I'm getting outta here! Sorry for not blindly following your opinion.

[MM1988]

@MrDmitriiV nobody said you should go for Kriya Yoga and its the only way. Its also not something that replaces your meditation or self inquiry. Its just an additional technique, try it out and see for yourself or just ignore it. Leo just picked Kriya and tells us what his experiences were, so most people here will probably look into it too. Some might choose another school of yoga or dont start with it at all. Whats the big problem here really?

All of Yoga and Meditation basically boils down to quieting the mind. Either it does that for you or it doesnt.

Edited August 10, 2018 by MM1988

[Nahm]

@MrDmitriiV

See what it’s like to apply bigger picture & longer term thinking, and consider imagination could be more subtle, and more powerful than logic. 

Also, consider doing anything creative, if you’re interested in realizing you are The Creator.

[Forestluv]

8 hours ago, MrDmitriiV said:

@PrivetBut after doing it over a week, I realized that what you are doing with it is using imagination for those chakras. 

A week? Did you spend time learning the Kriya techniques that come prior to the chakra work? Or did you rush into the chakras? 

I’m two weeks into daily Kriya and still practicing the first few lessons as described in the book (that come before chakra). There is a lot of breathing and concentration practice prior to the chakra work. 

[Shanmugam]

11 hours ago, Natasha said:

@MrDmitriiV Everyone's path is different. Lots of people get awakened even without meditating much, practicing yoga, knowing about chakras, taking psychedelics, etc. Use other's teachings as suggestions, not requirements. I personally had the shift while self-inquiring guided by Leo in his Creating an Experience of No-self video and never had to do/try anything else after that. 

Are you still on this forum?  .. It has been very long since I saw your posts..

[FakeEnlightenment]

5 hours ago, see_on_see said:

About chakras: again, you believe you have internal organs because someone told you so, and you're blindly believing them because you haven't directly seen any of your organs any more than you've seen your chakras. 

You assume that it couldn't possibly be true that visualizing chakras could "make them work". But that's just an assumption. It could be that the imagination does much more than you think. For example, ever noticed that what you imagine can affect your body and emotions, even if what you are imagining isn't "actually out there"? The object of the imagination isn't "real", yet the emotions are. Visualization techniques are based on this and that's what makes them work. Chakras and visualizing chakras could work in the same way. 

This is the problem with using this kind of logic just because you heard it from Leo and following it blindly like a sheep. Just because you haven't SEEN something in person for yourself doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Does Australia not exist because you have personally never been there? But there is pictures of Australia and documentation about it from people who've lived there for hundreds of years. Same with your organs. You can feel your heartbeat, and when you cut someone open you can see their organs. 

Comparing the existence of organs and Chakras are completely different, because there is no evidence that Chakras exist as energy fields, and as you concede in your second paragraph, the only thing that makes them real to you is the continuous imagination that they are real. Well isn't that surprising! Look up the confirmation bias in psychology. If you continue to imagine something, day after day, it has an effect on your belief in that something. Think about it like affirmations, if you say your confident over and over, you will eventually start to feel more confident. Does it mean you're actually a confident person just by making yourself feel like you are? Probably not, but it will help you. This is the way I see Chakras, it's all basically made up in your mind but they do have real emotional effects on us because that's the power of the placebo effect. So does that make Chakras REAL because imagining in them has real effects on our body and mind? No! They are more so ideas you create, but if they help people, I don't see anything wrong with them.

 

Edited August 10, 2018 by FakeEnlightenment

[the dream]

@MrDmitriiV

I appreciate the warning, but this forum is a blind-faith-free-zone.

 

As for the chakras, I didn't believe it either at first. This was something that was slowly revealed to me through a couple years of yoga practice.

Ultimately I think if you're not into Kriyas then find something else. A lengthy theoretical debate such as this is a waste of time.

[Mafortu]

Gentlemen, please!

What we need here is for Leo to make a video on chakras and Kriya Yoga. I for one am skeptic too but I wish to know more.

[SoonHei]

lol whenever i see this thread bumped to the top (ironic, i know) i just cant help but wonder what leo thinks seeing this thread lol

 

The Dark Side of Leo

 

like these other people are discussing a supposed dark side of mine

 

yolo

[FakeEnlightenment]

1 hour ago, see_on_see said:

The problem as always, is that because the thing you're trying to debunk doesn't fit the paradigm, then you don't even try it, and there you have your confirmation bias, but the actually dangerous kind of confirmation bias, because you closed your minds off to the actual practice with no possibility of ever considering it could work. 

@see_on_see

You'd be surprised to find out that I'm actually a deep, solid Turquoise on the spiral, and have been transitioning into Coral for quite some time, working as a Yogi / Mystic instructor for an extremely nuanced version of Kriya yoga I devised myself. I'm not trying to debunk anything, just trying to clarify what reality is and what we can agree on, because we obviously have different paradigms or world views. In all my years of practice, I've never felt energy fields around my body that people label as Chakras, nor have any of my clients, which are among the elite Buddhism monks.

 

[Forestluv]

16 minutes ago, FakeEnlightenment said:

@see_on_see

You'd be surprised to find out that I'm actually a deep, solid Turquoise on the spiral, and have been transitioning into Coral for quite some time, working as a Yogi / Mystic instructor for an extremely nuanced version of Kriya yoga I devised myself. I'm not trying to debunk anything, just trying to clarify what reality is and what we can agree on, because we obviously have different paradigms or world views. In all my years of practice, I've never felt energy fields around my body that people label as Chakras, nor have any of my clients, which are among the elite Buddhism monks.

 

Beginner mind, Zen mind

[Natasha]

7 hours ago, Shanmugam said:

Are you still on this forum?  .. It has been very long since I saw your posts..

You missed me? 

 

 

[SgtPepper]

19 hours ago, MrDmitriiV said:

@Malelekakis I did read a book recommended by Leo and done a few practices.

The practices asked me to use imagination to imagine chakras and imagine moving them. WHICH I DID. But I couldn't help but notice that the feeling I got was a result of imagination not chakras.

How do you know your imagination does not have sort some of influence on your bodies chemistry in the physical world? How do you know there is not another side to physical reality that can be directly influenced via imagination? 

Look, I have not tried Kriya yoga myself nor do I practice techniques related to chakras, but you gotta open-minded to these various ideas, thats all. Leo is not asking you to blindly believe him, he is sharing what practices are helping him grow, and what I do believe is that Leo is a person who is being honest about his experience. If the practice does not work for you then just practice regular meditation.

I personally have loads of psychedelic experiences and have recognized there is a lot more to reality than just what is being physically seen. The physical world is just ONE side to the human experience. 

I can see that you would like scientific proof, but there simply isn't (yet) because the funding nor the motivation is there, but that does not invalidate the technique nor the experience of people who practice the technique. Your simply going to have to try it out yourself and see whether imaging chakras creates some sort of difference in how you organize your emotions. 

There are some models and theories that we hold emotions and energies in our body ---> look at Wilhelm Reich's work on bio-energetics. 

 

Edited August 10, 2018 by SgtPepper

[Shanmugam]

52 minutes ago, Natasha said:

You missed me? 

 

 

oh yes..  

[stevegan928]

I imagine things all the time without believing in them. 

I guess that's another thing to add to my gratitude journal. 

Quote

Dear Diary, today I found out I'm actually fortunate to have the ability to imagine things without believing in them, it turns out some people start worshiping red orbs of light in their chest if you so much as ask them to simply imagine such a thing. I guess I have a superpower, I am so grateful for this.