Developing the "REAL" doing nothing technique

[peanutspathtotruth]

It's quickly getting to the point of mental masturbation. I found "True Meditation" by Adya the best read on this topic which clarified a lot. "No Mind No Problem" from Ramaji is also interesting. But everything else one has to find out for oneself, there is no point in arguing about this too much. Basically leaving experience alone creates space for understanding. Without inquiring into the nature of experience and the experiencer, there won't be understanding though. That's why I find both are super important. The rest everyone has to find out for himself. Moreover, I also think this is a full time job (which does not mean formal sits don't have their place in this) 

[robdl]

3 hours ago, Jack River said:

Your not seeing the big picture dude. Until all you are psychologically secure you will keep searching. This will prevent because you are looking in time for your arriving. Thought is pursing a reward in the future. That is the problem. 

Quite so.  Thought is incredibly cunning, sneaky, and self-deceptive --- and will use even notions of time/enlightenment/meditative techniques to sustain and strengthen its movement.

 

[robdl]

19 minutes ago, peanutspathtotruth said:

I found "True Meditation" by Adya the best read on this topic which clarified a lot. "No Mind No Problem" from Ramaji is also interestingBut everything else one has to find out for oneself, there is no point in arguing about this too much.

Indeed.  Citing videos, Leo, traditions, spiritual masters, etc., is only at the conceptual understanding level, which means it's only at the level of ego mind: thought-self seeking security in conceptual/spiritual knowledge/belief to sustain its own movement.

There must be direct, whole insight into all of this.  And the insight is completely beyond concept/intellect.  There is no external spiritual authority for it.

Edited August 16, 2018 by robdl

[robdl]

The direct insight can never be communicated to anyone.  It has to be seen for oneself.

But what can be communicated to others? The nature of thought, its tricks, and its traps.  So I like to start there -- sharing what has been directly observed.

We can't really talk about enlightenment, but we can communicate thought's seeking quality for objects, which includes the object of enlightenment

Edited August 16, 2018 by robdl

[Faceless]

4 hours ago, Jack River said:

Having a reward in mind like enlightenment and using a technique called do noting to get there seems pretty crazy to me. And I am a kinda crazy and a dummy. I have friends who meditate before a surf comp. but they meditate to concentrate or focus. Visualize and conquer a goal. 

Quite so. You have really caught on to this my friend??

36 minutes ago, robdl said:

But what can be communicated to others? The nature of thought, its tricks, and its traps.  So I like to start there -- sharing what has been directly observed.

We can't really talk about enlightenment, but we can communicate thought's seeking quality for objects, which includes the object of enlightenment

 

To talk about that which is immeasurable from the standpoint of measure is futile indeed. 

Edited August 16, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

As long as there is a progressive movement of measure,(thought-self) being sustained and cultivated, that will be the very limitation in ending this limit that measure has established and seeks to escape. Only measure moves within the limitation of time. Measure can never exceed its own limit by utilizing the very limitation that feeds the very movement of measure. An example of the Self feeding loop⭕️ in action, which is always fragmented and incomplete. 

 

An example of measure put very simply; a psychological A to B type of pursuit....to move from this to that, here to there, I have have been this, i must be that, (psychological becoming or time). These are all psychological movements of the self, or (divisive action), seeking psychological security in its own movement. Contradiction nourishing confusion-conflict-fear, and further seeking psychological security because of that. 

 

Can there be a whole insight into this movement of measure?? 

 

And can we see all the subtle forms of psychological measure in action in our daily lives?

Edited August 16, 2018 by Faceless

[robdl]

An ego mind is quick to seek enlightenment and use any tools/methods/knowledge at its disposal to reach such a goal, but what is the meaning of this endeavour if the nature of seeking, methods, and goals are not understood at all?  

To not understand that the seeker, the seeking action itself, the method/knowledge employed, and the goal are all one and the same movement of thought as a self-feeding loop?  

Is this to be understood at the end of a "process" over "time", 20 years down the road? Or can this be understood now or at any time?

The mind loves time, procrastination, projecting a goal ahead, progress, graduality ---- as these all allow mind to self-sustain. 

Mind has no need, use for the Now -- and in fact, is always in escape/seek mode from it.  Movement away from what is.

Edited August 16, 2018 by robdl

[Faceless]

10 minutes ago, robdl said:

Is this to be understood at the end of a "process" over "time", 20 years down the road? Or can this be understood now or at any time?

Great question...I would say 20 years if ever.

The more we perpetuate this movement of seeking(time), the more we depend on, and remain attached to its (illusions-self deception), that manifest by that very movement of cultivating the self(psychological becoming). 

The more we feed the illusion, the more we seek security in it. 

Edited August 16, 2018 by Faceless

[robdl]

1 minute ago, Faceless said:

 

The more we perpetuate this movement of seeking(time),

The subtlety of this may be missed, and it's important.   Thought's seeking action is time.  Seeking and psychological time are one; both thought's movement from what-is.  Different names/concepts for the same thing.

[Faceless]

4 minutes ago, robdl said:

The subtlety of this may be missed, and it's important.   Thought's seeking action is time.  Seeking and psychological time are one; both thought's movement from what-is.  Different names/concepts for the same thing.

Yes. All explaining one movement. 

[Faceless]

28 minutes ago, Faceless said:

Yes. All explaining one movement. 

Can there be a choiceless attention to this movement of time,(psychological becoming), in daily living. 

Edited August 16, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

4 minutes ago, Feel Good said:

Is this what krishnamurti means by 'observing without a motive'? 

'Observation free of the past' 

?

 

Indeed??

Observation without (positive & negative movement of the self) ‘TIME’. 

Edited August 16, 2018 by Faceless

[robdl]

1 minute ago, Feel Good said:

Is this what krishnamurti means by 'observing without a motive'? 

'Observation free of the past' 

?

 

Krishnamurti also called it "observation without the 'observer." 

The "observer" being just what you referenced -- the past, motive, conditioned experience/memory/knowledge

[Faceless]

9 minutes ago, robdl said:

The "observer" being just what you referenced -- the past, motive, conditioned experience/memory/knowledge

All the movement of time. 

[Jack River]

@Faceless thanks man. I have really Given all my attention to this. My friends say they really see a difference in me. I’m am really appreciating life now man. Conflict is so low now dude. 

[Jack River]

@Feel Good I agree man. 

I am very grateful for these guys. I went into this to live without all the drama. So far it’s been quick and effective. Just watching fear in movement and knowing when I am adding to it really has helped. 

[Jack River]

4 hours ago, robdl said:

Quite so.  Thought is incredibly cunning, sneaky, and self-deceptive --- and will use even notions of time/enlightenment/meditative techniques to sustain and strengthen its movement.

 

For sure man. It’s constantly doing this. Even when we least expect it. 

[Faceless]

2 hours ago, Feel Good said:

I feel a lot better, more energy, more 'integrated'. 

Energy is extraordinary when time ceases to feed on itself. 

Tremendous energy indeed. 

[Faceless]

1 hour ago, Jack River said:

@Faceless thanks man. I have really Given all my attention to this. My friends say they really see a difference in me. I’m am really appreciating life now man. Conflict is so low now dude. 

 Great way to live, friend??

 

[Privet]

15 hours ago, tsuki said:

The funniest thing is that I intended the same thing for you with my response.
My answer was not conceptual.

Oops. I overlooked that, I'm sorry.

15 hours ago, tsuki said:

Perhaps I should listen to your questions as a student then, so that we can understand each other.

That'd be very weird, lol.