Mystical experiences vs radical recontextualizations

[Zweistein]

On 7.8.2018 at 10:40 PM, Zweistein said:

@now is forever

Do you=I=we "realize" how big this project could get? ?

My intuition says: to go from one spiral dynamics stage to the next, one might have to go through one hero's and/or heroine's journey cycle. Could that be true? "I" feel like "I" have gone through the latter many times.

 

After a bit more contemplation, I would say that I have gone through one big cycle of Maureen Murdock's heroine's journey, but through several hero's journey cycles and each time I finished one of those it implied going one stage up in the Spiral Dynamics model. 

(I know to many people this post will sound completely arrogant )
But to those of you, who don't think it's arrogant - what do you think? Was it similar in your journey?

[tsuki]

1 hour ago, Zweistein said:

But to those of you, who don't think it's arrogant - what do you think? Was it similar in your journey?

@Zweistein Not arrogant at all.
I have an intuition that Spiral Dynamics is the hero's journey in disguise if zoomed (and vice versa).
Are we willing to explore it?

Edited August 9, 2018 by tsuki

[Zweistein]

1 hour ago, tsuki said:

@Zweistein Not arrogant at all.
I have an intuition that Spiral Dynamics is the hero's journey in disguise if zoomed (and vice versa).
Are we willing to explore it?

Of course :-)  I'm already contemplating & plotting ;-)
I feel like I have gone through several hero's cycles (as defined by Joseph Campbell), but only one heroine cycle (as Maureen Murdock defines it). It would also be interesting to know what you think about her heroine's cycle and if you have gone through something like that as well 

[tsuki]

@Zweistein How about that?

1. Beige - The unknown as unity
2. Purple - Split of the unknown into the 'self' and the 'other'.
3. Red - Recognition of meaning that separates 'the self' and 'the other'
4. Blue - Recognition of possibility of common meaning and co-existence for the sake of it
5. Orange - Unity of 'the self' and 'the other' under creation of independent meaning
6. Green - Total unity through recognition of creation as meaning.

Next tiers undergo the same steps, but with respect to various kinds of meaning.

EDIT: Nope, I don't like the creation part. It should be more ambiguous like 'action' or 'movement'.

Edited August 10, 2018 by tsuki

[Zweistein]

10 hours ago, tsuki said:

@Zweistein How about that?

1. Beige - The unknown as unity
2. Purple - Split of the unknown into the 'self' and the 'other'.
3. Red - Recognition of meaning that separates 'the self' and 'the other'
4. Blue - Recognition of possibility of common meaning and co-existence for the sake of it
5. Orange - Unity of 'the self' and 'the other' under creation of independent meaning
6. Green - Total unity through recognition of creation as meaning.

Next tiers undergo the same steps, but with respect to various kinds of meaning.

EDIT: Nope, I don't like the creation part. It should be more ambiguous like 'action' or 'movement'.

Uhhh, this looks really interesting, @tsuki! I guess it goes along a bit with personal vs. collective ego as well ("the pendulum swinging").
 

[now is forever]

On 10.8.2018 at 0:51 PM, tsuki said:

EDIT: Nope, I don't like the creation part. It should be more ambiguous like 'action' or 'movement'.

mhhh in what is creation different than action and movement? if it‘s a process? it‘s all about theory aligned with doing and embodiment, isn‘t it. 

how to get there is another theory though.

Edited August 13, 2018 by now is forever

[tsuki]

7 hours ago, now is forever said:

mhhh in what is creation different than action and movement? if it‘s a process? 

@now is forever I didn't like that word because to me it is conflated with meaning of 'introducing something that was not there'.
It should be more - like you say - in lines of process/action/movement, etc.

8 hours ago, now is forever said:

it‘s all about theorie aligned with doing and embodiment, isn‘t it. 

how to get there is another theory thoug.

Well, if we assume that yellow is the one that is able to observe this theory in practice, then this very theory can be used as well.
Yellow can see all the stages below, but also understands that in tier two, he is like Beige with respect to some other dimension of oneness.
Raising consciousness to see the difference between 'self' and 'other' puts him to Turquoise, but this differentiation is much more nuanced than the transition from Beige to Purple.

The basic 'skeleton' of steps is the same. This is the power of ambiguity.
Perhaps, this is how prophecies work lol.

[now is forever]

yes, so basically speaking it’s a strangeloop between theory building and embodiment. the line between the lines = the mirror between the lines (open or not) and the actual construction, that makes us step from one into the other colour or tier.

think green is mostly still stuck in embodiment of creation, then.

embodiment is through action and movement. what leads to process and process leads to theory building.

Edited August 13, 2018 by now is forever